Color Skopar 28mm f/3.5 (LTM) ... lens code?

[ramarren]

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I've found that the Voigtländer Color Skopar 28mm f/3.5 (LTM) works very nicely with the Summaron-M 28mm f/5.6 lens profile on my CL. The LTM to M-mount adapter I'm using on it has the recess area for painting in the Leica six-bit code, but I can't seem to find this code in the on-line listings. 

Does anyone happen to know what it is, or have one of the Summaron-M 28mm lenses available to take a picture of so I can see how to code it? I saw one older post with a picture of the code, but so far my attempts to code it that way have resulted only in an "Unknown Lens" on the CL. 

Thanks in advance!

[NigelG]

+1

Just picked up a nice black paint copy (having regretted selling my chrome version when I got a summicron....) 

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Just seen on e**y:

 

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[ramarren]

Thanks! Yes, that's the pattern I have. I probably screwed up the placement ... will try again.

 

[ramarren]

2 hours ago, NigelG said:

+1

Just picked up a nice black paint copy (having regretted selling my chrome version when I got a summicron....) 

I bought this black one new in 2012. It's my favorite Color Skopar, have had nearly all of them.

[NigelG]

I’m trying to chase up the right 28/90 adapter. I had a voigtlander original one before that worked well but the generic one Aperture London had left the lens mounted on an angle.....

The voigtlander ones no longer seem to be available even on e**y in the uk

 

Edited February 26, 2019 by NigelG

[ramarren]

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Look for a Raqual or a Kipon LTM to M-Mount adapter for 28-90. I think I saw one on the 'bay UK site for about £30 or something like that. They both have the right flange setup and space for coding. CameraQuest.com also carries the Rayqual adapters in the USA; I'm sure Steve would mail order to you at a reasonable price. 

https://www.cameraquest.com/adaptltm.htm

Edited February 26, 2019 by ramarren

[Jim-St]

23 hours ago, ramarren said:

I've found that the Voigtländer Color Skopar 28mm f/3.5 (LTM) works very nicely with the Summaron-M 28mm f/5.6 lens profile on my CL.

Can I ask what advantage you see in coding this lens for use on the CL? My experience has been that I've seen really none of the odd artefacts (Italian flag etc) I saw on my M8 and M9 when using uncoded (and sometimes even coded) Voigtlanders. It's one of the main reasons I'm so pleased with CL - it's given a whole new lease of life to several lenses I hardly used on the digital M's as rectifying the images was a bit of a pita.

Also I'm bearing in mind Sean Reid's strictures about in-camera distortion corrections, though I'm  a bit agnostic as to the threat these pose.

So I've set up a User Profile for "M uncoded" with lens recognition switched off and find it works just fine.

What are you gaining from coding the Skopar as a specific Leica 28mm? Any old 28mm coding will give the exif record of lens used. So I'm puzzled what you're getting from the coding...

Jim

[ramarren]

When I make exposures with the Color Skopar using my M4-2, crop to a centered APS-C image, and compare them with what I see out of the CL, they match better when I use the Summaron-M 28mm f/5.6 lens profile. That's all. I've tried the other 24, 28, and 35 mm profiles, and none; this Summaron profile works best with this lens IMO. 

I don't read Sean Reid.

G

 

[Jim-St]

6 hours ago, ramarren said:

When I make exposures with the Color Skopar using my M4-2, crop to a centered APS-C image, and compare them with what I see out of the CL, they match better when I use the Summaron-M 28mm f/5.6 lens profile. That's all. I've tried the other 24, 28, and 35 mm profiles, and none; this Summaron profile works best with this lens IMO. 

G

I admire the rigour of your working, but I’m confused by one detail: does this not imply you would need a different lens profile if you changed the film stock in your M4-2?

6 hours ago, ramarren said:

I don't read Sean Reid.

G

My Reid subscription expired last month. I don’t plan to rejoin for now 🧐

 

Jim 

[ramarren]

15 hours ago, Jim-St said:

I admire the rigour of your working, but I’m confused by one detail: does this not imply you would need a different lens profile if you changed the film stock in your M4-2?

I don't know that the film in use can change the optical properties of a lens.  

Lens profiles in Leica cameras adjust the rendering qualities of the lens in its interaction with a particular sensor assembly, which is a wholly different—and far more complex—optical system compared to film. With a film camera, the lens's optical properties simply are what they are; with a digital camera, what the lens images is further modified by what the sensor's optical system does to it.

