Summicron 28 and Summarit 35 on M8

[vlcek]

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Hey!

Right now i got the Zeiss ZM Biogon 25 and the Zeiss ZM C Biogon 35 on my M8. Has anybody tested the lenses named in the title compared to the ones i have? Would i gain anything in terms of "Leica look" or are they pretty much similar (not counting the differences in aperture)?

[vlcek]

BTW, i do have the 50 and 90 Summarit on the M8 and i like the output they produce very much. So i was wondering if i am missing anything for 28 and 35mm if i keep using Zeiss. You know, the nagging "Do i need other lenses?" feeling

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[a.noctilux]

If you don't try them out, you would never "see" 😉.

 

I came to Summarit-M lenses lately, and I love their outputs and handlings over their brighter sibblings Summicron/Summilux,

but in some situations larger aperture is a must.

I completed my first Summarit-M 2.5/50mm with two Summarit-M 2.5/35mm and 2.5/75mm.

They are so small and light that now I also prefer "new for me Elmarit-M 2.8/28mm asph." over my Summicron-M 2/28mm asph. that I use for years.

Summarit-M are also 6bit coded if this is important for your M8 use with UV/IR filter.

 

I can't comment Zeiss vs Leitz/Leica since I used Zeiss lenses on Contax and never have Zeiss on Leica.

The only thing that I can say is "they are different in their own way".

[Guest]

14 hours ago, a.noctilux said:

Summarit-M are also 6bit coded if this is important for your M8 use with UV/IR filter.

Could you explain more this part please? I don’t care about EXIF information, but am I missing important (a relative term in this context I know) image correction behaviour by not using coded lenses? How does it relate to UV/IR filter use also?

[a.noctilux]

When I used my M8, sometimes weird color rendering without UV/IR filter on lens.

Some more corrections ( I don't know which ) may compliment as there is one setting of lens detection "ON + UV/IR".

 

Anyway, most of time, I use M8 with IR pass filter (not UV/IR) so that setting or 6bit coded lens not relevant for my use.

 

M8, 640 ISO, IR filter on 35mm lens

 

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[farnz]

 

On 5/8/2019 at 1:58 PM, AndyGarton said:

Could you explain more this part please? I don’t care about EXIF information, but am I missing important (a relative term in this context I know) image correction behaviour by not using coded lenses? How does it relate to UV/IR filter use also?

The 6-bit coding is quite important for lenses shorter than 50 mm (ie 35, 28 etc) because the M8's Kodak KAF-10500 sensor has special off-set sensels (photodiodes) towards and at the edge of the sensor.  These are needed to balance the very angled rays that hit the sensor with wide angle lenses because of the very short "register" - the distance between the rear of the lens and the sensor (or film) - which for Leica rangefinder cameras is only 27.8 mm.

Without 6-bit coding turned on for wide angle lenses there can be noticeable vignetting and cyan/magenta discolouration in pictures because the M8 needs to know what lens is attached so that it can appropriately compensate for these aberrations.

Apart from EXIF, 6-bit coding is unimportant for lenses longer than 50 mm because the rays are much more perpendicular to the sensor and don't need compensation.

Pete.

Edited May 12, 2019 by farnz

[Guest]

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Thanks, that’s surprising. So a 35mm Voigtländer or Zeiss, or indeed an older non-coded Summicron, would be no good on an M8?

[Guest]

Similarly, newer lenses such as the Summarit 2.4 35mm, released (I think) since the last M8 firmware update was done - same problem there?

(I'm beginning to regret my recent M8 purchase, which I haven't received yet, so haven't had chance to shoot with - I only own CV and Zeiss lenses though 😞 )

[Graham (G4FUJ)]

I regularly use a 25mm Zeiss on my M8...

[vlcek]

vor 35 Minuten schrieb AndyGarton:

Similarly, newer lenses such as the Summarit 2.4 35mm, released (I think) since the last M8 firmware update was done - same problem there?

(I'm beginning to regret my recent M8 purchase, which I haven't received yet, so haven't had chance to shoot with - I only own CV and Zeiss lenses though 😞 )

My M8 (first version with latest firmware) does recognize my Summarit 50 F2.4

Other than that you can always write the correct lens name into the EXIF part of your photos and correct your files in post. Or code your lenses with a marker (will eventuall rub off) or something more permanent. So there is no need to regret your purchase, the M8 is an awesome camera. Really awesome.

[jankap]

vor 7 Stunden schrieb farnz:

 

The 6-bit coding is quite important for lenses shorter than 50 mm (ie 35, 28 etc) because the M8's Kodak KAF-10500 sensor has special off-set sensels (photodiodes) towards and at the edge of the sensor.  These are needed to balance the very angled rays that hit the sensor with wide angle lenses because of the very short "register" - the distance between the rear of the lens and the sensor (or film) - which for Leica rangefinder cameras is only 27.8 mm.

Without 6-bit coding turned on for wide angle lenses there can be noticeable vignetting and cyan/magenta discolouration in pictures because the M8 needs to know what lens is attached so that it can appropriately compensate for these aberrations.

Pete.

The M8 has a crop sensor (APS-H), so the corner problems could be not so severe. I don't have an M8.

Aren't there codes for the Biogons in the meantime?

[vlcek]

vor 2 Stunden schrieb jankap:

 

Aren't there codes for the Biogons in the meantime?

Nope but there are recommendations which Leica lens profile you should use for a Zeiss ZM lens. My main goal would be that the focal length is recorded into the exif. The rest can be fixed in post.

[farnz]

2 hours ago, jankap said:

The M8 has a crop sensor (APS-H), so the corner problems could be not so severe. I don't have an M8.

Aren't there codes for the Biogons in the meantime?

The short register distance means that the effects are still there although  a little less obvious than with the M9's full frame KAF-18500 sensor if 6-bit coding isn't activated.

Pete.

[farnz]

3 hours ago, AndyGarton said:

Thanks, that’s surprising. So a 35mm Voigtländer or Zeiss, or indeed an older non-coded Summicron, would be no good on an M8?

I wouldn't say "no good" 😮 but 6-bit coding them is advised.  There are a number of ways to do this and select the 6-bit code for a similar Leica lens so that the vignetting etc are minimised.  For example, the pits can be dremelled into the lens flange and filled with black or white paint accordingly, there are inexpensive pre-pitted lens flanges available on the online auction site that can be swapped for the lens flange on the lens, or there are 'temporary' marking systems using a template and a Sharpie felt pen.

Pete.