Paulus Posted May 3, 2018 Author Share #41 Posted May 3, 2018 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) The guard started about the rules of the house. I said I have read them, but did not know what size a pocket camera supposed to be. I showed him a photo of an iphone x ( ten ) leaning against my MP. stating that the size must not be the problem. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Edited May 3, 2018 by Paulus 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/284105-leica-m-is-too-big/?do=findComment&comment=3511880'>More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted May 3, 2018 Posted May 3, 2018 Hi Paulus, Take a look here Leica M is too big.. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Paulus Posted May 3, 2018 Author Share #42 Posted May 3, 2018 The guard said...: " But the camera is too thick. The lens is protruding to much. I frowned... "Please give me an explanation. How can such a lens be too big. The guard told about issues in the past, that led to this decision: People were hanging their camera around their neck, came to close to a work of art. The camera swung and collide with the art and damaged it. " So what, if I take the camera in my hand, wrap the sling around my fist so that it cannot sling anymore, is it still to big? " I asked. " Yes it is still to big, because of the protruding lens. " I took my minilux. Always have been a real pocket camera: " No to big, because of the protruding lens." So size did not really matter. or did it? We don't know. At this moment I asked if the Director of the museum had time for me, or if he had read the letter I had sent him Saturday. The guard went away to ask him. I went to sit in a blind spot, but the guard found me very quickly. Because, he said, he just had to asked the other guard, my whereabouts on the video. So the museum has a good detection system I believe. The director had no lust to speak to me , obviously, because it was of no interest to him, according to the guard. If there had been twenty of us, it would be a different matter, but i was alone. The rules were as they were. I said: " But the rules are not saying what is allowed ore not. People cannot interpret these rules and you as a guard shall stay discussing these rules because they are unclear. The guard could see the pint and went back to the director... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulus Posted May 3, 2018 Author Share #43 Posted May 3, 2018 In the mean time I walked around the beautiful exhibition, you must see it: And saw people admiring the pictures. Taking pictures with their Olympus with tripod quick-release still on and their Ipad. The man with the camera with the table stative just happened to put it away during my taking pictures of it. The other persons I asked for permission. They did not understand that their device was forbidden. Obviously the guards did not pay enough attention to them. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/284105-leica-m-is-too-big/?do=findComment&comment=3511894'>More sharing options...
Paulus Posted May 3, 2018 Author Share #44 Posted May 3, 2018 This man stated, that nobody had asked him to put away his camera. Normally he had a Nikon on him also. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/284105-leica-m-is-too-big/?do=findComment&comment=3511895'>More sharing options...
Paulus Posted May 3, 2018 Author Share #45 Posted May 3, 2018 (edited) He said he was in his right making the pictures because he had read the signs, stating, without flash was allowed to take pictures. I looked at the statements in the beginning of the museum: There were three: The first stated " pocket cameras" were alowed. The second also, but the third: Only mobile phones were allowed. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Edited May 3, 2018 by Paulus 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/284105-leica-m-is-too-big/?do=findComment&comment=3511898'>More sharing options...
pgk Posted May 3, 2018 Share #46 Posted May 3, 2018 Life is unfair I'm afraid. Rules are far more important than the reality of what they are trying to achieve. Seeking forgiveness is appropriate in this case I would suggest. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulus Posted May 3, 2018 Author Share #47 Posted May 3, 2018 Advertisement (gone after registration) Also the man with the Ipad did not know he was doing the wrong thing, because as he stated, nobody had told him.. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/284105-leica-m-is-too-big/?do=findComment&comment=3511900'>More sharing options...
