Abram Posted June 8, 2019 Share #121 Posted June 8, 2019 Advertisement (gone after registration) I don't think I ever posted in here but after a year and a half or so with my M10 I still feel like I'm getting to know it, though I attribute that largely to the fact that I primarily have been shooting film in that time. I have enjoyed the improved viewfinder, though the increased magnification has made 50mm easier to use and my 28mm less so. I still don't like the LED frame lines because they always seem to fade out and disappear (I had the same problem with my M240s) but I can more or less work around them. I find that it is capable of producing excellent monochrome conversions and I'm still adjusting my workflow to work with the color files as it's different enough from the M240 that my previous workflow and presets no longer work. This all sounds like a bunch of complaints, but in all honesty I am very happy with it as a digital camera. It does what I need and stays out of the way, which is exactly what I want. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 8, 2019 Posted June 8, 2019 Hi Abram, Take a look here M10 Love (or lack of it). I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
mikelevitt Posted June 14, 2019 Share #122 Posted June 14, 2019 I bought a pair of M8s and they were bad cameras that took bad looking photos, hot mirror filter or not. I bought an M9 and thought that it created amazing, beautiful photos at low ISO. But I also thought it was hard to focus, had a rough shutter release and a horrible sound, bad battery life, horrible high-ISO performance, a worthless screen and weird interface. In short, I liked the results, but took no enjoyment or joy from shooting it. The M10 solved all of these issues. It's a fun camera to shoot, viewfinder is great, love the high-ISO performance, and it feels good, like an old film body. If I had known how much I would love it, I would have bought a new M10P instead of a used M10, but I assumed it would be another disappointment. My M9 sat on a shelf for 5 years while I shot other cameras. I've used the M10 every day since I got it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 14, 2019 Share #123 Posted June 14, 2019 I'm happy that you are happy, but I am slightly puzzled at your slagging of the M8 - a camera that is still capable of amazingly high-quality photographs. I still have a number of prints from the M8 hanging on my wall, some up to 1 m wide. They are as good as the day they were taken - which is pretty good. FYI, the M9 had the same sensor as the M8, only full-frame instead of APS-H and an 0.7 mm IR filter instead of 0.5 mm. When the M10 came out I sold my M240 and reverted to the M9 and MM1, The M10 offered me nothing that justified the extra outlay. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
astrostl Posted June 18, 2019 Share #124 Posted June 18, 2019 "the M9 had the same sensor as the M8, only full-frame instead of APS-H" ?? 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted June 18, 2019 Share #125 Posted June 18, 2019 18 minutes ago, astrostl said: "the M9 had the same sensor as the M8, only full-frame instead of APS-H" ?? Same pixel density; the M9 sensor is just bigger. Jeff 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
adan Posted June 18, 2019 Share #126 Posted June 18, 2019 (edited) The M8 and the M9 (and the DMR back for the Leica R8/9, and some medium-format backs) had Kodak CCD sensors with the same architecture. I.E. the individual pixels and circuitry engraved into the silicon chip were the same "units" in size, sensitivity, microscopic structure, and so on. 6.8 x 6.8 microns. Once Kodak had designed that basic architecture, they could just put more or fewer identical pixels on larger or smaller silicon chips If you think of the pixels as "houses" laid out in a street grid, the M8 had 10.3 million laid out in a "city" of 27mm x 18mm, while the M9 had ~18 million of the exact same "houses" laid out over a "city" of 24mm x 36mm. And 39 million for the even larger 36mm x 48mm KAF-39000 (39Mpixels) medium-format sensor - essentially (but not literally) two M9 sensors glued side by side, and without Leica's "special" microlenses. Not to be confused with the sensor "package", which includes the non-silicon parts and layers of the sensor. The M9 sensor had slightly different Bayer filters (Leica claimed a "tweak" to red sensitivity); it had a thicker IR/cover-glass layer (.8mm vs. 0.5mm), a larger circuit-board (naturally) and required microlenses that were more and more offset towards the corners due to the larger angle of view. But take the M9 24 x36 silicon and slice it down to 27 x 18mm - "APS-H format," named (not very accurately) for one of the formats of APS film - and it will be the M8 silicon. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Photo_System Edited June 18, 2019 by adan 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveco Posted June 19, 2019 Share #127 Posted June 19, 2019 Advertisement (gone after registration) I love my M10, it is the camera I was hoping for when I bought my M8. The only thing I miss from the M8 is the CCD sensor, but I much prefer the M10, it is fun to use, and very capable. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicagoMatthew Posted June 19, 2019 Share #128 Posted June 19, 2019 (edited) I've had the m9, the m240 and now the m10. I loved the m9 files but nothing else... the screen was terrible and the shutter was like nails on a chalk board. The m240 was a big step up, but the white balance was always a little wonky IMO... and losing the CCD sensor for better low light performance was a hard trade. The m10, nails the files almost everytime... personally, I don't have issues with the battery unless I am using the liveview a lot, but I also take both my m10 and m240 out so I am splitting my time between them. I will say the m10 is heavy, even more so for me because I have the Leica case on it, which adds a little heft. Instagram: matthewm2 Edited June 19, 2019 by ChicagoMatthew Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
g2van Posted July 10, 2019 Share #129 Posted July 10, 2019 I really like the M10, it's my keeper (ahem...) M camera. I tried the M9 but just couldn't get over the terrible LCD screen and the weird cocking sound. I didn't try it long enough to get into the "limit of high ISO" issue. With my eyesight, the terrible LCD screen was not very helpful for me to check focus. Also heard about the slower buffer. All these things for a luxury brand and a luxury price made it unacceptable for me. So when the M240 came out with a better screen and and EVF option (huge flexibility with non M/LTM lenses), I bought my first digital M. I was ok with the M240's high ISO, but the colours weren't totally my taste. TBH I could have enjoyed the M240 and getting an M10 was an exercise of luxurious choice. But the M10 is just perfect for me - the colours are warmer, the higher ISO is very good and it just seems to work with the non-Leica wide/ultra wide lenses e.g. Voigt 21/4, Voit 15/4.6 v2, Konica 21-35 dual M Hex - all of which were awful on the M240. The weight saving and bulk were good to have but not the deciding factors for me. The M10 is just about perfect for me - I wouldn't want anything more than 24MP. Only complaint is the EVF is too big and blocks the shutter speed dial. Maybe one day if Leica came up with a hybrid viewfinder ..... but by then (if it happens), it would be a 200MP hog Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkmoore Posted July 10, 2019 Share #130 Posted July 10, 2019 12 hours ago, g2van said: I really like the M10, it's my keeper (ahem...) M camera. I tried the M9 but just couldn't get over the terrible LCD screen and the weird cocking sound. I didn't try it long enough to get into the "limit of high ISO" issue. With my eyesight, the terrible LCD screen was not very helpful for me to check focus. Also heard about the slower buffer. All these things for a luxury brand and a luxury price made it unacceptable for me. So when the M240 came out with a better screen and and EVF option (huge flexibility with non M/LTM lenses), I bought my first digital M. I was ok with the M240's high ISO, but the colours weren't totally my taste. TBH I could have enjoyed the M240 and getting an M10 was an exercise of luxurious choice. But the M10 is just perfect for me - the colours are warmer, the higher ISO is very good and it just seems to work with the non-Leica wide/ultra wide lenses e.g. Voigt 21/4, Voit 15/4.6 v2, Konica 21-35 dual M Hex - all of which were awful on the M240. The weight saving and bulk were good to have but not the deciding factors for me. The M10 is just about perfect for me - I wouldn't want anything more than 24MP. Only complaint is the EVF is too big and blocks the shutter speed dial. Maybe one day if Leica came up with a hybrid viewfinder ..... but by then (if it happens), it would be a 200MP hog Why even buy a Leica M digital to use an EVF and a bunch of vintage lenses? Seems an expensive endeavor for one that primarily uses vintage lenses (assuming based on the info provided). A Nikon z or Sony A seem to be the better option. In my humble opinion (that isn’t worth much) there is absolutely no reason to own a Leica M if you are predominantly using the attached EVF. To get back on topic, I love the M10P. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