The intent of Leica lens profiles is to make their lenses image as per their original intent and performance on whatever recording medium, in all their cameras. They're not really designed for third party lenses at all, but since the lens profiles make modifications to correct sensor interaction issues that arise out of an optical design match or mismatch with the sensor in use, if you can find a pairing that works well, you should use it. 

[ramarren]

Oh yes: I was reminded by a post in another thread...

A secondary consideration on the CL is that if you do not have a lens profile chosen with an uncoded lens, AutoISO (although you can select it with the ISO control) does not function. So to get as much functionality as the camera can offer with your uncoded lenses, it's a darn good idea to find and use as good a lens profile as you can manage. 

[Jim-St]

16 hours ago, ramarren said:

I don't know that the film in use can change the optical properties of a lens.  

Lens profiles in Leica cameras adjust the rendering qualities of the lens in its interaction with a particular sensor assembly, which is a wholly different—and far more complex—optical system compared to film. With a film camera, the lens's optical properties simply are what they are; with a digital camera, what the lens images is further modified by what the sensor's optical system does to it.

The intent of Leica lens profiles is to make their lenses image as per their original intent and performance on whatever recording medium, in all their cameras. They're not really designed for third party lenses at all, but since the lens profiles make modifications to correct sensor interaction issues that arise out of an optical design match or mismatch with the sensor in use, if you can find a pairing that works well, you should use it. 

You're right, of course. I guess I've always come at it that coding was to sort out the weird colour stuff (Italian flags, cyan drift etc) that the M8 and the M9 sensors produced, especially with wider-than-35mm lenses, and that when trying to use CV and Zeiss lenses one needed to find the Leica lens profile that best functioned to ameliorate matters. To me this was what was really needed from coding,  and for some years now Lightroom has allowed use of its lens profiles - developed from real-world use of CV and Zeiss (and Leica) lenses - to correct  distortions (barrel, pin-cushion, moustache etc) as and when needed. Like when you want to shoot a brick wall, rather than a cat, to post on some photo forum somewhere, or whatever 

 

2 hours ago, ramarren said:

Oh yes: I was reminded by a post in another thread...

A secondary consideration on the CL is that if you do not have a lens profile chosen with an uncoded lens, AutoISO (although you can select it with the ISO control) does not function. So to get as much functionality as the camera can offer with your uncoded lenses, it's a darn good idea to find and use as good a lens profile as you can manage. 

This I think is only true with reference to use of Auto ISO Settings for minimum shutter speeds expressed as reciprocal of lens focal length. In that case Auto ISO cannot work as the camera has no value of f to compute a shutter speed from. If you set minimum shutter speed of a fraction of a second, though, Auto ISO seems to work just fine on my camera (and I usually have this set at 1/30 as I find it hard to handhold the CL below that figure)

Overall though, I'm impressed by your reasoning on this topic, and I may well try the coding you suggest for my CV 28mm f3.5. It's currently got a Milich codable adapter on it, coded as a Elmarit-M 28mm f/2.8 (III), so it will just need one smudge of a black Sharpie to turn it into a Summaron... But I wonder what I'll gain from this that the LR lens profile for the Skopar doesn't provide??? 

Jim

[ramarren]

19 hours ago, Jim-St said:

This I think is only true with reference to use of Auto ISO Settings for minimum shutter speeds expressed as reciprocal of lens focal length. In that case Auto ISO cannot work as the camera has no value of f to compute a shutter speed from. If you set minimum shutter speed of a fraction of a second, though, Auto ISO seems to work just fine on my camera (and I usually have this set at 1/30 as I find it hard to handhold the CL below that figure)

Overall though, I'm impressed by your reasoning on this topic, and I may well try the coding you suggest for my CV 28mm f3.5. It's currently got a Milich codable adapter on it, coded as a Elmarit-M 28mm f/2.8 (III), so it will just need one smudge of a black Sharpie to turn it into a Summaron... But I wonder what I'll gain from this that the LR lens profile for the Skopar doesn't provide??? 

 

Thank you for the compliments...

Regards to AutoISO: That's a good point, I'd overlooked that you can set a hard AutoISO exposure time limit. I'll test it on my camera... yes, you are correct. thx! That will add some versatility to a couple of lenses' use I haven't bothered to code.

Regards to the LR profiles: Sometimes they produce results I like, other times not. They produce rather different rendering from the Leica lens profiles when compared against the Leica lenses and lens profiles. Since application of any Leica lens profile to a third party lens is a "best fit adaptation" at best, just use whichever one produces the end result you want.