"Vader" Certainly Isn't Any Prettier

[nicci78]

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7 hours ago, BernardC said:

Just like drivers think they need a car that can do 250 km/h.

Trust me in Germany you will need 250km/h. You will feel too slow at 200km in highway. 😉
 

Real cameras need more megapixels to stay relevant against smartphones. 
 

Edited October 12, 2019 by nicci78

[Jenningsmca]

Well, I wanted faster AF and longer lenses so I decided to pre-oder the Sony A9II with IBIS, 20fps and a 200-600 lens to go with it. Will keep the SL for the m lenses and times I want to slow down in life. May someday upgrade to the SL2.

Edited October 12, 2019 by Jenningsmca

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[FlashGordonPhotography]

5 hours ago, SlowDriver said:

+1.  As more lenses become available AF will more and more become the Achilles' heel of Leica preventing wider acceptance.  I also own the Canon EOS R.  As far as AF goes it is simply playing in another league.  Yesterday I was shooting in low light.  I started with the Leica SL but quickly switched to the Canon EOS R because the SL had too much difficulties locking focus.  The EOS R did a much much better job.  

The S1R has the best low light AF I have used. Far better than the SL. Better than the Z7, A9 and A7R3 (which I own). As good as my friends 1Dx2. This is in single shot, which is what I use. So if you're happy with that and the SL2 inherits the AF from the S1R you'll be happy. The S1R locks on like an angry dog in low light. CAF isn't it's strong suit however.

Although I bought an A9, thinking I'd use the advanced AF, mostly I still carry the SL or S1R because I really rarely need it and when I do I just work around it, because I prefer the Leica and S1R in every other way. I have maybe 500 shots on my A9 and it's 18 months old. Compared to 30K already on my S1R and many many thousands on the SL's, including about a hundred weddings shooting in dim reception rooms. I adapted pretty quick. No shots were lost because I didn't have a 1DX2 (which my shooting partner did have). Missing a photograph isn't life or death. Even as a wedding photographer, I don't suffer because the SL isn't class leading in CAF. It has other benefits.

**and not specifically directed at your post**

Of course some will complain it doesn't have CAF like the A9II, the size of a Fuji XT3, the DR of an X1D and the resolution of a GFX100. I really don't think Leica care. I don't think that's their market or the market they're looking at. Leica still struggle to see themselves as more than street, travel and fashion cameras and so the cameras seem to be built around those parameters. So with the SL you got great usability, build quality, lenses and weather sealing. OTOH you get stupid restrictions like the S007 only having a minute as a minimum shutter speed and mandatory LENR which means what could be one of the great landscape cameras made is hobbled, unnecessarily. But Leica will be Leica and since they can't make anything in quantity there will be a waiting list and the prices will be high so they will be profitable. I'm not convinced Leica want or care about wider acceptance. They seem to be honing in to this M10 like user interface, despite the SL/S camera back being vastly more usable. If they lose me as an SL2 buyer (which they probably have) they wont lose any sleep. There will be a dozen to fill my space on the waiting list. And despite my feelings on what they should do with the SL2 they remain one of the most profitable camera manufacturers there is. 

I think *WE* would like Leica to make cameras that are more flexible. I'm sure *WE* would like Leica to make longer lenses, faster AF, eye focus, PDAF etc. I don't know if Leica see that that is how Leicas are supposed to be used.

Gordon

[Mr.Q]

Different strokes for different folks I guess. I traded my X-T3 for the A9 a couple weeks ago and have well over 1,500 shots already.  I only took out the SL to compare the 24-90 against the 24-105. I may have overrated the 24-90 as the results were quite similar. And I found a gem in the CV 65 which is simply mind-blowing. Perhaps even better optically than my XCD 80/1.9. I'll wait until the official announcement, but I'm doubtful that the SL2 would add anything meaningful to my photography. I'm leaning towards pulling out of L-mount and upgrading to the A9 II.  

[sillbeers15]

2 hours ago, Mr.Q said:

Different strokes for different folks I guess. I traded my X-T3 for the A9 a couple weeks ago and have well over 1,500 shots already.  I only took out the SL to compare the 24-90 against the 24-105. I may have overrated the 24-90 as the results were quite similar. And I found a gem in the CV 65 which is simply mind-blowing. Perhaps even better optically than my XCD 80/1.9. I'll wait until the official announcement, but I'm doubtful that the SL2 would add anything meaningful to my photography. I'm leaning towards pulling out of L-mount and upgrading to the A9 II.  