g2van Posted July 10, 2019 Share #131 Posted July 10, 2019 I use mostly M or LTM lenses. The EVF helps me in lowlight situations for my failing eyes. I shoot more than 80% with the rangefinder and M lenses. For me, the EVF is a "must have", and the ability to use non-M lens is a "good to have especially for the price". This has turned out some great surprises such as the Minolta MD Varisoft 85mm f2.8 - a stellar alternative to the Thambar that works better (for me) and a few other MD mount lenses. I don't like Nikon Z or any Sony or any other brand with a complicated menu system and different style of shooting. So yes, the M10 rocks for me, for now and into the foreseeable future. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
35photo Posted July 20, 2019 Share #132 Posted July 20, 2019 On 5/10/2019 at 12:40 PM, dkmoore said: The thickness difference between M9 and M10 is not discernible. The M9 is also lighter than the M10. Now, I do agree with your shutter comment although it never really bothers me on the M9M. Ah the thickness is totally noticeable to me...I shot an M6 for years big difference.... Don't care about the weight, prefer a heavier camera makes it easier to balance.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jplomley Posted July 21, 2019 Share #133 Posted July 21, 2019 Love the M10 so much, I purchased a second one in silver. The perfect M, ergonomically and in overall usability. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxfairclough Posted July 22, 2019 Share #134 Posted July 22, 2019 I wish the custom wheel on the M10 would allow you to change ISO as opposed to just exposure compensation etc. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
magixaxeman Posted July 22, 2019 Share #135 Posted July 22, 2019 4 hours ago, maxfairclough said: I wish the custom wheel on the M10 would allow you to change ISO as opposed to just exposure compensation etc. Theres already a dial on the top left for that! 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxfairclough Posted July 22, 2019 Share #136 Posted July 22, 2019 1 hour ago, magixaxeman said: Theres already a dial on the top left for that! Haha well you are not wrong. And I like it! I suppose myself transitioning from Canon DSLR to Leica, there are some things I do miss, and fast ISO changing in smaller increments being one of them. The dial to lift, and move, is a bit of delay for fast pace scenarios. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pedaes Posted July 22, 2019 Share #137 Posted July 22, 2019 (edited) 5 minutes ago, maxfairclough said: The dial to lift, and move, is a bit of delay for fast pace scenarios. The M10 does not pretend to be a camera 'for fast pace scenarios', although it can be a lot quicker than a SLR in some situations. Never understood why people buy a rangefinder and want it to be something it is not. Edited July 22, 2019 by pedaes 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxfairclough Posted July 22, 2019 Share #138 Posted July 22, 2019 56 minutes ago, pedaes said: The M10 does not pretend to be a camera 'for fast pace scenarios', although it can be a lot quicker than a SLR in some situations. Never understood why people buy a rangefinder and want it to be something it is not. I know this. Just mentioning there are some features that I do miss. I do enjoy turning the ISO dial etc. There is just some instances where I forget/dont want to slow down and want to quickly adjust ISO etc. All good. Very happy with my camera. 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkcampbell2 Posted July 23, 2019 Share #139 Posted July 23, 2019 23 hours ago, pedaes said: The M10 does not pretend to be a camera 'for fast pace scenarios', although it can be a lot quicker than a SLR in some situations. Never understood why people buy a rangefinder and want it to be something it is not. Really? I think there are a few street photogs that would disagree. And wether the ISO dial is on the left or the right really doesn't have anything to do with a camera being a rangefinder or a SLR. I never understood why people try to define what a rangefinder should be by what it is "not" instead of its possibilities. Possible firmware fix, make the left ISO dial and the right Exposure Comp dials programable. Set the camera up the way you want it. Cheers, jc 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pedaes Posted July 23, 2019 Share #140 Posted July 23, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, jkcampbell2 said: Possible firmware fix, A fix - nothing is broken! Cheers. Edited July 23, 2019 by pedaes 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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