Focusing with the M10-D

[IkarusJohn]

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Generally, I dislike add-ons for cameras; especially on such classic designs as the M body cameras.  Adding an external viewfinder, and thereby having two viewfinders on a camera has always grated with me.  The downside of this is that with an M camera using the OVF, there is a tendency for subjects to be in the centre of the image, rather than off-centre, thereby creating tension in the composition.  I know you can focus and recompose, but if you’re using a shallow depth of field, this becomes problematic.

For wide angle lenses, the coupled rangefinder provides very accurate focusing (the OVF on the M10 cameras is truly fantastic) and is a pleasure to use.  But for the Noctilux, 75 Summilux and an old 135 Elmar I acquired some time ago, focusing with the OVF can be challenging; particularly off centre.  So I tried the Visoflex-020 from my TL2 on the M10-D.  What a revelation!

There are only two viewing modes -

(1) no info at all or

(2) the usual dispay of icons on the top (White Balance, DNG or JPG, metering mode, shutter advance, lens fitted and battery level) and bottom of the frame with histogram (useful),

activated by the video button.  In addition, if you select no info, when you press the shutter release, you get the bottom frame info (M or A, ISO, EV Compensation, Shutter Speed & frames remaining on the card).  Useful, but some might find this last bit  irritating, I guess.

But what is truly useful, and a revolutionary discovery for me is that, like the M10 and M240 before it, when you focus the lens, the EVF jumps to magnified view (which you can adjust using the thumbwheel), but you can also move the magnificed patch (albeit to the left and to the right, and not vertically) when pressing the focus button and rotating the thumb wheel.  This overcomes my biggest irritation with the coupled rangefinder - the fixed focusing patch.  It has always bugged me that you focus in the centre, with the tendency to then leave the composition with the subject in the centre.  This becomes very boring  

I appreciate that this won’t be new to M10 users, but this is my first digital M since the M9 based Monochrom (discounting the M60 which didn’t take the previous EVF, which was pretty average anyway - I had it on the original T and it spoiled that camera for me); this has changed my view of the M cameras completely.  Now I can use the camera “naked”, and mostly this will be just fine with wides and the fantastic OVF.  But when focus and composition is more critical, I can see the EVF getting more use than I thought.

This camera will be a keeper!

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[pico]

The EVF is a new experience to me, John. I only recently got it. I cannot say yet that its a game changer, but that's just my inexperience. Now with the new M10 RF, all is so very good. I can't say enough good about Leica. (I still frame the M9 with an auxiliary viewfinder but focus using the RF, a habit learned with old Barnacks. )

 

 

[evikne]

I will probably try out a Visoflex sometime in the future, but at the moment I've spent all my money on Leica lenses. 😬

[a.noctilux]

John, nice to hear that M10-D suits your use.

Yes for the best OVF in Leica M : high/long eye point, wider opening, no flare, very good contrast in contre-jour.

Visoflex 020 was for me a revelation on M10 (almost two years already ? ).

Nice also that the magnified portion can be moved around the frame to aid pinpoint focus and to take spot meter reading when needed.

[IkarusJohn]

I’m reading the manual for the first time - it’s very interesting!

Evikne, I’m afraid I’ve spent all my money and some 🙄 !  Next year is devoted to debt reduction.  To be honest, as this year has been spent largely either in hopsital or in treatment (leukaemia), this camera and my new gravel bike have been my treat to myself - a recovery incentive.  I will spend my summer holidays getting fit and getting back into taking pictures with my M10-D & Monochrom, and my M lenses.

Pico, the EVF is a useful add-on to the M10.  It doesn’t subsitute the excellent OVF, and to be honest with wide lenses (particularly ones like the 28 Summaron), exact focus is more reliable than the EVF.  But for others, the EVF is excellent.  It’s worth a try.

Cheers
John

Edited December 15, 2018 by IkarusJohn

[lct]

45 minutes ago, IkarusJohn said:

[...] But what is truly useful, and a revolutionary discovery for me is that, like the M10 and M240 before it, when you focus the lens, the EVF jumps to magnified view (which you can adjust using the thumbwheel) [...]

Reason why the M mount is irreplaceable contrary to the opinion of some post-revolutionary  SL/CL/TL users. As far as M lenses are concerned, the so-called superior L mount is simply incapable to do that. 

[IkarusJohn]

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1 minute ago, lct said:

Reason why the M mount is irreplaceable contrary to the opinion of some post-revolutionary  SL/CL/TL users. As far as M lenses are concerned, the so-called superior L mount is simply incapable to do that. 

Not really - a quick stab on the joystick, and you get magnification and you can move it around (with M lenses).  A few years of use this is second nature.  For me, magnification is something I tend to use if I’m being fussy about focusing - as Jono observed some time ago, you don’t need it most of the time as the EVF in the SL is very good for nailing focus.  But I disgress ...

[lct]

20 minutes ago, IkarusJohn said:

Not really - a quick stab on the joystick, and you get magnification and you can move it around (with M lenses).  [...]

And the decisive moment is gone. Been there done that. The M mount is the only one allowing auto zoom with M lenses so far. Could well be the only superiority of Leica in the mirrorless battle as far as M lenses are concerned at least. 

[ramarren]

1 hour ago, lct said:

Reason why the M mount is irreplaceable contrary to the opinion of some post-revolutionary  SL/CL/TL users. As far as M lenses are concerned, the so-called superior L mount is simply incapable to do that. 

An M lens is an adapted lens on the L-mount, thus the body cannot sense the movement of the focusing helicoid. An L lens does that little trick on the SL/CL/TL bodies perfectly: the connection is electronic and works flawlessly.