We all have different choices based on our own preferences.

As for me, I only have Leica SL & M lenses and have no desire to use others. So my choice of cameras naturally fall to the SL2 or / and S1R.

[Chaemono]

I apere

vor 2 Stunden schrieb sillbeers15:

We all have different choices based on our own preferences.

As for me, I only have Leica SL & M lenses and have no desire to use others. So my choice of cameras naturally fall to the SL2 or / and S1R.

My approach is this, the best lenses (SL and modern M lenses) need to be paired with the best sensors. Everything else is a compromise as the S1R sensor performance shows.  If the M11 doesn't use a 36 MPx Sony sensor (IMX435 possibly) and the α7S III (if it ever is released) does with incredible low light performance, I will get a Kolari mod α7S III and not an M11.  I've stuck to the M10 not only because I love to use the camera, but also because I like its sensor performance in the ISO 200 to 640 range (compared it extensively against the α7R III and the Z7). 

Edited October 13, 2019 by Chaemono

[Mr.Q]

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2 hours ago, sillbeers15 said:

We all have different choices based on our own preferences.

As for me, I only have Leica SL & M lenses and have no desire to use others. So my choice of cameras naturally fall to the SL2 or / and S1R.

We certainly do. Didn't you sell your SL?

[nicci78]

Leica seems to be listening to their core users :

- M10 is a real barebone digital M. No video but live view is still available. 
 

- CL is essentially a TL2 with EVF and classic ergonomics. Exactly what traditional Leica users wanted  

- Q2 gives you everything we can wish for an update : weather sealing and 47MP for better crop ability

- SL2 will give us long due IBIS and 47MP. High megapixel count justifies the choice of very high resolution SL lenses  

 

We should be happy to see Leica fulfilling the majority of our wishes  

 

[nicci78]

Weird forum bug  

double post 

 

Edited October 13, 2019 by nicci78

[budjames]

31 minutes ago, nicci78 said:

Leica seems to be listening to their core users :

- M10 is a real barebone digital M. No video but live view is still available. 
 

- CL is essentially a TL2 with EVF and classic ergonomics. Exactly what traditional Leica users wanted  

- Q2 gives you everything we can wish for an update : weather sealing and 47MP for better crop ability

- SL2 will give us long due IBIS and 47MP. High megapixel count justifies the choice of very high resolution SL lenses  

 

We should be happy to see Leica fulfilling the majority of our wishes  

 

If the SL2 has IBIS, then it will be interesting if this works with M-adapted lens. 

Regards,
Bud James

Please check out my fine art and travel photography at www.budjames.photography or on Instagram at www.instagram.com/budjamesphoto.

[helged]

13 minutes ago, budjames said:

If the SL2 has IBIS, then it will be interesting if this works with M-adapted lens. 

Regards,
Bud James

Please check out my fine art and travel photography at www.budjames.photography or on Instagram at www.instagram.com/budjamesphoto.

IBIS will work with any lens, Leica-M included. For non-native lenses, you typically have to set the lens focal length manually. With the dedicated Leica M-adapter-L and properly marked 6-bit marked lenses, IBIS should work automatically. 

Edited October 13, 2019 by helged

[Chaemono]

vor 1 Stunde schrieb nicci78:

Leica seems to be listening to their core users :

- M10 is a real barebone digital M. No video but live view is still available. 
 

- CL is essentially a TL2 with EVF and classic ergonomics. Exactly what traditional Leica users wanted  

- Q2 gives you everything we can wish for an update : weather sealing and 47MP for better crop ability

- SL2 will give us long due IBIS and 47MP. High megapixel count justifies the choice of very high resolution SL lenses  

 

We should be happy to see Leica fulfilling the majority of our wishes  

 

They may not have heard mine, yet. I want 48ish MPx, please. 😁

[Chaemono]

vor einer Stunde schrieb budjames:

If the SL2 has IBIS, then it will be interesting if this works with M-adapted lens. 

