Do you assume a certain level of knowledge of a Leica shooter?

[ianman]

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13 hours ago, sblutter said:

We were on a 3hr walking trip in Madrid - one guy also had an M240, his was fitted with the 2.0 90 - a big heavy lens.  I was using my fav walking lenses; 50 Elmarit-M (collapsible) & and the pancake Voight 35 2.5.

I'm been an M shooter for 50 yrs - was a pro for yrs, a lot of them as an architectural view camera on location guy, have had shows etc.

In 3 hours, the 90 guy never even looked through the VF'r

Maybe nothing interested him...

I really don't get your point!?

[RayD28]

I don't have much more to offer than what has already been said, but after many years away from photography and having never owned a digital camera, I bought a Nikon body and a 50mm lens (in exchange for the slow kit lens).  This was five years ago.  Spent days figuring out the functions and taking test shots.  I thought a nice zoom would come in handy and started researching lenses and determined that I paid over $1,200 for a cropped sensor camera!  Nothing wrong with cropped sensors but I exchanged it for a camera with a full sensor.  I had no idea to even ask about sensor size, and I bet the salesman didn't think to mention it because cropped sensors are so common.

As far as my own Leica journey, my first camera was an Olympus OM-2 bought in 1977 that had a split screen patch so I understood the basics of RF focusing.  After that, everything I know about Leica RF technique and film developing I learned from this forum's patient and generous members.  

Something along the same topic, I restarted learning to play guitar in my early 40s and I bought an acoustic Fender for $300.  I progressed to playing some favorite songs and decided to upgrade to a nicer guitar and bought a Martin D-28.  I and others immediately noticed the overwhelmingly better sound of my playing and I could not have been happier.   Did my ability improve immediately?  Nope, but my enthusiasm did and I played more often and became marginally better.  Has my Leica improved my photo skills?  Probably not much (the proof are my humble photo posts on this board) but my enthusiasm has grown.  

I tried golfing and hated it because I played so badly.  I have friends that were just as bad and they laid out hundreds of dollars for Ping golf clubs.  I thought it funny at the time but I get it now.  Life is short so if an M is affordable, why not?  

Finally, and this might have already been mentioned, my M240 displays the ISO in red in the viewfinder when I turn on the camera so it seems reasonable to ask a salesperson what the number represents.  The number of shots available to shoot given the SD card size?  Shutter speed?  ISO?  If there are any questions to ask, it seems the salesman is the exact person to ask.  

Edited January 1, 2019 by RayD28

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[Paulus]

The strange thing is, that if an instrument is really expensive, some people just don't want to touch it even tough it  it will play much lighter, precise or "better" in a non descriptive way.

If you have the opportunity to use a great instrument, it's never wasted one you, IMHO, not depending  what level you are on ( at least if you don't damage it in the process ). 

 

Sometimes the feeling of something expensive to work with, quality is maybe a better word, can alter your behavior. There are examples op psychologists in Germany ( Edmund Forster e.g.) during the interbellum, who treated their patients with serious mind problems in wonderful looking clinics with real painting on gold plated walls. Their reasoning about this was, that quality of environment could influence quality of thought.

 

 

 

[microview]

On 27 December 2018 at 10:39 AM, Ray Vonn said:

No.  Despite my previous experience using cameras generally, there were still considerable adjustments to be made in my habits and composition.  Took less than a week before wondering why my sunset shot of the beach rendered a blank image when I got home (aka cap over lens).  All this despite doing a fair amount of research before purchasing.

Almost about to take Leica Q back to Mayfair, when a string of pics were all bleached out. Finally spotted aperture setting had been accidentally nudged from A to 1sec!

[Ray Vonn]

4 hours ago, microview said:

Almost about to take Leica Q back to Mayfair, when a string of pics were all bleached out. Finally spotted aperture setting had been accidentally nudged from A to 1sec!

Er, you're not alone!  I tend to nudge that circle too.

Edited January 1, 2019 by Ray Vonn

[Ernstk]

18 hours ago, microview said:

Almost about to take Leica Q back to Mayfair, when a string of pics were all bleached out. Finally spotted aperture setting had been accidentally nudged from A to 1sec!

Those 1 second apertures can be a killer...

[_Michael]

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<edited>
I will first add that I really appreciate seeing some light-hearted and less than serious responses to this thread. My opinion here will be one from the eyes and thoughts of a fairly new Leica shooter, but not a novice photographer.

I've resisted posting a response because my initial reaction was not a real positive one. While I think the question may have been posted with the best of intentions, to me it simply reeks of the elitism often associated with Leica. 

I'm going to apologize right here and now for what I suspect could come across as somewhat aggressive and possibly mean. This is not meant to be a personal attack. We need more encouragement and collaboration in this world don't we? 

Why does there have to be an assumed level of knowledge? Did the great masters through the decades start with something else to hone their craft? (maybe?) In another response it was suggested that one might not "get the most out of" the gear without some knowledge. I actually find it a bit refreshing that a complete novice shooter would desire to buy this very basically equipped gear to learn on. Why shouldn't they learn via the basic, core essentials of what photography is? Learn the craft and not rely on the computer between your eye and the world to make decisions for you. That approach is SO easy to do in this world of instant gratification and life at 144 characters. 

