A little experiment . . .

[T25UFO]

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Two photos, taken with a different lens.  Not looking for a critique on my style of portraiture, just curious if forum members can see much difference and which they prefer.  Reason for the experiment is that I'm trying to decide which lens I prefer for this type of photo.  

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The model is my long suffering wife and both photos taken on our 50th wedding anniversary; well I did say long suffering . . .

 

[250swb]

I think the lens that is making her smile is the best one.

[LocalHero1953]

And that's the truth. The best portrait is much more down to the ability of the photographer and how they interact with the subject than the lens capabilities. The latter are relevant, but first decide which lens has the right aperture and FL, is easier to use, and allows you to forget it's there, and so letting you concentrate on real world portraiture.

[maxfairclough]

I'll offer a serious answer. 

The second one. Seems contrastier and more to my liking.

Although not sure how much can be said seeing as the lighting/brightness of the scene has changed as well as her outfit. Would have been a better comparison to have them photographed at the same time.

[elgenper]

The first image has more "three-dimensionality"; the second looks much flatter.  Possibly the focal lengths differ (with the second one longer), but even lenses with identical view angles differ a lot in my experience.  Personally, I would prefer to work with the first one for portraits.

[LocalHero1953]

My answer was intended to be serious! I can't see a difference between the IQ of these images at this resolution on the forum. Most people looking at a portrait will be far more likely to respond to the person, their expression, the lighting and the composition, than the minute differences in IQ on display here. I want a portait lens that balances well on the camera, is fast to AF, or has a focus ring with the right resistance and gearing (those two things are vital in a M lens) that falls naturally to hand, ditto with the aperture ring.

[250swb]

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1 hour ago, maxfairclough said:

I'll offer a serious answer. 

The second one. Seems contrastier and more to my liking

Last time I looked the contrast slider was still included in Lightroom. 

And surely that is the point, the magic is supposed to come from tiny and pointless differences between two lenses where having an opinion and acting on it when post processing does an even better creative job. 

[T25UFO]

1 hour ago, maxfairclough said:

I'll offer a serious answer. 

The second one. Seems contrastier and more to my liking.

Although not sure how much can be said seeing as the lighting/brightness of the scene has changed as well as her outfit. Would have been a better comparison to have them photographed at the same time.

Thank you maxfairclough, this is exactly the sort of feedback I was looking for.  More comment below!

49 minutes ago, elgenper said:

The first image has more "three-dimensionality"; the second looks much flatter.  Possibly the focal lengths differ (with the second one longer), but even lenses with identical view angles differ a lot in my experience.  Personally, I would prefer to work with the first one for portraits.

Thank you also elgenper, even though you have a different view, this is all good feedback.

I said the two photos were taken with different lenses, but didn't mention they were taken with different cameras (!) and this was the reason for the experiment.  And so, the reveal . . .

The first photo was taken with M10-D and 90mm APO lens, what many would consider the ideal portrait lens.  Exposure was 1/125th at f4.  The second photo was taken at the same camera to subject distance with a 28mm lens on the Q2 (sorry elgenper, it's not the longer lens!).  I then cropped to achieve roughly the same perspective as the 90mm and this time the exposure was 1/125th at f1.7.

The objective was to see to see if I could produce a reasonable head and shoulders portrait from a fixed 28mm lens, that had a similar look to using what is generally accepted as the ideal portrait focal length of 90mm.  Some people have commented that the crop feature of the Q2 is a gimmick; perhaps time for a rethink.  Perhaps I should have posted in the Q forum, but that would have spoilt the reveal . . .

[ianman]

Can't see much difference. Top one for me, it seems to have a pleasant softness.

[pippy]

I agree 100% with what elginper said in his first sentence above (pasted again here so no-one needs to go back);

"The first image has more 'three-dimensionality'; the second looks much flatter..."

Just look at the tops of the shoulders.

Philip.

Edited February 13, 2020 by pippy

[T25UFO]

Just now, pippy said:

I agree 100% with what elginper said in his first sentence above (pasted again here so no-one needs to go back);

"The first image has more 'three-dimensionality'; the second looks much flatter..."

Philip.

I totally agree, but I suppose the point of the exercise is that you can produce a reasonable (conventional) portrait if you just have the Q2 in your bag at the time.

By the way, still waiting for the next batch of M10M to arrive at Red Dot, then I can post comparisons with the M9M.  Hope you are continuing to enjoy your M9M.

[pippy]

12 minutes ago, T25UFO said:

...I suppose the point of the exercise is that you can produce a reasonable (conventional) portrait if you just have the Q2 in your bag at the time.

