Thought processes of others from someone who has owned both an M and a Q and wants back into the Leica world

[fotografr]

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3 hours ago, analog-digital said:

I have 2 M8's. On one I have NO IR/UV filter. And it works................. No black irritation color problem. I think media (internet) pushing this "problem" to an high level.....

My personal experience and that of many, many other M8 users on this forum was very different. We all saw the blacks rendered as magenta with our own eyes and Leica readily acknowledged the problem by going so far as to provide M8 purchasers with two free IR/UV filters. I doubt they'd have done that if the issue was just internet hype.

You say you have two M8s and that one has no IR/UV filter. The filters go on the lenses, not the cameras. Are we on the same page here?

 

Edited April 17, 2019 by fotografr

[analog-digital]

@fotografr

Filter in the lens of corse 

The magenta "problem" is NOT a general black-out problem. Only certain materials (clothes, fabrics) are not properly dotted. But how many times is this the case? And if, LR can change that and a UV / IR filter too. Many users have so much a "protective filter" in front of the lens.

So, where is the problem now?

Edited April 17, 2019 by analog-digital

[fotografr]

13 minutes ago, analog-digital said:

@fotografr

The magenta "problem" is NOT a general black-out problem. Only certain materials (clothes, fabrics) are not properly dotted. But how many times is this the case? And if, LR can change that and a UV / IR filter too. Many users have so much a "protective filter" in front of the lens.

So, where is the problem now?

Sure, you can get rid of the magenta cast in Lightroom. But that's time consuming and also changes other colors. And so what if it's only a problem with certain materials? Who's to say when it's going to happen and wreck your shot?

At any rate, it's no problem for me because I no longer use M8s. But don't give bad advice to someone about a real issue. There is even a current discussion on the M8 part of this forum about Leica still offering two free filters. Anyone buying a M8 should have this information as part of their decision and for someone to say the problem doesn't exist when it clearly does is a disservice.

That's where the problem is now.

Incidentally, the price for a UV/IR cut filter is substantially higher than for a standard UV filter. I don't think too many people would put them on their lenses unnecessarily.

Edited April 17, 2019 by fotografr

[analog-digital]

vor 6 Minuten schrieb fotografr:

Sure, you can get rid of the magenta cast in Lightroom. But that's time consuming and also changes other colors. And so what if it's only a problem with certain materials? Who's to say when it's going to happen and wreck your shot?

At any rate, it's no problem for me because I no longer use M8s. But don't give bad advice to someone about a real issue. There is even a current discussion on the M8 part of this forum about Leica still offering two free filters. Anyone buying a M8 should have this information as part of their decision and for someone to say the problem doesn't exist when it clearly does is a disservice.

That's where the problem is now.

Incidentally, the price for a UV/IR cut filter is substantially higher than for a standard UV filter. I don't think too many people would put them on their lenses unnecessarily.

Sorry, if you can afford a M8, as well as the $ 40.- for the filter!

I do not give bad advice for a real problem. There is a solution and one should mention that. The M8 is still a terrific camera and impresses with a very good price / performance ratio. Since none of the new Leica Digitalen can keep up. Because you really do not make better photos.

[fotografr]

This all started with you suggesting the "problem" was just internet hype. Now you at least agree the problem exists. I'm not disagreeing with you that the M8 is a good camera, but anyone considering buying one should have accurate information about it.

When I bought my first M8, I paid over $600 to put IR/UV filters on all my lenses. Whether I could afford it or not is beside the point.

Maybe you can buy a single Hoya filter for $40, but who's going to stick something like that on a Leica lens they paid thousands for?  Try pricing a Leica filter.

Now, since the OP never even expressed an interest in the M8, why don't we drop this and stop boring everybody?

[analog-digital]

Sorry to say I pay'd $ 25 to 30.- for each LEICA filter and I had in total 8 (different diameter)! OK now?

 

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

 

 

And I do not bore anyone. I wrote in my first post: If you like/love the basics go for a much cheaper M8.

