Auction Find

[willeica]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

I agree with Augusto about the estate sale theory. If this were a 'tarted up' model there would have been many other places where it could have been sold for much more money. To my eye (not as good as Jerzy's) everything about the interior fits with the camera type and period. Some examples from that era have the 'film instruction plate' on the camera rather than on the bottom plate, but that would not bother me too much. The number written inside the camera looks to my poor eyesight like E 22 5 49, which may have been a date put on by a service person either in Germany or the US.

William

[M9reno]

Tony, I would fire the self-timer by pressing the small indented button on its left-hand side.  It’s not good for the mechanism for it to be permanently armed.  This will also reveal whether the self-timer is still functioning correctly.

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[M9reno]

8 minutes ago, willeica said:

Some examples from that era have the 'film instruction plate' on the camera rather than on the bottom plate, but that would not bother me too much. The number written inside the camera looks to my poor eyesight like E 22 5 49, which may have been a date put on by a service person either in Germany or the US.

Here is mine, 360048, not much different, and serviced recently by Malcolm Taylor.  The bottom plate has the instructions.  It would be good if Tony could show a close-up of the gearing inside his take-up spool compartment, like my example below.

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

[earleygallery]

What a find! Congratulations! 

[Tony A.]

4 minutes ago, M9reno said:

 It would be good if Tony could show a close-up of the gearing inside his take-up spool compartment, like my example below.

 

 

 

 

I will try to get a better pic of the gearing when I get home this evening. Also, thanks for the tip on the timer, will do that as well.

[andybarton]

1 hour ago, willeica said:

The number written inside the camera looks to my poor eyesight like E 22 5 49, which may have been a date put on by a service person either in Germany or the US.

Most likely Germany, as a US technician would have written E 5 22 49 (if indeed that is a servicing date)

[jerzy]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

thx for posting the photos. I did not have the 360048 in my database. Neither 360001. A photo showing the top cover with the knobs would be great.

But back to 360001. Self timer is genuine IIId. All other details are conform with the first batch of IIId. It shall have black blinds. Gears on wind axis are not so clearly visible, but I am pretty sure that they are the same as in the camera presented by M9Reno. This camera is indeed not listed in Band I (Hahne list) but this says only that the camera was not sold and must have left the factory "in another way". Most probably inquiry with Leica Archive will not provide the answer when the camera was produced nor shipped.
In the table shown by Pecole the 2 production batches are marked with different color. Regardless of the shipping date the cameras from the first batch were assembled (fully or partially) before July 1940, while the cameras from the second batch were pre-assembled before May 1940 and some of them were finally assembled after October 1940. An artcle with more details will be published in June edition of Vidom (Leica Historica Germany), in German language. I cannot comment pencil written "E xxxx, have no idea what it could be. The last missing evidence would be checking the serial number engraved internally.

And short comment to 360048 - usualy film loadin instruction  plate was mounted on the camera cover and not bottom plate. But I would not pay too much attrantion to this

 

[M9reno]

5 minutes ago, jerzy said:

thx for posting the photos. I did not have the 360048 in my database. Neither 360001. A photo showing the top cover with the knobs would be great.

Thanks, Jerzy.  I've updated your other thread and added a link here.  A photo of the top cover will follow later today.  Thanks again.

[willeica]

1 hour ago, jerzy said:

Most probably inquiry with Leica Archive will not provide the answer when the camera was produced nor shipped.

Thanks for all your comments, Jerzy. Jim Lager went through the relevant records and could not find a delivery record for this one. My own suspicion is that this camera was in the factory until the end of WWII.

On the inspection front I received this today from Jim Lager:

"Hello William, The place to go in the USA for inspection would be DAG. Don Goldberg.

 360001 is a rare find. It was being developed/evaluated/tested 80 years ago. More than 3/4th's 

of a century later we are privileged to see it. Very exciting for historians! Jim"

 

I would suggest if you are approaching Don that it is not only a service that you need, but rather you need to see what the internal numbers might be and whether they match 360001. You should also mention Jim Lager's recommendation of an inspection by Don.

 

I have also asked Lars Netopil for a 'second opinion' on this camera.

 

William

 

[zeitz]

If you go to the trouble of sending the camera to Don and have him open the camera to look for numbers, I would recommend that you do whatever service he says is needed to restore full function.  It is highly likely that the lubricants have dried up.  The camera is well worth the ~ $300 Don would charge for a CLA.  It is unfortunate that DAG only accepts packages from the normal carriers (USPS, UPS, FedEx) for repair.  You cannot go to a door and hand deliver the camera.  You may want to plead with Don for an exception because of the value of the camera.  His home / shop is near Madison, WI.

[willeica]

Tony A. Lars Netopil is also pretty convinced about this camera. I have sent you his contact details by PM. This seems to be a real find indeed, the kind of one that most of us dream about.

William

[Tony A.]

I hope this is what you all were wanting to see. This is a surprisingly difficult shot to get. I can try again.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Edited February 12, 2020 by Tony A.

[willeica]

Just some observations. This would seem to be the construction pre 1940. See example in Jerzy's IIId thread and also M9reno's example. The shutter release on your camera is also pre 1941. I also seem to recall that Jerzy said that IIId bodies were pre-assembled. They would, therefore, have details similar to those existing in 1939.

William

[M9reno]

7 hours ago, Tony A. said:

I hope this is what you all were wanting to see. This is a surprisingly difficult shot to get. I can try again.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Tony, is the Self-Timer working correctly?

[Tony A.]

45 minutes ago, M9reno said:

Tony, is the Self-Timer working correctly?

Yes, it seems to be. 

[Tony A.]

Here is another photo that Jerzy  asked for. 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Edited February 12, 2020 by Tony A.

[Pecole]

1 hour ago, willeica said:

Just some observations. This would seem to be the construction pre 1940. See example in Jerzy's IIId thread and also M9reno's example. The shutter release on your camera is also pre 1941. I also seem to recall that Jerzy said that IIId bodies were pre-assembled. They would, therefore, have details similar to those existing in 1939.

William

If Jerzy is right in saying that all IIId's were pre-assembled early, why do we have some with red blinds?

[jerzy]

Thank you Tony, black blinds (if not replaced) indicate very early assembly, many IIId from the first batch have red blinds. 

[jerzy]

vor 6 Minuten schrieb Pecole:

If Jerzy is right in saying that all IIId's were pre-assembled early, why do we have some with red blinds?

red blinds were used in regular production (IIIc) from March 1940 until October 1941 approximately. Some of them have been replaced with black ones later on, so this alone is not the proof when the cameras have been assembled. But there are other details (see my thread Any IIId owner?) which allow to determine when assembly (or pre-assembly) was. The earliest documented IIId that was shiped from the factory is from 1939, so with black blinds still. Red blinds may be found as well on cameras with 367xxx, shiped in 1943/44, so 3-4 years after Leitz switched back to black blinds. 
And insight into delivery records shows that some of cameras were stocked in delivery stock, ready for shipment for weeks, sometimes more than 1 year. Very unusual for IIIc from this time.

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[dubois pierre]

I see on a book by D  Rogliatti that a limited  IIId series starts at number 360000

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!