Trouble holding SL steady

[Csacwp]

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When using 50mm, 75mm, and 90mm M lenses, I have a lot of trouble holding the SL steady enough to focus easily with the EVF. This is especially pronounced when shooting in the portrait orientation. I have no such issues with SLRs and M’s... does anybody have any advice? Do you think Leica will ever introduce an EVF body with image stabilization?

[sillbeers15]

try using a tripod,..or alternatively attach a vertical grip which holds a an additional battery for extended shooting. I hv that permanently attached onto my SL.

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[darylgo]

When using magnification unsteadiness really shows and the vertcal orientation makes it worse (for me).  Have you tried vertical with both arms against your body, I find this orietation awkward but more steady.  

Leica has opitcal stabilization, I would be surprised to see it in body.  

[thighslapper]

A Handstrap such as the Herringbone (or similar) helps enormously .......

 

You no longer have to actually grip the camera firmly as the strap transfers the rotational weight to the back of your hand and wrist.

 

Similarly when in portrait orientation the camera mostly dangles from the strap rather than needing to be gripped tightly. 

 

Anything that reduces strain makes you much steadier. 

 

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ps. the EVF is so good you shouldn't really need magnification after a bit of practice.

Edited January 14, 2018 by thighslapper

[Steve McGarrett]

To me it's a very steady camera, good grip, I've found easier to keep steady than the Sony A7, at least with medium or big lenses (...unless you turn on IBIS on A7...)

[geetee1972]

For shooting in portrait mode, other than using the vertical grip (which really helps to steady the composition), I've found that holding the camera with the built in grip on the bottom makes a big difference. It's hard to explain how to hold it like this without showing you in a photograph (which forgive me but I'm not going to do) so bear with me.

 

You keep your elbows in by the side of your body and you hold the grip part in both hands so that your thumbs fall side by side on the back of the camera just below the function buttons. Assuming you've got a focus tab on your lens, you can then use the fore finger of your left hand to focus and the one on your right hand to operate the shutter.

 

It works really well and makes for a much more stable shooting platform.

[LD_50]

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I can’t see how the SL would provide a less steady handholding experience than an M with the same lens. The SL has a real grip and the body and lens are not very heavy together.

 

Are you assessing steadiness when using magnification in the EVF? That would explain the difference with DSLR or M that don’t show magnification.

 

I recommend the RRS L bracket to add a bit of height to the grip and also a strap or hand strap can be used to stabilize your grip.

[John Z. Goriup]

Please bear with me in this lengthy & heavy-handed epistle, but what if it actually works for you too.............?

 

Since it's introduction, folks have been complaining about difficulties holding , focusing, manipulating and generally handling the SL with any number of native, M, R or third-party lenses. I too found the SL to be a different experience than all the SLRs I owned previously, not to mention the M bodies I have owned  ( and an M240-P I still use occasionally ), but decided to analyze & solve my 'problem' by concentrating hard on the whole issue of the SL in my life as a photographer. I can not claim that it was a surprise to find that it wasn't a camera problem at all, rather, the basic recognition that I was getting old and that it was my own deterioration - arthritis in my case, that was making its painful, debilitating presence felt to a greater degree than previously as I was attempting to hold and effectively use a camera which was heavier, larger & whose shape I simply wasn't used to, and which had altogether different handling characteristics than those bodies I was accustomed to using.

 

I am in the care of an older physician, a gent who shares many of my afflictions, who wisely initiated a series of lab. tests and as a result referred me to an orthopdic surgeon / specialist. That referral was a life-changing event. After some interviews, consultation and  X-rays of both hands and wrists, the specialist's first step to a more permanent solution was to administer some steroidal cortizoid injections - done in one in-office visit - into the base of several fingers to soften and make more flexible the 'sheaths' that cover the fingers under the skin and aid in facilitating the smooth sliding of the tendons of the fingers against said 'sheaths membranes'. It was hardening and calcification of these sheaths which was causing them to hang up on the joints and tendoins of my fingers and actually locking some fingers into fixed positions that required my othe hand to 'unlock'. After about a weeks wait of allowing the medication to take full effect I was able to use my hands to their full extent and re-discovered the joys of normally functioning hands and joints.......and Good-By pain. I could work on my Porsche, I could easily do woodworking with handtools, I felt like a youngster and I could effortlessly operate / handle all my Leicas, new or old.  In regular follow-up visits my physician emphasized how wide-spread neglecting, obvious painful symptoms is, and how many folks could dramatically improve their lives by merely visditing their doctors and opening up about problems they're experiencing. I am most certainly not suggesting all who are having some difficulty handling their SLs can look forward to an equally simple solution, but I am strongly suggesting that it might be most beneficial to determine if there is a medical reason / cause behind some of the 'problems' encountered with new equipment. I respectfully submit that blaming Leica a priori for producing a different type of camera to that we were accustomed to is not condusive to any kind of workable solution.

 

In my case, the improvement in my condition and my subsequent embracing of the SL as my primary, go-to camera system has been startling.

 

JZG

 

 

[Jeff S]

You might try Lars’ sniper technique....it works...

 

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/111304-tripod-monopod-nothing/?do=findComment&comment=1209129

 

Jeff

[Csacwp]

I can’t see how the SL would provide a less steady handholding experience than an M with the same lens. The SL has a real grip and the body and lens are not very heavy together.

 

Are you assessing steadiness when using magnification in the EVF? That would explain the difference with DSLR or M that don’t show magnification.

 

I recommend the RRS L bracket to add a bit of height to the grip and also a strap or hand strap can be used to stabilize your grip.

