Color profile for Leica M (M10, 262) with ColorChecker

[tom24]

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Hello

 

Do you have any experience with X-Rite ColorChecker and creating color profiles for Leica M camare (M10, MD (Type 262)?

 

How do they work for the Leica M10, Leica 262 - dual illumination profile and a single illumination profiles?

Can dula illuminets profile be used for general purpous (like in Lightroom Adobe standard profile)? Or is better to create several individual profiles?

 

Is it worth it to produce profiles with ColorCecher (X-Rite) or is it better to use the Adobe Standard for General Use - for best colors and general purpous for Leica M?  

Your experience?

 

I use Lightroom clacic cc and Adobe standard profile.

New Adobe color profile is too contrasting to begin with (for my taste).

 

Any experience, advice, whatever would happen to me.

 

I apologize if any question is pointless, but I do not have much experience, andI would like to get them.

 

Thanks in advance.

Best wishes.

 

Tomaz.

 

[wda]

Tomaz, ColorChecker helps you produce a bespoke colour profile exclusively for your camera as an aid to high fidelity post processing. Calibrating your monitor is another important link in the chain. I use ColorChecker for each camera I possess.

 

The Adobe profiles are good, but they are generic. A bespoke profile generally is better. The principle applies to any camera, not just M10 or M262.

 

I hope that helps.

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[Jeff S]

New Adobe color profile is too contrasting to begin with (for my taste).

.

This is the point; it’s subjective and only you can determine preferences. Even sometimes by individual picture.

 

LR Classic CC has many options listed below Color and Standard.

 

Or build your own profiles and see what you think. There’s no right or wrong.

 

Jeff

[tom24]

Thank you.

 

I have a calibrated display.

I have a new Eizo display (for two months) so I'm even more interested in color management. J

I'm meeting for the first time by creating dng profiles of camera.

Especially for displaying beautiful colors that can be done by Leica M with Leica lenses.

 

So I ask for advice, what is best in practice (not just in theory)?

What kind of profiles shoul I do (makes sense to do)?

Should I do multiple single illuminations profiles and which?

Or should I do dual illumination profile?

 

And what kind of light is best used for the dual illumination profile?

It is OK strong sunny day and a home lamp (thungsten 2800 K)?

 

I will be very happy for any advice that works best in practice.

 

Thank you.

 

Regards.

[tom24]

When browsing the Internet, I found this interesting guide.

 

https://rawpedia.rawtherapee.com/How_to_create_DCP_color_profiles

 

Maybe some opinions from practice?

 

Regards.

 

 

[jaapv]

The X-rite software is more than sufficient for general use. All the rest in the article is overkill for most photographers.

[Luke_Miller]

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I use the X-rite ColorChecker card (no software) to create profiles for my M-240 (and previous color bodies).  I photograph the card under tungsten and daylight lighting and then create the profile using the free Adobe DNG Profile Editor. Very satisfied with the results.

[wda]

It is worth reading this site ://xritephoto.com/colorchecker for best use the ColorChecker Passport.

[Jeff S]

Thank you.

 

I have a calibrated display.

I have a new Eizo display (for two months) so I'm even more interested in color management. J

I'm meeting for the first time by creating dng profiles of camera.

Especially for displaying beautiful colors that can be done by Leica M with Leica lenses.

 

So I ask for advice, what is best in practice (not just in theory)?

What kind of profiles shoul I do (makes sense to do)?

Should I do multiple single illuminations profiles and which?

Or should I do dual illumination profile?

 

And what kind of light is best used for the dual illumination profile?

It is OK strong sunny day and a home lamp (thungsten 2800 K)?

 

I will be very happy for any advice that works best in practice.

 

Thank you.

 

Regards.

You left out a key word, “What works best in YOUR practice.”

 

Try the options and decide.

 

Jeff

[Chuck Albertson]

I've used the Color Checker to create profiles for the SL. However, I haven't seen much difference between them and the "Embedded" profile of the SL files. I like both of them more than Adobe Standard.

