Leica SL not worth the investment, really bad service

[metedme]

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I have had hell with Leica, claiming impact damage, no warranty repair. In fact they described the damage as huge so I will attach the photos. Be warned what you are about to see will shock you. 

To cut a very long story short, every piece of SL gear has failed, SL body, 16-35mm SL, 24-90mm SL, that was $24,000 from new. The repairs take 3 months at best and 5 months plus if you dispute the Germans, because they are never wrong, all I can see from reading around the inter web is Im not alone. Im writing this post to warn others to not buy SL gear if you are professional , everything in the SL line needs to go to Germany and they clearly have a policy of blaming the customer, the sensor is out of tolerance, warranty is therefore void, it must have been dropped.

I'm not one to accept BS and I have no issues publicising my situation. If I can save anyone from my experience its worth it. Leica Germany are not willing to move on this so I have to take legal action, this is how they treat there customers !!!!!

Anyone else had this experience please get in touch 

 

 

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[ajmarton1]

Yeah, I had ONE nick but that was not my problem.  I used the SL in drizzle in Bali and the moisture got to the 24-90mm lens and the EVF.  So much for being weather proof. Sent it to NJ and they determined it needed to go to Germany.  I was told there was some impact damage on the body's lens mount which I think is BS as my Leica gear is extremely well taken packed when I travel.  But I really had no choice - what are you supposed to do?  I fixed it.  But I strongly believe the SL should have survived the moisture.  So I got it repaired at my cost and sold it all.  I had already sold the 50mm 1.4 because it performed terribly in India in low or complex lighting.  The 24-90 and 90-280 were fine but not great.  Also had the 75mm and sold it too when I decided to dump the SL.  I still own and love the RF Leicas - I have the Mono 246, M10-P and Q and a bunch of the film bodies. But the SL was a so-so experience.  I bought the Nikon D850 with all the top 1.4g lenses and straight 2.8 zooms.  I am very impressed with the Nikon.  Taking it to So. Africa for a safari, then Japan. So we shall see how it performs.  But playing around with it at home indicates all will be very good.  I hope the SL2 is better with more lens options.  I also had the M adapter but why compromise on AF to get the lens you want to use.  With Nikon and Canon each coming out with mirrorless full frame bodies, Leica better step up its game on the SL.  

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[metedme]

Thanks for your reply, I love the R series, excellent lenses and well priced, I also like the M (not as well priced), I own the M240, the camera is so rugged, so durable and it bought off eBay 2nd hand, never missed a beat, never again will I deal with Leica directly.

Leica market the SL as weather resistant, and capable of professional use, the real world performance falls well short. Ive used my SL in the rain simply because they market it as capable of such conditions, and now thats their second angle of attack on me, they found corrosion under the hotshoe, again cover your eyes, its a horror story (lol). This is BS on another level, talk about hype.

 

 

 

 

hotshoe

Edited February 17, 2019 by jaapv
libel removed

[Ingo]

'Impact damage' (beside other) seems to be a standard phrase on Leicas cost estimates. 
In 2017 I sent them a recently bought 'mint condition' SL body to adjust the spirit level. The feedback was: 

General device status
            strong signs of wear
            Clean sensor
            Housing damaged
            Bayonet ring scratches
            Housing scratches
            impact damage

Replace sleeve
Adjust sensor position
Clean sensor
Firmware Update
Cleaning the eyepiece

Again: This body was two weeks old and never used outdoor. 
I have no idea what this BS is about.

[thighslapper]

2 hours ago, Ingo said:

'Impact damage' (beside other) seems to be a standard phrase on Leicas cost estimates. 
In 2017 I sent them a recently bought 'mint condition' SL body to adjust the spirit level. The feedback was: 

General device status
            strong signs of wear
            Clean sensor
            Housing damaged
            Bayonet ring scratches
            Housing scratches
            impact damage

Replace sleeve
Adjust sensor position
Clean sensor
Firmware Update
Cleaning the eyepiece

Again: This body was two weeks old and never used outdoor. 
I have no idea what this BS is about.

Noted here as well ..... but it did not seem to prevent the items I have sent for adjustment/checking being done under warranty where it was still valid.

