leica sl2 Tom Berger: Leica’s New Milestone – My first experiences with the SL2

[tommydom]

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21 minutes ago, caissa said:

... Are there already profiles for the SL2 (in LR or r C1) ?

C1 does not have the SL2 in the current version (12.1.0.106). 

[MediaFotografie]

vor 2 Stunden schrieb tommydom:

C1 does not have the SL2 in the current version (12.1.0.106). 

 

but C1 can open SL2‘s DNGs without any problems - and with stunning results

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[tommydom]

2 hours ago, mediafotografie said:

 

but C1 can open SL2‘s DNGs without any problems - and with stunning results

+1 - Agreed, I used one of @Chaemono DNG from the SL2 Dynamic Range thread to get the same results he achieved via Lightroom. Some amazing files if you can handle the size of the DNGs.

[fototom]

Am 19.11.2019 um 16:31 schrieb caissa:

Did you use jpgs or raws ?  And if raws, how did you “develop” them. Are there already profiles for the SL2 (in LR or r C1) ?

... I ALWAYS use raw-files (as I wrote before 😉) and develop the DNGs in Photoshop RAW-converter ...

Edited November 21, 2019 by fototom

[Akaki]

Dear members.

One question.

If I use Noctilux 0.95, it will be 100% compatible with SL2  47 mp sensor Image?

Because I read that TL Lenses will be compatible only with 20 mp.

Thank you

Edited November 22, 2019 by Akaki

[fixedwheel]

45 minutes ago, Akaki said:

Because I read that TL Lenses will be compatible only with 20 mp.

That's because TL lenses are set up for the APS-C sized sensor.

John

[Akaki]

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10 minutes ago, fixedwheel said:

That's because TL lenses are set up for the APS-C sized sensor.

 

Thank you John

I was thinking about that, but wanted be sure.

[fixedwheel]

4 minutes ago, Akaki said:

I was thinking about that, but wanted be sure.

I am also planning to make use of my M lenses on the SL2, I don't have any TL or SL Leica lenses, or L mount lenses from elsewhere, so initially it will just be M glass via a M-Adapter L (18771)

John

[nryn]

Tom, may I ask what lenses you used for these outstanding images? I believe I see M lenses in all of your shots and you mention a Sigma L-mount lens.

I plan on keeping my L-mount lens collection small and relying on my M lens collection.

[tom0511]

Hi Tom,

I wonder how you come to the conclusion high-iso-noise is better than SL1?

What I see, at least at 100%, this is not the case. Like the S1r to me the SL2 shows more noise than the 24MP sensor.

[Shlomo]

Hi friends, SL2 is on the very top of my wishlist, but still there seems to be no SL2 VS X1D2 review rich in comparative images concerning sheer IQ - is there any news out there?

Cheers, Shlomo.

Edited December 11, 2019 by Shlomo

[thighslapper]

On 12/11/2019 at 10:34 AM, Shlomo said:

Hi friends, SL2 is on the very top of my wishlist, but still there seems to be no SL2 VS X1D2 review rich in comparative images concerning sheer IQ - is there any news out there?

Cheers, Shlomo.

not surprised ...... for it be in any way meaningful you need SL2 and X1D2 images taken of identical subjects at the same time using the same focal length lenses.

I doubt there are many .... if any ... people who own both an SL2 and X1D2 .... and who are willing to expend the effort in carrying out a rigorous test. Unless you have genuine comparison images the results will be meaningless. 

I've done all this in the past with various cameras and found the 'real world' differences in image quality to be negligible in cameras of this quality and price bracket. 

[Jeff S]

On 12/12/2019 at 8:39 AM, thighslapper said:

I've done all this in the past with various cameras and found the 'real world' differences in image quality to be negligible in cameras of this quality and price bracket. 

Likewise for me, once editing and print workflow is dialed in.  Mostly comes down to things like native lens options, ergonomics and handling, menu and control interface, viewing and focusing, and other specifically desired characteristics (e.g., weather sealing, stabilization, etc). 

Jeff

[Photoworks]

On 12/11/2019 at 5:34 AM, Shlomo said:

Hi friends, SL2 is on the very top of my wishlist, but still there seems to be no SL2 VS X1D2 review rich in comparative images concerning sheer IQ - is there any news out there?

Cheers, Shlomo.

Probably because it is not a comparison to make, I have tested both and went with SL2.
the decision came down for this point:
1. adapting lenses. SL2 wins since the X1D camera does not have a shutter, adapting lenses is terrible, NO IBIS and lots of rolling shutter at all time.

2. firmware: X1D is still working on a final firmware, with Hasselblad is there such a thing of a final Firmware? they just came out with one and still many functions are greyed out.

3 AF. SL2 is good, not amazing but good. X1D is the same contrast base but very slow, combined with lenses that start at f3.5 the focusing suffer and most lighting.

4. image look: The medium format look is amazing, that is the only reason to get the x1D and 80mm 1.9 lens.

5. ISO: I think the ISO performance is comparable for both, probably both usable to 6400. Sony is still cleaner and more dynamic range.