I don’t find it harder to hold steady than my M’s. I find the exaggerated camera shake seen in the EVF when using, say, a 90mm very difficult. No such problems with optical finders....

[LD_50]

I don’t find it harder to hold steady than my M’s. I find the exaggerated camera shake seen in the EVF when using, say, a 90mm very difficult. No such problems with optical finders....

If you’re holding as steady as other cameras there should be no issue other than you’re seeing the 90mm field of view rather than the wider fixed OVF view of a rangefinder. This would be no different than an SLR.

 

Are you using magnification that would exaggerate the movement you’re seeing?

Edited January 14, 2018 by LD_50

[ramarren]

I don’t find it harder to hold steady than my M’s. I find the exaggerated camera shake seen in the EVF when using, say, a 90mm very difficult. No such problems with optical finders....

 

 

Turn off magnification and learn to see for focusing with the normal magnification display. If light levels are low, try focusing at larger lens openings. 

 

Magnification in the EVF amplifies both camera motion and refresh "jitter". As light levels become lower, refresh jitter increases due to the way the camera accumulates several 'frames' of data before updating the EVF display. Depending upon the light levels and the working aperture you've chosen with an adapted lens, jitter rapidly increases past a certain point (when the camera cannot collect enough light in a single refresh time to fully illuminate the EVF). The only useful solutions are to minimize magnification, let more light into the camera, and fully stabilize the camera and lens to minimize camera motion. 

 

Native lenses take longer to show refresh jitter since their normal operation is like that of an SLR: the aperture is normally held wide open until exposure time since the camera has full information regarding the lens maximum aperture and set aperture for exposure at all times. It shows up more swiftly if you use the aperture simulation mode (DoF Preview) or exposure simulation mode (DoF Preview + exposure time preview) functions, rather than the normal preview display.

[Csacwp]

By magnification, you mean pressing the joystick to zoom in? I find it nearly impossible to focus lenses wide open without doing that. By “turning magnification off” you mean not pressing the joystick? Or is there a menu setting?

[Paul J]

I find in portrait mode it's much better if you rotate the sitter.

[LD_50]

By magnification, you mean pressing the joystick to zoom in? I find it nearly impossible to focus lenses wide open without doing that. By “turning magnification off” you mean not pressing the joystick? Or is there a menu setting?

Yes- zooming in is what I was referring to when I asked about magnification. Not pressing the joystick (or the BL button) would avoid it.

 

I find I can focus pretty well without magnification with a 50/1.4 and 35/1.4. I will typically zoom in if necessary and then zoom back out before shooting.

[Csacwp]

That’s what I do, but while zoomed

in to check the focus, I find the shaking to be too sever to focus a 75 1.4 or 90 2.0.

[FlashGordonPhotography]

"you're holding it wrong" - Steve Jobs......

 

You probably are, although nothing will change the fact that when you push the magnification button you're seeing the equivalent of a 300mm lens or longer. Some shake is inevitable.

 

You can use a monopod. If you're left eyed then there's a great technique where you rest the camera on your left shoulder. Joe McNally uses that one. Great technique like holding your elbows in front of your body and spreading your feet a bit. With a small lens rest the bottom of the camera on your left hand instead of holding it up with your right. Bigger lenses you hold the lens.

 

Mostly though you need to relax. Over gripping, holding your breath too long and over thinking it will make the muscles tense and that exaggerates the effect.

 

Gordon

[IkarusJohn]

You might try Lars’ sniper technique....it works...

 

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/111304-tripod-monopod-nothing/?do=findComment&comment=1209129

 

Jeff

 

It's worth quoting Lars in full - he was such a great contributor here:

 

This is how the sniper offhand technique applies to cameras:

 

• Wear the camera diagonally or 'bandolier style' with the strap over your right shoulder and the camera to the left.

• Raise the camera to nearly shooting position with your right hand.

• Raise your left hand outside the strap ...

• ... bring it inside the strap from above/outside ...

• ... and outside again UNDER the strap, so that the strap is now wound around your left lower arm just 'above' ('inside', medially to) the wrist.

• Now grip the camera with the left hand too, shrug your shoulders a bit and the strap is now a snug fit over your right shoulder, behind your back, around your flank and your arm, and it anchors the camera very steadily.

 

You will have to adjust the strap of course so that it will fit your body and the clothes you usually wear. But that length will make for comfortable and secure carry too. Even if you sometimes carry the camera just around your neck, this length will usually make the basplate hover about two fingers above your belt buckle. This technique is great for slow speeds and also for long lenses. It is about as effective as a monopod.

 

The old man from the Mauser Age

 

 

Another great tip mentioned here in relation to video (where camera shake is a nightmare), attach a piece of string to your baseplate and put the other end of the string under your foot.  Put a bit of tension on the string, and you have a reasonably stable camera.

[thighslapper]

Not all of us have steady hands ......and this is often aggravated by essential tremor (often hereditary) and intention tremor are common and worsen with age, as does muscle strength. Magnification greatly exaggerates what might be hardly noticeable under normal circumstances. 

 

With the EVF on the SL you should be able to focus easily and accurately without magnification on all lenses ..... including the Nocti 50/0.95, it just takes confidence and practice. 

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[ramarren]

By magnification, you mean pressing the joystick to zoom in? I find it nearly impossible to focus lenses wide open without doing that. By “turning magnification off” you mean not pressing the joystick? Or is there a menu setting?

 

 

Yes, focus assist magnification which is enabled by either a joystick button press or the LL button. 

Regards your inability: Practice makes perfect. It's pretty easy to see the focus transition on most lenses between wide open and about f/5.6-f/8, depending on the focal length but particularly for focal lengths greater than or equal to 50mm. 

Edited January 16, 2018 by ramarren