The rest came from you. Sorry!

 

Edited April 17, 2019 by analog-digital

[fotografr]

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29 minutes ago, analog-digital said:

Sorry to say I pay'd $ 25 to 30.- for each LEICA filter and I had in total 8 (different diameter)! OK now?

 

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

 

 

And I do not bore anyone. I wrote in my first post: If you like/love the basics go for a much cheaper M8.

The rest came from you. Sorry!

 

https://www.leicacamerausa.com/photography/lens-filters/page2.htmlI

I call BS. Sorry.

 

Edited April 17, 2019 by fotografr

[fotografr]

37 minutes ago, analog-digital said:

Sorry to say I pay'd $ 25 to 30.- for each LEICA filter and I had in total 8 (different diameter)! OK now?

 

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

 

 

And I do not bore anyone. I wrote in my first post: If you like/love the basics go for a much cheaper M8.

The rest came from you. Sorry!

 

Anyone who is interested can read what you said for themselves. Bye now.

Edited April 17, 2019 by fotografr

[analog-digital]

Only your last post I really do not understand, not even what you actually want .....

I only mentioned once (1x) that the M8 is a good alternative (first post). Then came your objections. And the filters do not cost hundreds of dollars, that's simply not true. I bought my filters 2 years ago from the Leica dealer and ebay. But let's leave that aside, it does not help, except that the M8 is a good camera. And I can judge that, believe me. I do not just have one or two cameras.

[fotografr]

5 minutes ago, analog-digital said:

Only your last post I really do not understand, not even what you actually want .....

I only mentioned once (1x) that the M8 is a good alternative (first post). Then came your objections. And the filters do not cost hundreds of dollars, that's simply not true. I bought my filters 2 years ago from the Leica dealer and ebay. But let's leave that aside, it does not help, except that the M8 is a good camera. And I can judge that, believe me. I do not just have one or two cameras.

You recommended the M8. I replied by stating some issues, one of which was the need to use the UV/IR filters. You then responded by saying the problem didn't exist, which is incorrect. That's all this was about. Now I'm totally done with this topic.

[analog-digital]

The problem exists, you know, you can google it.

And now it comes:
But it's only a problem in very few cases. Without filter. So mount a filter and it's good. What do you want? Filters have many mounted, so what's the ongoing bashing?

[fotografr]

6 hours ago, analog-digital said:

I have 2 M8's. On one I have NO IR/UV filter. And it works................. No black irritation color problem. I think media (internet) pushing this "problem" to an high level.....

Your own words, my friend.

Just out of curiosity, if the problem doesn't exist, why do you have all those filters?

I am not bashing. Just setting the record straight.

Edited April 17, 2019 by fotografr

[analog-digital]

OK my friend. My native language is NOT English, maybe Google did not translate so accurately. So synonymous with the M8 WITHOUT UV / IR filter with me this "Magenta problem" has not occurred. Why? Because it only happens in very rare cases (if at all). Is that so hard to understand and understand?

[fotografr]

23 minutes ago, analog-digital said:

OK my friend. My native language is NOT English, maybe Google did not translate so accurately. So synonymous with the M8 WITHOUT UV / IR filter with me this "Magenta problem" has not occurred. Why? Because it only happens in very rare cases (if at all). Is that so hard to understand and understand?

What I don't understand is if you think the problem is so rare, why do you bother with the filters? I was an early M8 purchaser and before I got the filters I had numerous incidents of magenta cast in what should have been black material. So did many others. If you doubt that, simply do a search and you'll find hundreds of comments about it on this forum. The fact that it hasn't happened to you does not mean the problem is non-existent. You are trying to generalize from only your experience. Do some research. The only thing that's hard for me to understand is why you keep trying to deny something that so clearly exists. It's almost as if you take it as a personal insult that someone chooses to discuss a fault with your beloved camera.