So if you want the best body for an M and are desperate for the auto-zoom-for-focus-on-the-EVF, get an M body. Personally, I find it annoying as hell and turn it off anyway. 

[IkarusJohn]

57 minutes ago, lct said:

And the decisive moment is gone. Been there done that. The M mount is the only one allowing auto zoom with M lenses so far. Could well be the only superiority of Leica in the mirrorless battle as far as M lenses are concerned at least. 

Yes, the M with EVF is the only camera with auto-magnification with the focusing ring - but only with coupled lenses.

Decisive moment?  Well, LCT, I think we all know you do not like the SL since it was released (for reasons that seemed to change with the weather), but I would never use magnification for decisive moment photography.  Clearly, your approach varies, but this is not the unique selling point of the M10 for me.  You Sony Kolari mod may be different, but for me if the decisive moment is critical, I won’’t be using the EVF.  I use the OVF for that photography because I can see the wider scene unfolding and focusing using the RF is quicker than the EVF with magnificiation.  Actually, the magnification is a pain in the arse (for me) if timing is an issue.

But then, your approach clearly differs.

Cheers
John

[pico]

I cannot imagine why anyone would use an EVF for moment critical photography.

 

[ramarren]

I'll use any viewfinder available for all kinds of photography, and use them however makes the most sense. 

For "critical moment" (?*) photography, I've usually set an aperture and focus zone well in advance of when I'm going to make a shot so I'm using whatever viewfinder I have to frame and make the exposure only. Works just as well with an EVF as it does with a tunnel-optical, wire frame, or reflex viewfinder, in my experience.

* "Critical moment" photography? ALL good photography requires that you make your exposure at the critical moment. It's especially important when photographing people and capturing facial and body expressions, but even a still life requires some effort to capture the scene at the appropriate moment.

[Chaemono]

vor 9 Stunden schrieb IkarusJohn:

So I tried the Visoflex-020 from my TL2 on the M10-D.  What a revelation!

I thought you knew this all along.

vor 9 Stunden schrieb IkarusJohn:

But what is truly useful, and a revolutionary discovery for me is that, like the M10 and M240 before it, when you focus the lens, the EVF jumps to magnified view

If you keep the shutter half pressed when you focus the lens, the magnified view stays off. In situations where magnification is annoying because one wants to view the whole scene, especially when the zone of acceptable sharpness within a photo is larger (deeper DOF), this can be very useful. It allows one to compose and to take a shot more quickly when there is a bit of movement in the scene, for example.

[IkarusJohn]

2 hours ago, Chaemono said:

I thought you knew this all along...

Oh,yes.  I did. But not the moveable magnification point or how good the implementation was going to be.

[LocalHero1953]

9 hours ago, pico said:

I cannot imagine why anyone would use an EVF for moment critical photography.

 

A heretic's comment: I find the CL better than the M240 (and, from my understanding, the M10) for the critical moment. There are several elements to this, of which an OVF vs EVF is only one.

- The speed of the EVF in the CL and SL is nearly at that of the OVF. Not quite the same, but good enough for me.

- The CL is much quicker than recent digital Ms (or than the SL, TL2) at starting up / waking up to take a shot: it's virtually instant, while the M240 and M10 will miss the critical moment if you rely on it waking up from sleep. Sure, you can switch off sleep mode, and run down the battery; you can walk around on the prowl with your finger on the M's button to keep it awake, but distractions happen. In my real life, especially with AF, the CL is more reliable. Perhaps the M11 will get over this wake up lag. I suspect Leica has discovered a trick to fast wake up in the CL that will be incorporated in other future bodies.

- In low light the CL CAN be easier (and so quicker) to focus. This is marginal: in just low light, the EVF shows a brighter image than the OVF, and the RF patch is difficult to see; in VERY low light the EVF breaks up and becomes unusable, while you might still be able to focus highlights in the OVF/RF.

[jaapv]

12 hours ago, lct said:

Reason why the M mount is irreplaceable contrary to the opinion of some post-revolutionary  SL/CL/TL users. As far as M lenses are concerned, the so-called superior L mount is simply incapable to do that. 

Some users are as capable as a mount, and able to flick the thumbwheel 😎

[LocalHero1953]

This automatic magnification is a mixed blessing. It irritates me when the slightest touch on the focus ring results in magnification, so I lose the composition. I've tried both and prefer magnification to be my choice, not the camera's.

[IkarusJohn]

8 hours ago, LocalHero1953 said:

This automatic magnification is a mixed blessing. It irritates me when the slightest touch on the focus ring results in magnification, so I lose the composition. I've tried both and prefer magnification to be my choice, not the camera's.

This is a good point that I had been wondering about.  For me, the OVF will be the first choice, with the EVF used in limited circumstances where “decisive moment” isn’t the issue.

It has been my habit for years to turn the camera off between shots, using the collar on the shutter release. I now have the SL with its switch on the back left of the top deck (left thumb activation, and I have to look) and the M10-D with the switch on the back centre (right thumb).  Each, I think, is retrograde. Habitually, I will see a picture opportunity unfolding, and I will turn the camera on with my right index finger and the camera would be working byt the time I am ready to take the picture.  I don’t think these changes are improvements.

I’m going to have to learn a new technique.  Hopefully it won’t involve stabbing the shutter release on a camera still starting up ...

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[scott kirkpatrick]

On the -D, rotating the outer dial to switch it on is easiest and surest with two thumbs.  Since I hold it with two hands when I am getting ready to shoot, that seems to work.  With SL (and Olympus cameras) I agree, it's awkward.

[ramarren]

When I'm shooting, I just leave my cameras turned on. I only power them off when I've stopped shooting for a time. That seems simplest to me.