 

 

[Shlomo]

Thank You for You answer - I am about to get some shots with both cameras, I don't need ISO or autofocus - only IQ, let's see, what is going to happen 😉

Cordially, Shlomo 

[Jared]

On 2/14/2020 at 1:05 PM, Shlomo said:

Thank You for You answer - I am about to get some shots with both cameras, I don't need ISO or autofocus - only IQ, let's see, what is going to happen 😉

Cordially, Shlomo 

My X1DII has more dynamic range.  In some scenes that matters, in other scenes it doesn’t.  There is also a significant difference in colors, both saturation and hue.  Not better or worse, just different.  I prefer the X1D hues more often than I prefer the SL2, but I can make either one look the way I want for any given photograph.  That’s after white balancing on the same gray card. Your opinion might differ. Obviously, the aspect ratio is different.  From a practical standpoint, neither has a significant resolution advantage.  

I Use the X1DII for landscapes.  Anything on a tripod, I’d rather use the Hasselblad.  For flash work, I prefer the X1D due to the full compatibility with Profoto and the leaf shutter.  However, the SL2 is fine with my Profoto strobes as long as I don’t need TTL or HSS.  The Hasselblad, however, is quite sloooooowwww.  Everything from FPS to autofocus to shutter lag is dramatically slower than the SL2.  Moving subjects?  Just don’t bother with the X1D.

Lenses are exceptional with either.  I have favorites in each format.  In general, the newest Leica SL lenses probably are better in terms of straight up MTF, but it isn’t by much, and the X1D’s larger chip means that it has more millimeters to play with so the lenses don’t have to work quite as hard.  High ISO noise is a stop or so better in the X1D.

Basically, if I’m shooting on a tripod or with strobes outdoors, I want the X1D.  Anything else, I’d take the SL2.  That’s from an image quality standpoint as well as a usability standpoint.  I’ve only had the SL2 for a couple days, but I have extensive use with the sensor in the form of the Q2, and have years of experience with the original SL including the 24-90, 35 Summicron, 75 Summicron, and 90-280.

What would you want to see in terms of a comparison photo or two?  I’m happy to post something for you.  What type of subject? What focal length? What ISO’s do you care about?  Are you just looking at dynamic range?  Or DR and resolution?  Or, it sounds like you may already have this covered yourself?  Not volunteering for a rigorous and comprehensive set of tests, but if there was something specific you wanted to see...

[Shlomo]

On 2/29/2020 at 12:36 AM, Jared said:

"What would you want to see in terms of a comparison photo or two?  I’m happy to post something for you.  What type of subject? What focal length? What ISO’s do you care about?  Are you just looking at dynamic range?  Or DR and resolution?  Or, it sounds like you may already have this covered yourself?  Not volunteering for a rigorous and comprehensive set of tests, but if there was something specific you wanted to see...."

Dear Jared, thank You so much! If You have some really cropped sample Images I 'd very happy, I' ve been searching the whole Internet for direct comparisons and found . . . . . nothing, no test, no You Tube, no Vimeo, no nothing. I do not need ISO, I have two Leica bodies and shot almost always on ISO 100, if I was dissatisfied with the results, of course it would be extremely ridiculous to say, that I only had needed more ISO to make a remarkable picture 😃. I always was interested in digital medium format for regular street and travel photography, like in the old days, when it was superfine to have a Roleiflex 6 x 6. The results where outstanding and epic and no one cared about ISO, size or weight. So if You please could post some more or less comparable cropped images I would be extremely glad. My intention is to buy the X1D2 with 45mm or SL 2 with 35mm. 

Thank You for every everything, greetings from Berlin ❤️

Yours Shlomo.

Edited March 2, 2020 by Shlomo

[Jared]

No problem, Shlomo!  Here are a couple samples from my back garden earlier this afternoon...

This should give you a good idea of what both the X1DII and the SL2 are capable of in a typical use case.  It will show you the difference in color (at least for this subject on this day), the difference in how they handle depth of field, the different perspective, and a sample of "sharpness" from each.

First, here is the entire scene.  The SL2 shot was taken with the 35mm Summicron SL.  The X1DII shot was taken with the 45mm XCD P lens.  Each was shot at maximum aperture.  That's f/2 for the SL2 and f/4 for the X1D.  Because of the difference in format, the depth of field should feel more like f/2 vs f/2.8 (in 35mm terms).  Both cameras were handheld.  Both cameras were at base ISO.  Because the SL2 had a faster lens, the shutter speeds are different.  That gave the SL2 a significant edge in sharpness even without the IBIS.  1/80s on most 35mm cameras with a 35mm lens is fairly easy to hand hold, but 1/45s on the XCD is actually right on the edge of where one can expect sharp results handheld, and you see it in a slight loss of micro-contrast vs the SL2.  In terms of straight resolution, they would have been quite close if the X1D had been mounted on a tripod.  I shot this handheld just to give a more "realistic" comparison to the SL2.

First, the SL2... The point of focus was the front of the pig's eye.  

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Now the X1DII... Same point of focus.

If

Crops to come...

[Jared]

And here is the crop from the SL2...

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[Jared]

And this is approximately the same crop from the X1DII.  You can see that I really should have bumped up the ISO a touch and gotten a faster shutter speed or else used a tripod.  Still, it's a practical example that should give you a good idea of typical results.

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