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TL CL future


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I am still loving my x 113 - If I get excited one day and fancy an interchangeable lensed Leica, then I will buy a CL most likely, but would prefer them to fix the wandering focus point first - as that would grip me a little too much. 

Anyway the x still produces excellent images. 

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It is a pity as the Cl could be the M of the future ( it is small fast and inconspicuous) for the younger generation that love AF, fully automatic, touch screen, but searching for high quality. 

But for that is needed constant firmware updates, a larger integration of accessories, new lenses ( not big as di SL ones).  

I do think that at state of art a full frame could make a difference for a larger number of younger photographers 

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I really like my CL. When I first tried it, I was confused with the dials - not M intuitive (or just me!).  I kept playing with a friend's CL and it kept calling me. Now I've had it just over a month and am really enjoying it more and more (especially since I've gotten to know the dials). I find it's a perfect complement to my M camera - and not just little brother back-up - it's up there shoulder to shoulder with the M: the M for that M way of shooting, the CL for the hybrid M and AF way and both using the same lenses. 

I normally try not the buy the first iteration (and with the CL I did wait for more than a year) but the CL is really a joy to use for me. I travel very light, no more than M body with 3 lenses tops (all small/light) - never with back-up body. Now with the CL, I can have alternative ways to shoot depending on my mood and have 2 bodies with the same lens system (well, not L for the M of course) - so it's a very happy situation.

I'm no industry / business insider/commentator - but I can't see the CL being discontinued for the next decade ..... into a CL3 with 100MP (urgh!).

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8 hours ago, g2van said:

I normally try not the buy the first iteration (and with the CL I did wait for more than a year) but the CL is really a joy to use for me

I would argue that its the 5th generation of Leica's APS-C system (X1, X2, X-Vario, T (genetic mutation), CL)

:D

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The CL seems to be in a sweet spot when it comes to sensor size, overall dimensions, form factor, and weight. Any signing at shift in sensor size is likely going to result in compromises to weight, body size, better cooling and larger batteries. It’s easy for prospective owners to say yes to sensor size increases but are they prepared to accept the inevitable trade-offs? How many owners actually blow up their images to A2 or bigger? If you change some of the fundamentals does your competitive set change and can you still be successful? What does change cost Leica in terms of development, and the potential buyer in a market with shrinking volumes?

Where Leica can make a significant impact is in software and connectivity without significantly impacting the form factor of the CL. Some of us may not want or need this, but a generation for whom connectivity and frequent software updates are the norm, it becomes price of entry for future acceptance.

Edited by Le Chef
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My error:“I do think that at state of art a full frame could make a difference for a larger number of younger photographers “

instead of I do not think that....
sorry
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I would like to see evidence of more active planning for the CL line by Leica - particularly a lens roadmap.  While the existing range provides a lot of choice there are too many fixed focal length lenses missing to provide a full system line up, from w/a to telephoto.  e.g. a wide aperture portrait lenses, a longer telephoto than the zoom, etc.

Yes, FF L-mount lenses can be used but that compromises the size/weight/performance balance that is the attraction of the concept.

Are there going to be any more APS-C lenses from Leica?

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I do hope that any future L-mount lenses for APS-C, whether from Sigma or Leica, will be small in size, in keeping with the form factor of the CL itself and such lenses as the 18mm and 23mm.  I don't mind them being a little larger than those two lenses if they are fast lenses, but the L-mount lenses just announced by Sigma are way too large (I understand they are for full-frame cameras) and I have no interest in carrying around anything that big.  

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16 minutes ago, caigy said:

the L-mount lenses just announced by Sigma are way too large (I understand they are for full-frame cameras) and I have no interest in carrying around anything that big

The new Sigma 45/2.8 looks rather compact as an FF AF lens, even compared to Leica TL lenses. 64mm x 46mm, 215g according to this link: https://tinyurl.com/y3zsw5ap

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2 hours ago, caigy said:

I do hope that any future L-mount lenses for APS-C, whether from Sigma or Leica, will be small in size, in keeping with the form factor of the CL itself and such lenses as the 18mm and 23mm.  

Sigma have just announced their 16mm, 30mm and 56mm for the Cannon APS-C mirrorless camera and the L mount lenses are supposed to be the next. They are not tiny, but they are fast. 

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I'm sure the Sigma lens will mount on the CL. Whether it works well in all particulars will be seen once it is available for testing. It's only just been announced as yet, to the best of my knowledge.

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3 hours ago, pixeljohn22 said:

If I understand correctly the Sigma 45/2.8 will mount on the CL, correct? Is a firmware update required to do so? Thanks.

The whole point of the L mount alliance is mutual compatibility. lens firmware updates are usually automatic. 

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Yikes. Interesting convo. 

But I'll throw my two cents from the peanut gallery. You know what I want? 

Standardisation. It's what brought humanity into the 20th century. Can you imagine standard sensors that can be inter-changed when tech gets better? Software chips that can be swapped to accommodate more powerful software? Wouldn't it be interesting to have interchangeable components? Back in the old days of computers, the mainstream idea was interchangeable parts. Instead, they are one-ofs. Apple has led the way with this business model. Interchangeability is good for everyone and the environment except business revenue. Apple considers 4-5 year old machines as "vintage," no longer furnishing parts or service. Is that really the wave of the digital revolution? Waste, waste, and more waste in the name of profits. But I digress. 

I guess I'm not really into a disposable society, and it seems even a discussion of what the future of the CL basically means. It means a new version, after only two and a half years since it's introduction. It's why it took me a long time to invest in a digital camera - because I knew it would be obsolete after a few years. I'll bet everyone here still has film cameras that can produce excellent images.

/end rant. 

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Yes we are living an age where everything becomes obsolete very fast. 

But the point is not whether the CL should last ten years or not , but if the CL system is continuously feed. Lens, and all accessories can be still used in future versions or finishing as the 4/3 that Leica produced years ago?

The R system where the M solution is simply a makeshift solution as focusing on R camera is not the same in the visoflex for M. 

When a customer choose a Leica doesn’t choose a cheap one. Long lasting value is a paradigm in this kind of market as the M was and is. 

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