The first person mentioned; See my previous comment. Once again, why does it matter and why should there be any qualification gate? This will touch on a far different subject but some people will simply buy what they perceive to be "the best". They want to be part of the elite. The special. The cool-kids. Etc. Leica has a well deserved reputation for being among the best in the world. The legacy, the storied photographers who use the gear and timeless results all lead to that place of indeed being something special. But again, who cares?  Sure, that gear may never be used but does it matter? Let them purchase all they want and celebrate it. If Leica sales slip away what will be left? 

For the second person; Again, what does it matter? Why assume they aren't using the gear because it’s a big lens? Maybe there is a problem with the camera. Maybe the battery is dead. Maybe they didn't see anything that excited them enough to create an image. Maybe they fell and hurt their shoulder and it's physically painful to even lift it. I offer those examples of things I have experienced personally. I can also tell you I've walked around an entire day, or dayS even without shooting a single frame. I've done it with small gear, and I've done it with large pro-body Canon gear and big lenses. 

I apologize for what some might call a rant, but let's offer a position of openness and community rather than one of elitism and you-aren't-good-enough or skilled enough attitudes. We are all constantly learning (or should be) and we should welcome any and all who want to come along for the ride. Be it with the Rolleiflex twin-lens, the 110 instamatic, the latest Sony/Canon/Nikon/Fuji or the much desired Leica it should not matter one bit. Let's support and encourage the arts. And maybe, just maybe we can reduce the elitism perception while still maintaining the desire and mystic of the amazing Leica solutions. I jumped in and find it to be incredibly refreshing, and desires for more still exist but are much more easily satiated by knowing I don't really need it. (but bring on the M10 and 'll take it  )  Everyone who has asked me about the M has been encouraged to get one for the simplicity as I hand it to them to feel the substance. 

I cannot stress enough how this is not meant to be a personal attack or criticism but one simply using your points as originally posted.  

Maybe, just maybe I've provided a viewpoint for thought...or one for laughter and scorn. Thanks for reading this far. 

 

 

Michael

Edited January 4, 2019 by erl
Edited at request of Michael

[Peter Kilmister]

Thank you @_Michael for your views. The most important part for me is your statement, "Let's support and encourage the arts." 

Wise words!

[erl]

Michael, I can't disagree with your expressed views, but IMO your 'rant' as you called it, is too long. It is easy to lose sight of the fact that you are not being personal. I believe your message could have been put more succinctly in half as many words and thus with more impact. Your points still stand of course.

[_Michael]

19 minutes ago, erl said:

Michael, I can't disagree with your expressed views, but IMO your 'rant' as you called it, is too long. It is easy to lose sight of the fact that you are not being personal. I believe your message could have been put more succinctly in half as many words and thus with more impact. Your points still stand of course.

Thank you for this feedback. It was definitely feeling long as I was writing it. I appreciate that my points come through and sincerely hope it's not taken as personal with the extended text. Maybe I should apply some editing.

[_Michael]

4 hours ago, _Michael said:

Thank you for this feedback. It was definitely feeling long as I was writing it. I appreciate that my points come through and sincerely hope it's not taken as personal with the extended text. Maybe I should apply some editing.

Trying to figure out how to edit the post. 

[erl]

Just managed to do the edit for you.

[epand56]

I do not bother at all. To me, If a guy has the money, he can also buy a brand new spaceship and keep it in his backyard. 
If somebody can pay 10,000 euros to take pictures of his old dog, it's ok with me. I'm sure that skill will come with practice, if the guy want to get skilled.
If not, well, a Leica is also a good, expensive paper holder.

[JOCO34]

I have a friend who owns several cameras all DSLR's who truly believes that the camera is responsible for good photos.  When he saw my leica the other day he commented that he needs to get one so he can get better photos since the Leica costs more.  It's true he is an idiot but his wife is my wife's friend and she's cute.

[pico]

Maybe a shop will offer a big L plate jacket as a bonus for new Leica owners.

Edited April 4, 2019 by pico

[bocaburger]

I no longer contemplate about other guys knowledge, income, etc.  Anything involving comparing myself to other guys went out the window years ago, along with caring what other people think my knowledge or income is.  I guess I got to the age where I don't even think about it anymore. 

[pico]

58 minutes ago, bocaburger said:

I no longer contemplate about other guys knowledge, income, etc

I mildly resented the wealthy until I became one of them; now I hate them.
 

[jeff_m]

Unlike what seems to be norm I seem to meet Leica users all of the time. Most nice, some not so, just like the rest of the population. Most are eager to talk Leica’s. A certain amount of knowledge is not a given. It bothers me when someone tries to impress me with their knowledge. Some of the most enjoyable time I have spent with my Leica has been answering questions and getting to know people I’ve just met. 

[JimBo]

On 12/26/2018 at 11:43 PM, stevieg said:

This is the other classic video out there on the 'net.

 

Easily done tho'

I'm guilty as charged for forgetting the lens cap somtimes!

Me too, but only shooting with film Leicas!

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[Herr Barnack]

On 4/4/2019 at 1:03 PM, bocaburger said:

I no longer contemplate about other guys knowledge, income, etc.  Anything involving comparing myself to other guys went out the window years ago, along with caring what other people think my knowledge or income is.  I guess I got to the age where I don't even think about it anymore. 

 

There is great freedom and inner peace to be found in not giving a, uh... coitus about things that really don't matter.