[Nordvik]

I have used both X-Rite and Adobe to make profiles. There is a difference, you have to decide which is best for you. I also like to use the X-Rite DNG Profile Editor. Otherwise it will be to many profiles in LR.

[CharlesL]

1. If you shoot a ColorChecker target for the purpose of generating a camera profile, it takes care to do it right. See this article:
http://rawpedia.rawtherapee.com/How_to_create_DCP_color_profiles#Shooting_the_color_chart

2. One of the benefits of Raw Therapee, the donation-only raw processing program, is that it is easy to switch between .dcp profiles applied to an image, before or after other adjustments like setting the white balance.
 

[tom24]

Thank you for your opinions.

 

Thank you, Jaap. I agree.

I'll use an X-rite software.

I think that the process of how to shoot a target is clear and well displayed in this link (also mentioned by CharlesL).

 

Thankx Jeff – 100% agree - what works FOR ME!

 

Regards

[MikeMyers]

A very brief summary of what I'm trying to ask here, is how many people shooting digital Leica's calibrate their computer gear.  For a very long time, I captured images, and edited them on whatever computer I was using, with the same display I used for everything else.  I gradually moved to Apple computers, and started using PhotoLab4 for my editor.  Getting lost in the details, I joined the DxO forums to try to understand the software.  Before I got very far, all these people in the forum insisted I get my display calibrated.  At the time, I didn't properly understand, but eventually I learned that using my iMac computer along with my cameras, editing was useless because the images that looked "perfect" to me were anything but perfect to all these other people.

I guess to be correct, any and all photographic gear needs to be calibrated.  I've never read anything here about calibrating our Leica cameras, but I assume Leica makes sure the cameras are properly calibrated before they're sold.  From then on, everything falls apart, at least for me.  What I ended up buying was my i1Display Studio kit.  

     

 

For someone here who has no idea what I'm talking about, if I take a perfect photos with my M10, and edit it using any good editor on my iMac (or almost any computer) until it looks perfect, and if I then post it somewhere, or mail it to someone, what they get to see is unlikely to be a good image.  My iMac (and my Windows computers) sense room lighting, and boost or dim the screen brightness accordingly.  It's now mid-afternoon, and in my brightly lit room with my computer, the computer display is brightened accordingly so the screen looks good to me.  If when I finish I send one of you the photo, and you view it in proper lighting, my image is going to be un-naturally dark, and if I print it, it will also come out dark.  Calibrating my photo gear forces everything to match a "standard", and anyone using calibrated equipment will see the photo properly.

I've also got an ASUS 27" high resolution display which I have calibrated.  During the daytime, perfect images look "dark" on that display, but in the evening or night, the same image looks great.  Meanwhile, my iMac or one of my other computers adjusts the screen brightness automatically, so my correctly exposed images, that look dark on the ASUS, look great during the daytime on my iMac.

I probably haven't described this very well.  Professional photographers usually understand all this perfectly, but most of my friends have no idea what I'm talking about.  I'm certainly no expert, I'm just following the advice I was given about calibration, and I mostly do my image editing in the evening, only on my ASUS.  (I could calibrate my iMac too, but I prefer the extra bright screen for most other things I do on computers.)  I use an old 2013 iMac computer as my second monitor, from my Mac Mini.  If I slide a window from my ASUS to the iMac display, it's as if I doubled the brightness.)  

Anyway, the reason I'm asking this here, is to see what the rest of you do, if anything, about calibration for displays, printers, and so on.  There's lots of information posted up above that I need to look into, but I'm not looking for a "personal" setting.  I'd like to find a way to edit my images to a "standard" so other people with calibrated equipment are most likely to see the same things I do, when looking at one of my images on their own computer.

[david strachan]

My office always has the outside blind pulled down, and doesn't face the sun.  The monitor is in a low light part of the office with a wall behind it. Having a nice view outside, over your monitor is a big mistake. I really think the light surrounding monitors, needs to be reasonably low and consistent. That's important.  

And don't have an overbright monitor. Mine's not expensive, but a good Samsung for colour and definition.