Regards,
Bud James

Please check out my fine art and travel photography at www.budjames.photography or on Instagram at www.instagram.com/budjamesphoto.

Bud, of course, like Helge said. But don't get overly excited, yet. If it has 47 MPx, I will cancel my order.

[sillbeers15]

5 hours ago, Mr.Q said:

We certainly do. Didn't you sell your SL?

Yes, in anticipation to replace it with SL2 preorder after 9th Nov.

[Guest]

12 hours ago, FlashGordonPhotography said:

The S1R has the best low light AF I have used. Far better than the SL. Better than the Z7, A9 and A7R3 (which I own). As good as my friends 1Dx2. This is in single shot, which is what I use. So if you're happy with that and the SL2 inherits the AF from the S1R you'll be happy. The S1R locks on like an angry dog in low light. CAF isn't it's strong suit however.

Although I bought an A9, thinking I'd use the advanced AF, mostly I still carry the SL or S1R because I really rarely need it and when I do I just work around it, because I prefer the Leica and S1R in every other way. I have maybe 500 shots on my A9 and it's 18 months old. Compared to 30K already on my S1R and many many thousands on the SL's, including about a hundred weddings shooting in dim reception rooms. I adapted pretty quick. No shots were lost because I didn't have a 1DX2 (which my shooting partner did have). Missing a photograph isn't life or death. Even as a wedding photographer, I don't suffer because the SL isn't class leading in CAF. It has other benefits.

I probably should have been more specific in my post.  Friday I was shooting with the 35mm.  I assume for your weddings you mostly use the zooms.  I only have the 24-90mm and the 35mm and autofocus wise the 35mm is simply not as good as the zoom.  Too much back and forth hunting in low light.  It quite often still locks focus but it does so after going back and forth one or two times.  Otherwise it is obviously an excellent lens and weight is much more bearable than the zoom making it much more suitable as a carry with you lens.  Is it the case for the other primes as well that the autofocus is not as good as the zooms?

[LocalHero1953]

I have the 90SL and find it fast focusing. I haven't used it long enough to say how well it performs in low light, but I haven't noticed enough difference in performance to suggest it would be worse than the three zooms in low light - which I find good. Like Gordon, I don't use AFc, and find AFs fine. I do use tracking, though and would like it to be better than it is.

I'm puzzled about how or why different lenses would have different AF performance on the same body. In my ignorance I assumed that AF is determined by the body, which just tells the lens focus drive how to move. I'd expect errors and hunting to be caused by the body, not the lens. I remember the 60TL was slow (not inaccurate) on the TL2, but speeded up a lot on the CL (It speeded up on the TL2 later as well, with new f/w). So I don't understand how the 24-90 zoom could be fast but the 35SL slow. Perhaps someone with more technical knowledge of how AF works could explain it.

Edited October 13, 2019 by LocalHero1953

[sillbeers15]

I had great experiences with my SL75 and three zooms on AF in general on the SL. No complaints on AF locking speed and only very occasional back & forth AF before locking on in Low light. 

I use almost all AF eye detect on my SL75 and it has not let me down once.

My experience of less than ideal only happens with using my SL90-280 on AFC / AF tracking. Which gets me soft focus shots in between sharp focus shots while tracking moving subjects and situation gets worse when I select continuous high drive mode. I attribute the short comings not so much on CDAF drawback but rather the AF calculation speed of the processor in SL not up to the task.

I do not do AFC tracking on moving subjects on any other lenses so I cannot tell if it were lens specific issue. But like I said earlier I would not think it is due to specific lens but the camera processor.

will specific lens perform batter than others on AF speed? Only possibility I can think about would be the level of refinement in the database of each lens stored in the camera processor and editable through software downloads for DFD CDAF methodology application. I do not own the SL50lux but did remember an earlier firmware download available to improve on it’s AF speed.

[Donzo98]

2 hours ago, Chaemono said:

Bud, of course, like Helge said. But don't get overly excited, yet. If it has 47 MPx, I will cancel my order.

Why?? Because that would mean it has the same sensor as the S1R??

[Chaemono]

vor 31 Minuten schrieb Donzo98:

Why?? Because that would mean it has the same sensor as the S1R??

Yes, and I already have an S1R. 

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[jankap]

You could use the SL2 as a back-up.