Leica Elmarit R 90mm f/2.8 vs Leica Leitz Summicron-R 90mm f2

[J514QC]

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Hi,

 

Im looking for a portrait lens and I have a hard time choosing between the two.

 

Please note that the Summicron on the used market is around ( 1000 to 1300 canadian ) and the the elmarit ( 400 to 600 canadian ) !

 

I found a lot of topic talking about the 1.4 but this is out of my budget, I dont really use 90mm range that much but I just want to have the lens in the bag for the few time I will actually need it, thats why I dont want to break the bank and get the 1.4 or a newer version even if they are better than these two.

 

Does some of you actually know where I could find data or sample to see if the summicron is worth the premium over the elmarit. Is the price based on demand and prestige of really on optic performance that I could actually see in the picture, im not into showing off about my gear and for that 90mm I want to get result on the film and nothing more.

 

 

[wizard]

Short answer, you will be fine with the Elmarit. It has very good optics, and the Summicron is not better in that respect, it is just a little more versatile. The Summicron at its full aperture is very nice for portrait work, as it is not bitingly sharp at f2. It does get very sharp from f2.8 onwards though. So depending on your needs, the Summicron may not offer any additional value to you.

 

Cheers, Andy

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[TomB_tx]

Agree the Elmarit may even be sharper - except at f2. I picked up the Summicron some years back when it was a bargain, and it is nice. However, I think my 1968 M-mount “fat” TeleElmarit is as good, and with a 90 the 2.8 still has a thin focus plane.

[lct]

If you're after a portrait lens, i see little point in acquiring the R 90/2.8. The R 90/2 pre-apo is a superb portrait lens at f/2, my favorite perhaps with the M 90/2 v3, and at f/2.8 and on it is on par with the Elmarit more or less. It is even shorter (63 vs 72mm) and only slightly heavier (560 vs 515g) than the Elmarit. No brainer IMHO.

Edited May 14, 2018 by lct

[masjah]

I don't do a lot of portraits, but I find the Apo Asph 90/2 too ruthlessly sharp in this role. I'm sure the earlier non Apo would be better, or the Elmarit.

[gbealnz]

I've not handled the 90 Elmarit, but have owned the 90 Summicron R for a while. It's a heavy lens. I love it.

Gary

[adan]

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Prior to the Summicron APO (in both M and R mounts) - any 90 Elmarit would beat ANY 90 Summicron in terms of resolution. Down to about f/5.6.

 

However, the 90 Summicrons do have: 1 stop more light-gathering capability (for available-darkness journalism), and larger and "prettier" background blurs (for bokeh fanatics). Which accounts for their higher prices (condition being equal). The 90 Summicrons amount to "poor man's" cousins to the f/1.4 75(M)/80mm( R )*** lenses - lots of spherical aberration, which makes for lower absolute resolution wide-open but prettier, smoother bokeh.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spherical_aberration

 

So, you have to decide which you prefer. Absolute resolution at larger apertures (in which case the Elmarit, or the rarish 90mm APO-Summicron-R-ASPH is your bet) - or - some very attractive softness for portraits or other uses at larger apertures, and equal resolution from f/5.6 on (in which case the 90 Summicron R non-APOs are quite nice). You takes your choice and pays your money.

_______________

 

There are no Leitz/Leica 90mm f/1.4 lenses, just the 75/80.

Edited May 25, 2018 by adan

[gvaliquette]

For "OCCASIONAL USE" for portraits and without "BREAKING THE BANK", as stated by the OP, the Elmarit-R 90mm/f2.8 is simply a "no-brainer".

 

enuf said.

 

Guy

 

[Henry Taylor]

Hi have a quick question  since I am using a Nikon  Z6 and can adapt either the R lenses or M .  I am looking at the R90 f2 or the M Elmarit 90 2.8.  which lens would you recommend . I like taking portraits and also would be using for street shooting.

 

Hank

[Ivar B]

15 hours ago, Henry Taylor said:

Hi have a quick question  since I am using a Nikon  Z6 and can adapt either the R lenses or M .  I am looking at the R90 f2 or the M Elmarit 90 2.8.  which lens would you recommend . I like taking portraits and also would be using for street shooting.

 

Hank

I don`t know how any of these lenses will work on a Nikon body, but I would expect R lenses to perform better due to the challenging nature of M lenses used on other bodies than Leica M bodies. I would recommend the Elmarit-R 2.8/90mm lens. If you can find the 2nd version it is optically superb and superior to the 2/90, and its optical design is the same as the Elmarit-M 2.8/90 (last version). It is also compact and lightweight, and at least up until recently they have been underpriced in the market.  