By the way, still waiting for the next batch of M10M to arrive at Red Dot, then I can post comparisons with the M9M.  Hope you are continuing to enjoy your M9M.

In which case I think you have done a good enough job to show that it IS perfectly possible.

Best wishes for when Ivor eventually gives you the call and thanks for the kind thought about the M9M. 'Very Much So' is the answer! So much so that my M-D 262 is getting VERY jealous...

Philip.

Edited February 13, 2020 by pippy

[sblutter]

Her expression in the 2nd shot feels corporate or law enforcement

The 1st is quite pleasing!

[T25UFO]

1 minute ago, sblutter said:

Her expression in the 2nd shot feels corporate or law enforcement

The 1st is quite pleasing!

My wife is very good at law enforcement - I've learnt after 50 years to never argue!

[sblutter]

1 minute ago, T25UFO said:

My wife is very good at law enforcement - I've learnt after 50 years to never argue!

Rule #1 for a happy, calm marriage:  No matter the subject, the lady is always right

[Jeff S]

45 minutes ago, T25UFO said:

 I then cropped to achieve roughly the same perspective as the 90mm and this time the exposure was 1/125th at f1.7.

 

One crops for field of view, not perspective, which only changes if you move closer to or farther from the subject (thereby changing the relationship between near and far objects). A 90mm lens is always a 90mm lens; a 28 is a 28.  Perspective is the same for both at the same camera/subject location.

Jeff

[pgk]

15 minutes ago, Jeff S said:

One crops for field of view, not perspective, which only changes if you move closer to or farther from the subject (thereby changing the relationship between near and far objects). A 90mm lens is always a 90mm lens; a 28 is a 28.  Perspective is the same for both at the same camera/subject location.

The 'problem' here is not the camera comparison nor the fact that one shot is cropped, but that posting jpegs on the forum simply doesn't create an image comparison sufficient to allow for any valid differentiation I'm afraid. Both images look fine and if the object was to illustrate that a crop from the Q2 is still perfectly acceptable on the web relative to the uncrossed image from the M10 then it does just that.

[elgenper]

1 hour ago, T25UFO said:

...Thank you also elgenper, even though you have a different view, this is all good feedback.

I said the two photos were taken with different lenses, but didn't mention they were taken with different cameras (!) and this was the reason for the experiment.  And so, the reveal . . .

The first photo was taken with M10-D and 90mm APO lens, what many would consider the ideal portrait lens.  Exposure was 1/125th at f4.  The second photo was taken at the same camera to subject distance with a 28mm lens on the Q2 (sorry elgenper, it's not the longer lens!).  I then cropped to achieve roughly the same perspective as the 90mm and this time the exposure was 1/125th at f1.7....

OK, instead of "focal length", I should have been more careful and said "field of view", or "angle of view".  And, if you crop a 28 view to that of a 90, you do have the same field of view (but not the same depth of field, of course).  But I´ll admit that the difference in plasticity is probably a result of the difference between using the whole full format sensor vs cropping a similar one to about 31 % of its size linearly (10% area-wise!).

So, I´d still prefer the first combination for portrait use, but it seems the reasons for that are different from what I assumed...😉

Edit: Both Jeff and pgk posted while I was busy writing, making similar observations.  And, I whole-heartedly agree with pgk that your experiment shows the potential of the Q2.

Edited February 13, 2020 by elgenper

[Jeff S]

6 minutes ago, pgk said:

The 'problem' here is not the camera comparison nor the fact that one shot is cropped, but that posting jpegs on the forum simply doesn't create an image comparison sufficient to allow for any valid differentiation I'm afraid. Both images look fine and if the object was to illustrate that a crop from the Q2 is still perfectly acceptable on the web relative to the uncrossed image from the M10 then it does just that.

Plenty of comments already addressed that issue.  I was responding directly to a follow up comment by the OP.

Jeff

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[T25UFO]

2 hours ago, sblutter said:

Rule #1 for a happy, calm marriage:  No matter the subject, the lady is always right

Reminds me of the following:

If a tree falls in the forest and nobody sees it, did it really happen?

If I speak my mind and my wife doesn't hear me, am I still wrong?

Thanks for all the comments.  Apologies for using the wrong terminology (cropping for perspective).  It was just a fun experiment to see if the Q2 could match something close to the M10 with a 90mm.  I think the answer is a qualified yes, which shows how remarkable this little fixed lens camera is.

Thanks again for looking and commenting 🙂