The last few times I took plenty of photos of the item being returned in case they behaved like a Car Rental Company ...... 

Luckily with SL and TL gear (touch wood) I have not had the issues that plagued my various M9/M240's and M lenses...... even though most bits (after 3yrs+) have genuine impact damage and scuffs of varying degrees. 

Edited February 15, 2019 by thighslapper

[Rupert Greenwell]

I had only had my new SL for a short time when the top left hand side button on the back ceased to function, I returned the body to the dealer and they sent it to Germany, a few weeks later I received a brand new body as a replacement.

Naturally I was pleased with this but had the SL been out of warranty I could have been in for a expensive and time consuming repair. 

[Ivar B]

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This is unfortunate, of course, but I don`t think your experience is universally applicable. My SL has never been to Wetzlar for servicing, but my last experience was a Summicron-M 2.0/28mm which despite careful use started rattling. It was several years out of warranty, but repaired free of charge with no questions. 

[Chaemono]

On 2/15/2019 at 2:28 AM, metedme said:

To cut a very long story short, every piece of SL gear has failed, SL body, 16-35mm SL, 24-90mm SL,...

You shouldn't have waited so long to share your experience with the community here.

 

 

 

[wildlightphoto]

This kind of "service" was the final nail in the coffin for my 35-year association with Leica Camera Inc.

I had been considering the SL + 90-280 APO, even making up bizarre usage scenarios in my mind that wouldn't be tripped up by the inadequate 24MP resolution and sluggish OS until Leica finally returned my 280 R APO not only un-repaired but also with additional damage after 8 months in Germany and no explanation other than 'parts not available'.  (The lens was subsequently repaired by DAG: parts required?  three screws.)

Knowing what kind of performance to expect from Leica APO lenses, there's still a temptation to buy back into the SL system but then I remember Leica's service.  I don't need that kind of abuse.

[Agent M10]

7 minutes ago, wildlightphoto said:

This kind of "service" was the final nail in the coffin for my 35-year association with Leica Camera Inc.

I had been considering the SL + 90-280 APO, even making up bizarre usage scenarios in my mind that wouldn't be tripped up by the inadequate 24MP resolution and sluggish OS until Leica finally returned my 280 R APO not only un-repaired but also with additional damage after 8 months in Germany and no explanation other than 'parts not available'.  (The lens was subsequently repaired by DAG: parts required?  three screws.)

Knowing what kind of performance to expect from Leica APO lenses, there's still a temptation to buy back into the SL system but then I remember Leica's service.  I don't need that kind of abuse.

My S007 sustained water damage from some rain on a trip. Leica examined it and arrived at the opinion that I somehow had dumped it in some water or something. Never happened. Anyway, Leica NJ did what it could to have it repaired under warranty. "No," was the answer. So I reluctantly paid the bill and thought I'd move on to another system. Since then Leica has been great, repairing all my S lenses without any problems. I recently bought an SL and will be buying the 75mm and 50mm Summicrons. They've got their way of doing things. Not a big deal in the big picture. 

[wildlightphoto]

11 minutes ago, Agent M10 said:

My S007 sustained water damage from some rain on a trip. Leica examined it and arrived at the opinion that I somehow had dumped it in some water or something. Never happened. Anyway, Leica NJ did what it could to have it repaired under warranty. "No," was the answer. So I reluctantly paid the bill and thought I'd move on to another system. Since then Leica has been great, repairing all my S lenses without any problems. I recently bought an SL and will be buying the 75mm and 50mm Summicrons. They've got their way of doing things. Not a big deal in the big picture. 

Perhaps 25% downtime isn't a big deal to you but it is to me.  25% downtime to me means buying a duplicate backup camera (body and lens) so that I have a camera available when I want it.  For comparison the downtime on my Sony system has been 0% despite the Internet Forum Wisdom that the Sony is a 'fragile' body with 'unreliable' sensor stabilization.

[LUF Admin]

We'll forward this case (or these cases) next week to Leica HQ.

Please give us some days.

