intermittent error

[stickan1]

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My M10 from september 2017 has developed an intermittent error. The shutter sometimes starts to go off on its own and continues until I shut off the camera. When I press the shutter it is blocked. In between it works ok. The error started to occur in cold weather and it is more frequent now. So far restarting by removing batteries has worked. But today I had to give up using the camera outdoors with -4 degrees, Celsius. I have now kept it indoors and it is ok. I have changed batteries. I am afraid that there is a poor contact somewhere. But before sending it in I would like to hear if there are any suggestions. I have firmware 2.7.5.0.

Edited November 30, 2019 by stickan1

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[michali]

2 hours ago, stickan1 said:

My M10 from september 2017 has developed an intermittent error. The shutter sometimes starts to go off on its own and continues until I shut off the camera. When I press the shutter it is blocked. In between it works ok. The error started to occur in cold weather and it is more frequent now. So far restarting by removing batteries has worked. But today I had to give up using the camera outdoors with -4 degrees, Celsius. I have now kept it indoors and it is ok. I have changed batteries. I am afraid that there is a poor contact somewhere. But before sending it in I would like to hear if there are any suggestions. I have firmware 2.7.5.0.

I had very similar issues with both of my M9s in Antarctica from about -5C. Once I got back indoors it behaved normally again. 

Does it do this all the time or only when you're outside in cold weather?

Edited November 30, 2019 by michali

[stickan1]

Only outdoors and in cold weather, but it doesn't have to be below zero. I now suspect and hope that it is a mechanical thing in the shutter button. I worked with the button, which has a soft release, so that it moves easier. I have made a short walk just now in -4 degrees and used the camera without problems. I have had problems with the shutter button getting stuck on another M camera. Lets hope this fix it!

[Gobert]

May be the button has collected some dirt and a nice cleaning, or compressed air, will help.

[adan]

An additional possibility, related to minus-C temperatures.

Moisture getting into the seam around the outside, or the cable-release socket inside, the shutter button - and freezing.

As we know, one can get condensation going from cold air into warm air - which can freeze if still present when going into cold air again. Or, of course, one tiny raindrop or snowflake might land right on the seam, melt, penetrate just a little, and then re-freeze as the camera metal cools in the ambient air. The fact the Ms have metal bodies (instead of less-conductive plastic) may also be a factor.

The M10 is somewhat weather-sealed as regards the critical electronics deep inside - but I'm not sure that applies in the first 1-2mm of the shutter button bezel.

Usual best practice going from cold air to warm air in "winter" photography, is to slip a camera/lens into a plastic baggie before entering the warm indoors - allows the camera (and the surrounding cold air in the baggie) to warm up slowly to indoor ambient temp without collecting condensation.

[Kwesi]

Have you tried shooting without the soft release button? Also have you tried keeping  the camera inside your coat until you are ready to shoot?

[TomB_tx]

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2 hours ago, Kwesi said:

Have you tried shooting without the soft release button? Also have you tried keeping  the camera inside your coat until you are ready to shoot?

In some climate the lens & VF will fog/frost over as you take it in and out of your coat. Back in the 1960s in Michigan’s U.P. We found it better to let cameras acclimate to the -25 F temperatures until we had to come inside, but of course our cameras didn’t have electronics then. Should still work with an M-A though.

[stickan1]

I think that the problem is solved. Today I made a long walk with the camera and dog in -4 degrees. No problems. I think that the shutter got stuck sometimes in the down position or very close to it due to dirt, aggravated by moisture and ice. I used the soft release to move the shutter up and down and also rotated it. I am reluctant to use any oil.

[jaapv]

Indeed! DON'T use oil or WD40 or whatever on the shutter button.

[Peter Kilmister]

26 minutes ago, jaapv said:

Indeed! DON'T use oil or WD40 or whatever on the shutter button.

@jaapv Thank you for telling us that. Now engraved in long-term memory.

[Kwesi]

2 hours ago, stickan1 said:

I think that the problem is solved. Today I made a long walk with the camera and dog in -4 degrees. No problems. I think that the shutter got stuck sometimes in the down position or very close to it due to dirt, aggravated by moisture and ice. I used the soft release to move the shutter up and down and also rotated it. I am reluctant to use any oil.

Glad to hear all is well again. I would suggest not using the soft release for a while. Depending on its height, you may be pushing down harder than intended and this may be contributing to some sort of "stuck shutter button" problem.

Edited December 1, 2019 by Kwesi