nicci78 Posted October 23, 2019 Share #1 Posted October 23, 2019 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) When Leica is going to the more mundane magnesium (like all other brands) for Q2 and supposedly for SL2. Bye bye aluminium. This trend to use lighter and cheaper materials starts with M typ 262, replacing brass for aluminium. But Q2 goes one step further for lighter magnesium. Fujifilm released X-Pro 3 with top and bottom case in titanium. Which as strong as steel, but is 55% lighter than it. It is also scratchproof. Fuji is going after Leica, by making the X-Pro 3 the luxurious option within their line up, with special metal choice. Is it a concern for you, that Leica cameras loose their metal cold feel, for the plastic feel of magnesium ? Edited October 23, 2019 by nicci78 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 23, 2019 Posted October 23, 2019 Hi nicci78, Take a look here Fujifilm more luxurious than Leica ?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
AndreasG Posted October 23, 2019 Share #2 Posted October 23, 2019 Why should Magnesium offer a plastic feel? It is a metal. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicci78 Posted October 23, 2019 Author Share #3 Posted October 23, 2019 (edited) it is a metal with plastic feel. Just try Leica Q in Al vs Q2 in Mg 100% unibody aluminium bodies such as T/TL, TL2 and SL feel fantastic. Q2 does not, sadly. Leica has always used magnesium for the body belt since the M8. But it was always covered with leatherette, due to plastic warm feel. Other bare parts were made of cold feel aluminium or brass. Until the Q2 and the soon to be announced SL2, which are 100% magnesium. SL2 is rumoured to ditch full unibody aluminium for full magnesium body, to save weight. Edited October 23, 2019 by nicci78 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wda Posted October 23, 2019 Share #4 Posted October 23, 2019 4 hours ago, nicci78 said: When Leica is going to the more mundane magnesium (like all other brands) for Q2 and supposedly for SL2. Bye bye aluminium. This trend to use lighter and cheaper materials starts with M typ 262, replacing brass for aluminium. But Q2 goes one step further for lighter magnesium. Fujifilm released X-Pro 3 with top and bottom case in titanium. Which as strong as steel, but is 55% lighter than it. It is also scratchproof. Fuji is going after Leica, by making the X-Pro 3 the luxurious option within their line up, with special metal choice. Is it a concern for you, that Leica cameras loose their metal cold feel, for the plastic feel of magnesium ? Does it really matter? Surely it is the results which count. 5 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianman Posted October 23, 2019 Share #5 Posted October 23, 2019 5 hours ago, nicci78 said: This trend to use lighter and cheaper materials starts with M typ 262 I thought it started with the M4-P. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exodies Posted October 23, 2019 Share #6 Posted October 23, 2019 I don’t like to touch aluminium Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbo Posted October 23, 2019 Share #7 Posted October 23, 2019 Advertisement (gone after registration) Don’t any of you guys own gloves? 2 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
UliWer Posted October 23, 2019 Share #8 Posted October 23, 2019 vor 4 Stunden schrieb Exodies: I don’t like to touch aluminium If you try to bite it, you'll prefer touching it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exodies Posted October 23, 2019 Share #9 Posted October 23, 2019 True, it’s worse if you put it in your mouth. The electric component of touch is completely ignored for some reason. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
masjah Posted October 23, 2019 Share #10 Posted October 23, 2019 1 hour ago, Exodies said: True, it’s worse if you put it in your mouth. The electric component of touch is completely ignored for some reason. Dear Lord - I thought it was bad enough when my wife's cousin's new puppy chewed up her (cousin's) camera. I'd honestly never considered putting any of my Leicas in my mouth. 1 5 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicci78 Posted October 24, 2019 Author Share #11 Posted October 24, 2019 19 hours ago, ianman said: I thought it started with the M4-P. Then it backed fire with bubbling M6 zinc top case. Making them quite appalling. Hopefully Leica get their senses and switch back to brass since M7 and MP. Until the M typ 262 in aluminium. Not a bad idea, I like the lightweight. Just like I dislike heavy chrome brass M lenses. Anodised aluminium one are better sui for the diminutive size of these optics. Magnesium is a step further to reduce manufacturing costs. But can we accept cheaper materials for high end/luxury items ? That’s the real question. I quite dislike the plastic feel of my Q2. Assembly is top notch, but tactile response is not. Just compare it to M10, to notice the abysmal difference between them. