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Rumored SF60 with SFC1 Commander


sillbeers15

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IMHO, the best solution would still be talk to Profoto or Elinchrom and work with them to have Leica-compatible HS and TTL remote controls, even if priced higher than same controls for Nikon / Canon / Sony. Elinchrom already has a HS (HIghSync) version for Olympus / Panasonic, which I am pretty sure sells in much lower volumes than Canikon, so they should be able to make a Leica version as well if they wanted to.

 

 

Leica flashes are likely to sell at even lower volumes than Panasonic and Olympus  :D

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Leica flashes are likely to sell at even lower volumes than Panasonic and Olympus  :D

 

I echo. Besides, most Leica folks shy away from using flashes & strobes. You can find that the SL forum is the only sub tread that contains interest on SF60 & SFC1. The M, CL forum clearly shows no interest at all on the subject. So take another 70% off total Leica users. Still think any third party flash & strobe suppliers still keen to develop wireless triggers and lights for Leica version. I seriously doubt it.

 

Btw when one says, I only use ambient light for photography > it means: I do not know how to use flash & strobes!

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SF60 with SFC1 Commander is pretty much the solution I expect of Leica.

 

For something more powerful, Profoto and Elinchrom are the logical choice. The A1 did show that beautiful studio light can be hot shoe mounted, compact, fast recycling  and linked to the larger profoto system. The SL, being part of the Profoto AirSync system, is a pretty good thing for me. That is, if Profoto will have a Leica version. I have been using the generic trigger with my B2 with no issues, not that I'm expecting any. It's a pretty basic tech.

 

The only thing is the A1 doesn't have an external auto flash sensor which is pretty useful still.

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I echo. Besides, most Leica folks shy away from using flashes & strobes. You can find that the SL forum is the only sub tread that contains interest on SF60 & SFC1. The M, CL forum clearly shows no interest at all on the subject. So take another 70% off total Leica users. Still think any third party flash & strobe suppliers still keen to develop wireless triggers and lights for Leica version. I seriously doubt it.

 

Btw when one says, I only use ambient light for photography > it means: I do not know how to use flash & strobes!

 

I think you are one of the few amateurs I know who cares enough about light to use external flash  ;)  Even pros do veer away from flash  :D  Particularly Canon users  :lol:

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True. I frequently switch off my flash when it warrants. When the light delights, no one should deny its inspiration to capture that moment.

 

It's when the scene needs something extra that strobes come in useful. But of course strobes aren't the only things that bring illumination to where it's needed.

Edited by lx1713
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I hope that Leica bring out their own version of the Nissin M10 hammerhead flash. This will be great for event photography on either the M series or more particularly the SL. I have done events with both my M240 and SL but using them with my SF58 (or the new SF60) on the top shoe is very unwieldy. I have occasionally used the flash on a side bar with a Nikon SC28 cable, which provides full functionality and TTL but again a bit unwieldy, as the rectangular flash doesn't make a good handle . A hammerhead which you can use as a side handle is the answer. When I did events some years ago with my Contax SLR's I used a Metz 45 CL-4 hammerhead. This balanced well on my Contax cameras with the heavy 28-85 f3.3 Vario-Sonnar lens. 

 

I would much rather buy a Leica-ised M10 than the SF60. Below is the just announced M10 attached some cheap bit of Japanese rubbish  :p The only negative point on the Nissin is that I might prefer a TTL cable rather than wireless connection to the flash, to keep the weight down. 

 

Wilson

 

 

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I hope that Leica bring out their own version of the Nissin M10 hammerhead flash. This will be great for event photography on either the M series or more particularly the SL. I have done events with both my M240 and SL but using them with my SF58 (or the new SF60) on the top shoe is very unwieldy. I have occasionally used the flash on a side bar with a Nikon SC28 cable, which provides full functionality and TTL but again a bit unwieldy, as the rectangular flash doesn't make a good handle . A hammerhead which you can use as a side handle is the answer. When I did events some years ago with my Contax SLR's I used a Metz 45 CL-4 hammerhead. This balanced well on my Contax cameras with the heavy 28-85 f3.3 Vario-Sonnar lens. 

 

I would much rather buy a Leica-ised M10 than the SF60. Below is the just announced M10 attached some cheap bit of Japanese rubbish  :p The only negative point on the Nissin is that I might prefer a TTL cable rather than wireless connection to the flash, to keep the weight down. 

 

Wilson

In general I prefer a hotshoe flash over a hammerhead even the lighter Metz 60 CT1 (the battery pack is separate) even though I love the power and flash quality. It's because I can manoeuvre a bit better. I'm a little surprised that you find the hammerhead flashes to be better balanced. I think perhaps it's because I do a fair amount of one handed shooting that the hammer design isn't so suitable.

 

The old Metz hammers are probably some of the more reliable flashes around. With nice colour quality (not the CT-4 though)

Edited by lx1713
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If I am correct, the SF C1 commander should be able to control with the newly released Nissin MG10.

 

This flash is more powerful than the Profoto A1.

 

I have sent an email to Nissin Technical, which they have acknowledged  but not yet answered, to enquire if the SFC-1 controller will control the MG10. The thing that slightly concerns me is that they say they have different models currently for Nikon and Canon plus Sony at a later date. Now this may only apply to the controller but it is a concern. The other problem is that the MG10 appears to be priced with a controller, which would be worthless to me. I will advise further when I have heard back from Nissin. 