Edited April 17, 2019 by fotografr

[analog-digital]

vor 1 Minute schrieb fotografr:

Do some research...

.... and the solution is or are the filters. 

You seem to be a very complicated person who turns every word in your mouth. Stop it, it's no use, you do not want or understand me and / or just look for trouble. Pity in the Leica Forum!

End of discussion

[fotografr]

2 minutes ago, analog-digital said:

 

End of discussion

Finally.

Edited April 17, 2019 by fotografr

[Paulus]

vor 12 Stunden schrieb analog-digital:

OK my friend. My native language is NOT English, maybe Google did not translate so accurately. So synonymous with the M8 WITHOUT UV / IR filter with me this "Magenta problem" has not occurred. Why? Because it only happens in very rare cases (if at all). Is that so hard to understand and understand?

You were/are  lucky.

 

When I was trying the M8 before I bought it , ( one of the first in the market at the time, the time everyone had sold their Leica Lenses cheap, because most of us did not believe Leica would come with aa digital answer ) Foto Talens , gave me an M8 out of the box, to try in the streets before I decided to buy it. I walked the big Square and visited the church standing there and to shots of the tourist inside, after half an hour the shopkeeper came seaching for me and found me in the church. He was a little anxious that I would not come back with his first and only M8 in The Netherlands at that time and was relieved to see me.  

When I watched the captures later that day, I saw that all the captures I made, had a magenta cast, taking the pictures of a young woman who was wearing a black sweater. Because I also took pictures that day with my Nikon D700 I could see the difference. No magenta in those pictures. 

That was the start of the internet discussion about the magenta problem, and yes, to me it was a problem because getting the magenta out of the sweater gave the girl a rather strange colorcast on her face. Maybe it was my lack of knowledge , maybe Lightroom was not so advanced in that time, but the problem was too big to buy the M8 to me. After the UV/IR issue, everybody got two for free and I bought two more ( spend € 200,- in total for them ) I felt reassured that the problem was solved and I enjoyed the M8 for as long as the M9 appeared. The choice for the M9 was only because it had full frame. The m8 was a wonderful camera ( and the M8.2 was marvelous!! ) and the enlargements I still have hanging in my rooms of 40 by 50 are stunning. Especially in black and white. 

Nowadays I would not spent money on the M8 because I think the alternative in the M10 is  better.

I just stopped using the UV/IR filters. I did use them on the M240 because I still had them. On the M10, I noticed chromatic abberation in the very small details so I stopped using them. I put them in the " new " Leica boxes, I always store in a dry/ dark place , so I can sell them for about € 25,- . I think most of use old M8 users have done this. The market is flushed with " new in the box " UV/IR filters and Leica still has some in stock, which they hardly sell, but price for the original prices + the percentage they up  their prices every now and then. 

 

 

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Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Edited April 18, 2019 by Paulus

[Paulus]

Sorry, wrong ( b&w) box in the picture, we want to make it scientifically right...

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[silverchrome]

It isn't just blacks either, foliage goes all yellowy as well.

I don't use my M8 without UVIR filters: they're pretty much a necessity if you want accurate colours from an M8.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[pamelamcguire]

On 4/16/2019 at 9:37 PM, robodocx said:

I just wanted to say how much I appreciate everyone's thoughtful input on this question. It has been very enlightening. After reading the posts here and some soul searching, I decided to bite the bullet, cancel my Q2 order and order a preowned M10. Looking forward to getting the camera and going back to the deliberate photo style that I so enjoyed with my M240. 

I just did the same today.  I've had a Q and traded it in for a Q2 (still on the wait list).  Processing about 1,000 photos from Vietnam and Cambodia in Capture One, I realized how much I dislike the distortion of the 28mm Q lens.  It's a great camera, don't get me wrong, but I really prefer to shoot with a 35mm or 50mm.  I have zero experience with a RF, but have been assured by the dealer (Camera West) that I'll get the hang of it.  The more deliberative, thoughtful approach to photography is appealing.