I don't calibrate my monitor...sometimes I'll hold a print next to the screen and perhaps turn my monitor brightness up or down a little.

Generally i get first hit on A3+ size prints. Might run a small 6x4 postcard as a test print first...and always very carefully check for sensor marks in sky views on the enlarged monitor image. Use clone tool.

You need to consider the light a print will be displayed.

Lots to consider, but do enough prints and it becomes second nature.

...

[Jeff S]

3 hours ago, MikeMyers said:

I guess to be correct, any and all photographic gear needs to be calibrated.  I've never read anything here about calibrating our Leica cameras, but I assume Leica makes sure the cameras are properly calibrated before they're sold.  

     

Ironic that you’re posting this in a discussion thread (albeit 3 years old) dedicated to the specific subject of generating a custom camera profile for Leica cameras, i.e, to improve color output from that provided out of camera and through editing software such as Adobe. One doesn’t need to be a professional to understand and use a color managed workflow, especially those who print results. This entails color management (even for b/w) at each stage from camera to screen to paper and to display lighting.  There are many related discussions in this DPP part of the forum. 

Jeff

[jaapv]

I strongly advise you to read this book  .As you have found, having a colour-managed workflow is essential for a satisfactory result. Understanding the basics makes life a whole lot easier. 

For instance, a camera is. never "properly calibrated" out of the factory.  Your raw converter sets the colour according to a camera profile which will interpret the colour information from the camera to something that the IT guys of your editing software deem to be correct, unless you create your own profiles, like one for daylight and one for tungsten, or a dual-illuminant one that will combine the two. You can even match the output from different cameras or brands this way, which is very useful if you use them side-by-side. 

BTW I can recall dozens of threads on creating colour profiles for our Leicas on this forum. 

[jaapv]

1 hour ago, david strachan said:

My office always has the outside blind pulled down, and doesn't face the sun.  The monitor is in a low light part of the office with a wall behind it. Having a nice view outside, over your monitor is a big mistake. I really think the light surrounding monitors, needs to be reasonably low and consistent. That's important.  

And don't have an overbright monitor. Mine's not expensive, but a good Samsung for colour and definition.

I don't calibrate my monitor...sometimes I'll hold a print next to the screen and perhaps turn my monitor brightness up or down a little.

Generally i get first hit on A3+ size prints. Might run a small 6x4 postcard as a test print first...and always very carefully check for sensor marks in sky views on the enlarged monitor image. Use clone tool.

You need to consider the light a print will be displayed.

Lots to consider, but do enough prints and it becomes second nature.

...

My editing screen  has a hood and  both monitors are in. a.dark corner with indirect light from a full-spectrum daylight light bulb behind them. I have the calibrating software set to remind me to re-calibrate every month. I did not feel that it was worth the money to get a self-calibrating screen - although that is very practical for professional use.

I run an Eizo CS2420 as main screen and a Samsung S60A 24 as secondary screen . The Samsung is not bad, but too harsh in sharpness and the colour cannot match the Eizo. 

[MikeMyers]

44 minutes ago, jaapv said:

I strongly advise you to read this book  .As you have found, having a colour-managed workflow is essential for a satisfactory result. Understanding the basics makes life a whole lot easier......

Baseed on your recommendation, I just ordered the book.  

In the past, I have sent edited images to people, that told me the image looked awful.  Now I understand why.  I doubt I need to calibrate my Leica, but it's obvious to me that calibrating my display is so important.  To not do so would be like doing my image editing while wearing tinted sunglasses.

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[Jeff S]

1 hour ago, MikeMyers said:

Baseed on your recommendation, I just ordered the book.  

In the past, I have sent edited images to people, that told me the image looked awful.  Now I understand why.  I doubt I need to calibrate my Leica, but it's obvious to me that calibrating my display is so important.  To not do so would be like doing my image editing while wearing tinted sunglasses.

Your Leica output is already interpreted by Leica engineers and/or by your converter. Why wouldn’t you want to better optimize your own initial color output for display on that wonderful screen?

Edited August 4, 2021 by Jeff S