Paulus Posted May 3, 2018 Author Share #48 Posted May 3, 2018 The really funny part came, when the ( very sympathetic ) guard asked me if I had a card, so the museum could communicate with me. I didn't have one on me, because my wallet just had the last card removed and i did not have my large bag on me, with my cards. Luckily I have a Photographers ID so I asked him, if he could make a picture with his smartphone and sent it to his Director. He could not, because he had a mobile telephone, but a very old one without a camera.... But I will hear from the museum in an answer to my letter. He told me. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted May 3, 2018 Share #49 Posted May 3, 2018 I applaud your persistence Paulus. Keep it up. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulus Posted May 4, 2018 Author Share #50 Posted May 4, 2018 This afternoon I got an email from the director. He explained how people behaved with cameras and that artworks , in the past, were damaged due to it. This is the reason why he will not allow any camera with an interchangeable lenses. An interchangeable lens can be harmful because the protruding lens can impact on the artwork and the lenses can be interchanged with lenses which are big enough to do serious damage, according to the director. He will still permit photographing in his museum, but will not take those risks anymore. To stop the discussion of the protruding lens and how big it must not be, he abolishes all cameras with interchangeable lenses. So far I can follow his argument and I must agree with it. He has IMHO as point. There are some brutal people walking around in musea. The director choses for telephones and "pocketcameras". No great harm can be done by this kind........but what's a pocketcamera? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted May 4, 2018 Share #51 Posted May 4, 2018 So what about a M camera with a collapsible Elmar old type? It is interchangeable, but does not protrude. And a CL with pancake 18? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdlaing Posted May 5, 2018 Share #52 Posted May 5, 2018 This afternoon I got an email from the director. He explained how people behaved with cameras and that artworks , in the past, were damaged due to it. This is the reason why he will not allow any camera with an interchangeable lenses. An interchangeable lens can be harmful because the protruding lens can impact on the artwork and the lenses can be interchanged with lenses which are big enough to do serious damage, according to the director. He will still permit photographing in his museum, but will not take those risks anymore. To stop the discussion of the protruding lens and how big it must not be, he abolishes all cameras with interchangeable lenses. So far I can follow his argument and I must agree with it. He has IMHO as point. There are some brutal people walking around in musea. The director choses for telephones and "pocketcameras". No great harm can be done by this kind........but what's a pocketcamera? A camera you can put in a suit jacket pocket or regular pants pocket. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted May 5, 2018 Share #53 Posted May 5, 2018 So what about a M camera with a collapsible Elmar old type? It is interchangeable, but does not protrude. And a CL with pancake 18? Better not to explain that point to the director, IMO. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exodies Posted May 5, 2018 Share #54 Posted May 5, 2018 A camera you can put in a suit jacket pocket or regular pants pocket. Thereby privileging suits and regular folk. It’s shameful. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
auceps Posted May 5, 2018 Share #55 Posted May 5, 2018 The problem is _not_ the protuding lens but the distance visitors should keep to exposed objects. An adivice to keep 1m distance would solve all these problems for all types of cameras. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulus Posted May 5, 2018 Author Share #56 Posted May 5, 2018 (edited) So what about a M camera with a collapsible Elmar old type? It is interchangeable, but does not protrude. And a CL with pancake 18? No, Leica M cameras are per definition forbidden. Any camera which lenses are interchangeable, it can wear other bigger lenses, is by definition forbidden I think. I think it has to do which the kinetic energy coming free, the moment the camera lens collides against and art object. For me the best way to avoid discussion would be the "Easy Jet/Ryan air etc. - way" : weight and volume which can be measured objectively by pushing the object trough a frame of the maximum volume. And a simple kitchen weight. One of the guards was thinking about making such a construction. The initiative to take such a measures derives from bad experience the last years. The museum is very populair because of its beautiful architecture and its marvelous modern exhibitions. It attracts groups op photographers and that it one thing they want to avoid as one of the guards informed me. They are al very reasonable people " with their backs against the wall'. One the one hand, they want to allow people to make pictures and want people to approach the objects up to a distance of maybe 10 centimeters, they don't want any barricades nor fences between art and people. On the other hand. They are understaffed and cannot put a guard next to every object. This was a " solution " to keep it all manageable. The next step, if this new policy doesn't work might be total abolishment of any camera. Edited May 5, 2018 by Paulus 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Lord Posted May 5, 2018 Share #57 Posted May 5, 2018 Before phones and digital pretty much all museums and galleries banned photography in order to preserve sales of postcards and absurdly expensive catalogue coffee-table books, and nasty tourist tat. The occasional film camera carrier was easily policed and spotted as he tried to surreptitiously tee up a shot of the Mona Lisa or Sunflowers. Then they realised that they simply could not enforce a ban with the Tsunami of mobile phone cameras toted by gaggles of tourists and mobs of adolescent kids on school trips, so pretty much gave up. The more savvy gallery mangers in turn realised that people sharing pics on social media was if anything free advertising and bested any Ad Agency money could buy, and got more people through the doors... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulus Posted May 5, 2018 Author Share #58 Posted May 5, 2018 (edited) So what about a M camera with a collapsible Elmar old type? It is interchangeable, but does not protrude. And a CL with pancake 1 The problem is _not_ the protuding lens but the distance visitors should keep to exposed objects. An adivice to keep 1m distance would solve all these problems for all types of cameras. I think you are right in this. It also would exclude some parts of the exhibition permanently for the public ( with cameras) . One marvelous art object ( by Wolfgang Laib ) they have is a space inside a wall in which you can walk a corridor surrounded by walls of wax plates. I gives you the feeling that you are in the tombe of a Egyptian farao en the smell of the wax is mindblowing. The corridor is only 70 cm broad I estimate. It's also in the Smithsonian I believe: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/the-otherworldly-calm-of-wolfgang-laibs-glowing-beeswax-room-9127160/ Other object are lying on the ground of standing in an empty space. There a meter or more distance would not be impossible, but how do you communicate with a public , to stay within these perimeters without actual borders. The praxis is, that not all art lovers are very good in restraining themselves due to all different reasons... Edited May 5, 2018 by Paulus Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted May 5, 2018 Share #59 Posted May 5, 2018 All this makes me feel eternally grateful to my hometown galleries etc which currently allow me to bring any camera gear I wish. I fear it wont last forever. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
david strachan Posted May 5, 2018 Share #60 Posted May 5, 2018 Yes, cameras are allowed in the SA Art Gallery and Museum here in Adelaide, thankfully. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.