Andreas

[Agent M10]

31 minutes ago, wildlightphoto said:

Perhaps 25% downtime isn't a big deal to you but it is to me.  25% downtime to me means buying a duplicate backup camera (body and lens) so that I have a camera available when I want it.  For comparison the downtime on my Sony system has been 0% despite the Internet Forum Wisdom that the Sony is a 'fragile' body with 'unreliable' sensor stabilization.

No, downtime is a big deal to me, too. As you put it, you could buy a backup body (many do) or move to another camera maker. Sounds like you did. The point is, if you're happy with your Sony then why even look back at Leica? A camera or lens failing or even a bad service call is not all that big a deal in the overall scheme of things. 

Edited February 17, 2019 by Agent M10

[wildlightphoto]

38 minutes ago, Agent M10 said:

... if you're happy with your Sony then why even look back at Leica? A camera or lens failing or even a bad service call is not all that big a deal in the overall scheme of things. 

Why look back at Leica?  It's simple: APO lenses.  Leica's APO lenses are spectacular.  The Sony FE 100-400 GM is quite good but its performance isn't the breathtaking, heart-stopping optical performance of a Leica APO lens. The R 280/4 APO has left a deep impression in my mind that I can't erase.

A camera or lens failing isn't that big a deal.  The camera or lens failing multiple times with the same problem and the service department failing to correct the problem multiple times after each failure is a big deal.  My R8/DMR in one year racked up enough frequent flier miles between Sacramento and New Jersey to take a very nice vacation, and this was for one problem that was not repaired multiple times.  Leica's service has left an impression in my mind as indelible as that of the 280/4 APO.

[Agent M10]

5 minutes ago, wildlightphoto said:

Why look back at Leica?  It's simple: APO lenses.  Leica's APO lenses are spectacular.  The Sony FE 100-400 GM is quite good but its performance isn't the breathtaking, heart-stopping optical performance of a Leica APO lens. The R 280/4 APO has left a deep impression in my mind that I can't erase.

Well, there you have it.

[metedme]

On 2/16/2019 at 10:03 PM, Ivar B said:

This is unfortunate, of course, but I don`t think your experience is universally applicable. My SL has never been to Wetzlar for servicing, but my last experience was a Summicron-M 2.0/28mm which despite careful use started rattling. It was several years out of warranty, but repaired free of charge with no questions. 

I own M240 and 5 M lenses and never had an issue, but the feedback from SL gear is really a worry. Of course complaints generate 10x the publicity of good service but too many instances like this. 

[IkarusJohn]

Hadn't noticed any feedback about the SL that I would think is a worry.  I had one of the first SLs, and it did lock up on me.  The dealer lent me their demo model, and my camera was replaced immediately one could be delivered to me from Germany.

Haven't had a single problem since, and the firmware upgrades have been real upgrades - I'm a very happy SL user, but then one swallow doesn't make summer ...

[metedme]

11 hours ago, Chaemono said:

You shouldn't have waited so long to share your experience with the community here

 

It's not just them. It's the whole country.

Long story in a short time frame, up until Friday we were trying to work things out.

[metedme]

17 minutes ago, IkarusJohn said:

Hadn't noticed any feedback about the SL that I would think is a worry.  I had one of the first SLs, and it did lock up on me.  The dealer lent me their demo model, and my camera was replaced immediately one could be delivered to me from Germany.

Haven't had a single problem since, and the firmware upgrades have been real upgrades - I'm a very happy SL user, but then one swallow doesn't make summer ...

Could you reset the camera or was it stuck ? 

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[metedme]

On 2/15/2019 at 6:12 PM, Ingo said:

'Impact damage' (beside other) seems to be a standard phrase on Leicas cost estimates. 
In 2017 I sent them a recently bought 'mint condition' SL body to adjust the spirit level. The feedback was: 

General device status
            strong signs of wear
            Clean sensor
            Housing damaged
            Bayonet ring scratches
            Housing scratches
            impact damage

Replace sleeve
Adjust sensor position
Clean sensor
Firmware Update
Cleaning the eyepiece

Again: This body was two weeks old and never used outdoor. 
I have no idea what this BS is about.

OMG it sounds like the script I got