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianman Posted October 24, 2019 Share #12 Posted October 24, 2019 6 minutes ago, nicci78 said: But can we accept cheaper materials for high end/luxury items ? That’s the real question It's a camera, not a luxury item. 3 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nowhereman Posted October 24, 2019 Share #13 Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) 26 minutes ago, nicci78 said: ...But can we accept cheaper materials for high end/luxury items ? That’s the real question... That magnesium is a "mundane" metal is an absurd concept — and that it's cheap compared to aluminum is also risible. You can do a webs search for "magnesium aluminum". In one article, on die casting, you can find this: Quote When compared to the cost of melting aluminum, new technology has lowered the expenses required to melt magnesium alloys, but casting requires a higher injection speed. Conversely, magnesium has a quicker ejection time over aluminum castings. Magnesium is also better at casting components with thinner walls and tighter tolerances than aluminum. However, even with the many advantages of magnesium, aluminum remains a less expensive alternative for die casting. Another article states: Quote Magnesium is 33% lighter than aluminum, 60% lighter than titanium, and 75% lighter than steel. Yet for many applications it’s stronger per unit volume than all three of those structural metals...It is also an extremely versatile metal. Besides its basic functions as a component in aluminum alloys, titanium, and steel production, magnesium can also be cast into various mechanical parts and replace aluminum alloys for virtually anything you want to make lighter and stronger. Edited October 24, 2019 by Nowhereman Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicci78 Posted October 24, 2019 Author Share #14 Posted October 24, 2019 Very high end/Luxury price. Magnesium is not cheap, but it is very cheap to build stuff with. So overall it is way cheaper than aluminium for consumer product. But have you notice how all premium products avoid magnesium ? watches and now smartphone (because they all have to feel premium) Of course except cameras, because japanese company, do not care about plastic feel. For them magnesium is a superior metal and it is super easy to work with. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LocalHero1953 Posted October 24, 2019 Share #15 Posted October 24, 2019 The market has voted - it prefers devices to be lighter: one of the big selling points of the M10 over the M240, and (probably) of the SL2 over the SL. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicci78 Posted October 24, 2019 Author Share #16 Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) M10 is only 20g lighter due to thinner body. But it still uses brass top and bottom covers. Just like its peers since M8. Except M typ 262 of course. Leica is aware that magnesium is a nice metal. Until Q2 they only use it as the body belt for almost all made in Germany digital cameras. Except beautiful CNC machined aluminium T, TL, SL & TL2 ones. Being covered by leatherette, Magnesium is not a nuisance at all. Visible bare parts were made from lacquered or chromed brass or anodised aluminium for a reason. SL and TL lenses use heavier aluminium external body for a tactile reason. For the Q2, they found a kind of magic paint job, imitating anodised aluminium. But it still feels plastic to me. Edited October 24, 2019 by nicci78 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicci78 Posted October 24, 2019 Author Share #17 Posted October 24, 2019 I've got a problem to pay premium price to Leica, just to get the same stuff as other Japanese companies. Even one of them, think that magnesium is not high end enough and goes to titanium with fancy protective treatments. Isn't that ironic ? People are starting to complain that SL2 will be a S1R paint job with a red dot. Which it won't. But you can wonder, as SL2 are rumoured to ditch CNC unibody aluminium frame for lighter but cheaper to manufacture magnesium. Exactly as the Lumix S1R. One key differentiator lost for the same luxurious price as before. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pedaes Posted October 24, 2019 Share #18 Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, nicci78 said: I've got a problem to pay premium price to Leica, just to get the same stuff as other Japanese companies. Even one of them, think that magnesium is not high end enough and goes to titanium with fancy protective treatments. Isn't that ironic ? . Are you for real? What nonsense. You want Leica to use a cheaper and inferior metal because it is more expensive to manufacture. I don't think Leica cameras are for you. Edited October 24, 2019 by pedaes 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
frame-it Posted October 24, 2019 Share #19 Posted October 24, 2019 1 hour ago, nicci78 said: But can we accept cheaper materials for high end/luxury items ? That’s the real question. I quite dislike the plastic feel of my Q2. Assembly is top notch, but tactile response is not. Just compare it to M10, to notice the abysmal difference between them. perhaps you can email Leica with your suggestions on increasing quality of their products. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianman Posted October 24, 2019 Share #20 Posted October 24, 2019 12 minutes ago, nicci78 said: I've got a problem to pay premium price to Leica It's good that you have the choice then. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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