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Capture One and Leica Q2 crop mode


b_ben
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Hi,

For the first time, I'm considering getting a Leica, as the Q2 looks very tempting... However, I was worried that the crop modes would not work with Capture One, which is a bit of a deal breaker. So, before purchasing one, I wanted to make sure that this could be fixed and made a script to retrieve the crop factor and apply it in Capture One. 2 goods news:

  • It's possible! It works with a combination of Exiftool and Applescript (so, unfortunately, it doesn't work with the Windows version), and it integrates into the Capture One menus
  • I release it as open-source, so that others can use it if they face the same issue: https://github.com/bezineb5/c1-crop-from-exif

Now, I just have to wait until B&H gets some  Q2 in stock... unless I finally go for a Q.

I hope this will help some of you!

Ben

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What is the problem? Doesn't C1 have a cropping tool? The in-camera cropping mode is nothing more than a visualisation. You can get exactly the same effect by cropping in postprocessing. In fact, the last is most likely considerably better, as you can adjust the framing and composition more precisely and at leisure.

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The in-camera cropping mode also writes the crop mode into the EXIF. By using the script, you get the crop you used to frame the photo, without having to remember for each photo how you intended it to be. And it's non-destructive, as it uses the crop tool of Capture One. You can adjust afterwards to your wishes.

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8 hours ago, b_ben said:

The in-camera cropping mode also writes the crop mode into the EXIF. By using the script, you get the crop you used to frame the photo, without having to remember for each photo how you intended it to be. And it's non-destructive, as it uses the crop tool of Capture One. You can adjust afterwards to your wishes.

Thank's b_ben for this link. I will test, when i will have a Q2. Perhaps in 2020 !!  (ordered one month ago)

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10 hours ago, b_ben said:

The in-camera cropping mode also writes the crop mode into the EXIF. By using the script, you get the crop you used to frame the photo, without having to remember for each photo how you intended it to be. And it's non-destructive, as it uses the crop tool of Capture One. You can adjust afterwards to your wishes.

If I have to remember how I intended a photo to be when viewing it on the screen, it is most likely for the bin... I am not sure the crop factor is read from EXIF. It is more likely that the setting is taken from the sidecar .XMP file by the postprocessing program.

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@microview The purpose of this script is to have the same behaviour in Capture One than in Lightroom because Capture One always shows the full DNG. Steve Huff is right, as by default, Capture One does not use the crop mode.

The crop mode is stored in the EXIF metadata in the field SubIFD:DefaultUserCrop which seems proprietary: https://www.sno.phy.queensu.ca/~phil/exiftool/TagNames/EXIF.html - it is not stored by the camera in a sidecar file (which are most likely produced by Lightroom afterwards).

The difference between Lightroom and Capture One is that the latter just ignore this field. But there is no reason why Capture One users wouldn't want to have the same level of support of their camera than users of Lightroom!

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1 hour ago, leicamario said:

Why is Lightroom able to handle the crops and Capture One not?

Leica uses DNG, which is an Adobe standard. it works best, in some cases, with Adobe products. C1 is always problematic, as Leica and Phase don't communicate.

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8 minutes ago, leicamario said:

Ah, that sucks. Those Q2 DNGs work like a charm in lightroom.

They also work very well in Capture One, no worries about that! I will certainly not come back to Lightroom, now that the crop mode works. I just need to receive the Q2 ;)

It's really up to one's taste which RAW editor is the best.

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19 hours ago, jaapv said:

Leica uses DNG, which is an Adobe standard. it works best, in some cases, with Adobe products. C1 is always problematic, as Leica and Phase don't communicate.

generally speaking maybe..but i find SL dngs are nicer in C1 than in LR

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During the beta test of the Q2 I created 'crop presets' for the Q2 dngs for 35mm, 50mm and 75mm. So in C1 I just had to apply the style to a photo to have it cropped. Of course this is just a workaround and I have to remember which crop I used for the photo but it's better than nothing. 
Anybody who want's to have the styles can drop me a PN and I will send them.

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I think it is simply a matter of the RAW converter maker choosing to support it - assuming they are even aware of it. Leica puts the info into the DNG, but the RAW converter needs to know that it is there and make use of it. When I asked the RAW Power guy about it he said he wasn't aware that it existed.

If I ever move from LR I will certainly request that RAW converter maker support this since I find it quite useful. When I can't get closer to the subject it is nice to be able to use this for my framing and then tweak it in LR if necessary. Without this I would most probably forget what exactly it was that caught my eye or what I was trying to capture. I also find it great for portraits since it means that I don't end up getting the subject too close to the edge of the frame where the lens can start distorting.

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10 hours ago, iRandom said:

I think it is simply a matter of the RAW converter maker choosing to support it - assuming they are even aware of it. Leica puts the info into the DNG, but the RAW converter needs to know that it is there and make use of it. When I asked the RAW Power guy about it he said he wasn't aware that it existed.

If I ever move from LR I will certainly request that RAW converter maker support this since I find it quite useful. When I can't get closer to the subject it is nice to be able to use this for my framing and then tweak it in LR if necessary. Without this I would most probably forget what exactly it was that caught my eye or what I was trying to capture. I also find it great for portraits since it means that I don't end up getting the subject too close to the edge of the frame where the lens can start distorting.

Yes, I can imagine it's a lot of work for RAW converter developers to follow all cameras... That would be a very nice move if all cameras were to produce DNG. But apparently, even with DNG,  differences remain. That also raises the question of long-term support for RAW files. In 20 years, will there be any way to open them with the proper support?

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Undoubtedly. Not only is this an open standard format, these concerns have (often) been expressed before - and debunked. When a format becomes obsolete, there will always be programs to translate the data to newer and current formats.

Furthermore, DNG has been specifically developed to avoid this problem. It is closely related to TIFF.

 

https://petapixel.com/2015/12/08/dng-the-pros-cons-and-myths-of-the-adobe-raw-file-format/

http://www.barrypearson.co.uk/articles/dng/index.htm

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I never use the crop either in the Q or now my Q2.  Agree with Jaapv that making the decision at home on the monitor is best instead of some digital crop.  My view is what if I want 40mm instead of 35mm, I can decide that in post. I crop about 80% of my Q images at home.

 

I use C1.

Edited by algrove
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