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Edited April 10, 2020 by Ivar B

[AndreasG]

vor 16 Stunden schrieb Henry Taylor:

I am looking at the R90 f2 or the M Elmarit 90 2.8.  which lens would you recommend

Both lenses work very well, see the shots here, however, made with a M10-D:

Elmarit M, 2.8/90 at f2.8:

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Summicron R 90/2 at f2.8 (adapted to Leica M via Adapter:

For my eye not a big difference in the image quality, but one could argue about rendering and the Bokeh.....

For street you certainly do not need the f2 so frequently, so I would prefer the Elmarit M due to its small size and weight.

[TomB_tx]

At 90mm either lens should work well on a Z6 - just as they do on my A7. The edge effects are seen on normal and wide angles. Since there is no auto-diaphragm control of R lenses on these bodies, the M version would be smaller and may handle better. I've used both a 90 TeleElmarit and Summicron R 90 on an A7 with nice results.

[wlaidlaw]

I was considering the same two lenses but in the end as I found an APO 100 Macro-Elmarit with ELPRO, at a reasonable price from New Zealand (thank you Gary), that was the route I decided to go. It is one of the very few lenses, which is sharper wide open than it is stopped down, which can be seen on the MTF charts.

I just wish that Parcelforce would deliver the APO 100 to me. The seller and I believe it is sitting in customs clearance at Heathrow, who apparently have a huge backlog at the moment and are also not tracking items, which have arrived in the country. I can believe this, as I  had an item delivered from Switzerland, when the tracking was showing it as still being in Switzerland. Swiss post had started a lost item search for it. They eventually told me it had been sitting untracked in UK customs for three weeks - they were not impressed and neither was I. As it was printed material, it should never have gone to customs in the first place. 

Wilson

[gbealnz]

Wondered if it had arrived? Hopefully soon.

[wlaidlaw]

Gary.....

 

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[andrew01]

On 4/9/2020 at 8:31 PM, Henry Taylor said:

Hi have a quick question  since I am using a Nikon  Z6 and can adapt either the R lenses or M .  I am looking at the R90 f2 or the M Elmarit 90 2.8.  which lens would you recommend . I like taking portraits and also would be using for street shooting.

 

Hank

Personally I would go for the R version, because the optics will be similar to the M version but the price of the R lens should be way less.

[Henry Taylor]

THANK YOU ANDREW  ,  SINCE I LOVE USING THE R LENSES I WOULD HIGHLY RECOMMEND THESE SINCE YOUR GETTING A GREAT SET AT A VERY REASONABLE PRICE.  I JUST PICKED UP A R 90 f2 that in my opinion better then the R 80 f1.4 I recently sold.  The hype was  that the R90 f.2 wasn't  sharp wide open.  For me,  I didn't find this  to be true, The M Elmarit 90  is also a great lens and if you can find a good one don't  hesitate.   Another fantastic lens is the Super- Angulon  R f4/ 21 which by the way was  manufactured by Schneider,  and If you like wide angel lens go of it . I bought my for $600, its the best wide angel  with the exception  of the Leica Super-Elma-M 21mm f3.4 ASPH, but then  you'll   going to  lay out a lot of money for this one.

Let me know what you finally decide.

Hank

Edited April 17, 2020 by Henry Taylor
add on words

[AZN]

2 hours ago, Henry Taylor said:

Another fantastic lens is the Super- Angulon  R f4/ 21

Until you try the Elmarit-R 19mm V2, and then you cannot ditch the SA 21mm fast enough 😃

Of course the R19v2 is crazily expensive now =/. (Damn videographers!)

[lct]

On 4/9/2020 at 9:31 PM, Henry Taylor said:

Hi have a quick question  since I am using a Nikon  Z6 and can adapt either the R lenses or M .  I am looking at the R90 f2 or the M Elmarit 90 2.8.  which lens would you recommend . I like taking portraits and also would be using for street shooting.

For portraits, 90/2. See my old post above. 

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[wlaidlaw]

The other problem to be very aware of on the Super Angulon is "Schneideritis". This is where the black paint Schneider put on the circumference of the elements or groups of elements in the optical cell, starts to flake off. Sellers will often say:  "Does not affect imaging", which is a bare-faced lie. If it is significant, of course it will affect imaging, by reducing resolution and contrast and significantly increasing flare, which is why the black paint was put there in the first place. Virtually all 21 Super Angulons will have some of this problem but it is a question of degree. I looked at 4 Super Angulons and rejected them before I found my current one, which only has a very modest amount. One trade seller was asking £900 for one that looked like there was a snow storm going on inside the lens. I ended up paying about half that for my one. 

Wilson