 

Wilson

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The SF60 is vastly smaller than the SF64. The SF 60 balances much better, even on smaller cameras like the Sony A7. I don't see any issues with the SF60 on the SL, except for occasional care regarding red eye.

 

The SF60 is small enough that you could use it with a short gripped handle if you wanted that set up. You'd be holding the handle, not the flash.

 

Gordon

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I have sent an email to Nissin Technical, which they have acknowledged  but not yet answered, to enquire if the SFC-1 controller will control the MG10. The thing that slightly concerns me is that they say they have different models currently for Nikon and Canon plus Sony at a later date. Now this may only apply to the controller but it is a concern. The other problem is that the MG10 appears to be priced with a controller, which would be worthless to me. I will advise further when I have heard back from Nissin. 

 

Wilson

There are 2 packages for MG10 available, one with Air 10s and the other without priced at USD$599 and $699 respectively. Technically SF60 should be able to control MG10 as the released information mentioned older Air1s as compatible. However, it is better you get a reply directly from Nissin. Kindly share your findings later :)

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The SF60 is vastly smaller than the SF64. The SF 60 balances much better, even on smaller cameras like the Sony A7. I don't see any issues with the SF60 on the SL, except for occasional care regarding red eye.

 

The SF60 is small enough that you could use it with a short gripped handle if you wanted that set up. You'd be holding the handle, not the flash.

 

Gordon

I agree with your rational on handing of SF60. However I'm keen to explore MG10 cause it might be strong enough for most HSS applications.

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I quite often take photos at outdoor evening events. The MG10 with a flash guide number of 84, is 40% more powerful than the SF60, which is worth having. Given that it appears as if I can get the MG10 on its own (I could only find a combined flash and controller price) and it is the same price as the SF60, that would be my preferred route. For when I want a simpler set up or don't need the power, I do already have the excellent SF40. When I really need the power, I have a Graflash and PF300 bulbs with a guide number of 300 but that works out at £12 a shot. 

 

Wilson

Edited by wlaidlaw
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I have just received the following reply from Nissin:

 

Thank you for your interest of Nissin flash.

 

Since Leica SFC-1 and Leica SF60 are Leica brand products , not a Nissin product.

At this moment, we do not have the Compatibility test result about those 2 Leica flash products work with our current products.

 

For your reference,

our new MG10 will support the commander using NAS technology , for example Nissin Air1 and Air10s. 

But for getting fully function support, we will suggest user to choose our Nissin Air 10s as the best model.

When using other commanders may have not fully support , but the wirelessly TTL , M , Zooming and HSS function should be working normally with our MG10 under NAS system.

  

If your camera model and commander does not show up in  our compatibility chart here : http://nissin.lekumo.biz/download/Nissin_Compatibility_Chart.pdf . 

We suggest you contact one of our distributor below and bring your camera and commander to the local dealer to have a try of our new MG10 in coming future.

 

http://www.nissindigital.com/distributors.html

 

I suspect something has been lost in translation. It looks like I will need to borrow an SFC-1 commander and go to Kenro in Swindon to try it on an MG10 flash. When I get back to the UK in the autumn, I will speak to Jimmy Hughes at Leica UK and see what I can arrange. Interesting that they deny that the SF60 and SFC-1 are Nissin products, when everyone knows they are. 

 

Wilson

Edited by wlaidlaw
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.

Interesting that they deny that the SF60 and SFC-1 are Nissin products, when everyone knows they are. 

 

Wilson

 

Not entirely surprised ...... we have a John Lewis Tumble Dryer that is clearly derived from an AEG model ..... but JL insist it is their 'own brand' and I am sure AEG would deny it is 'theirs' even though they clearly manufactured it. 

 

Such is the world of manufacturing under licence and re-badging ...... semantics it may be, but brand identity surpasses even common sense ......

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I have just received the following reply from Nissin:

 

Thank you for your interest of Nissin flash.

 

Since Leica SFC-1 and Leica SF60 are Leica brand products , not a Nissin product.

At this moment, we do not have the Compatibility test result about those 2 Leica flash products work with our current products.

 

 

 

 

 

The following website has a more optimistic outlook:

http://www.tipa.com/en-en/awards/nissin-mg10

 

I quote: ....the MG10 has full-function capability with Canon, Nikon, Sony, Fuji, Four Thirds and Leica systems.

 

I hope your test will confirm the suggested compatibility.

 

Regards, 

Stefan 

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Not entirely surprised ...... we have a John Lewis Tumble Dryer that is clearly derived from an AEG model ..... but JL insist it is their 'own brand' and I am sure AEG would deny it is 'theirs' even though they clearly manufactured it. 

 

Such is the world of manufacturing under licence and re-badging ...... semantics it may be, but brand identity surpasses even common sense ......

This is not necessarily correct. It might be made in the production facilities of AEG, but probably to JL specifications, which might differ from the AEG ones (I’m working in that kind of business).

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If anyone can beat me to it with checking compatibility of the SFC-1 and MG10 in the autumn, I would be delighted. Would save me a day fighting with the trains from Brighton to London and then London to Swindon (for Kenro, the agents for Nissin), back to London and finally back to Brighton again. The chances of all that working smoothly are far less than the chances of the SFC-1 working with the MG10  :)

 

Wilson

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