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Missed chances on the CL

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And with respect, (and I own neither camera, at the moment) the comparison should be SL vs A7RII surely?

Gary

My post was a reply to the claim that A7rII is not much bulkier than CL. CL should be compared with A6500. Have no idea why the original poster wanted to compare sizes of A7rII and CL instead.

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Small is no longer a priority for camera systems buyers that is fast becoming the domain of the smartphone camera. What buyers look for are things like great fast glass (reasonable size), stabilisation, weather proffing, stable software and a roadmap something that fiji, olympus and panasonic will or do offer at a lower price

Leica will get there but right now what it offers is a bit “all over the shop” If there are enough buyers the next offering will be a heck of a lot more mature all be slightly bigger

 

A camera worth keeping a eye on

I‘ did buy the camera, but I don‘ t agree...

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Oh yes, flash is not a problem. All Leica flashes (except the venerable SF20) can be used on TTL, all other universal flash systems on Auto.

 

.......and just after I have ordered an SF-40 

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Anyone tried CV 15mm (II or III) on CL?

 

 

CV 15mm vIII works very well on the CL (from the image thread, ex1 and ex2, although these images may not be the best to demonstrate the lens' excellent optical qualities).

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My post was a reply to the claim that A7rII is not much bulkier than CL. CL should be compared with A6500. Have no idea why the original poster wanted to compare sizes of A7rII and CL instead.

 

My bad i own both CL and A7s mod and i did not realize that the A7r2 is significantly bulkier:
Your comparo with the Sony 6500 is certainly more relevant:

If it were not to use M lenses, i would have preferred the Sony most probably.

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Small is no longer a priority for camera systems buyers that is fast becoming the domain. 

 

 

 

It is a question of personal preference, but the strong point of the CL is the aesthetics: how small and cool it looks. It is not a question of features. That is the kind of game Leica plays, and plays it very well. 

 

IBIS could make sense on the SL (or the S), a larger camera anyway, for much larger lenses. 

 

It is possible to design a pro-like camera with L mount and APS-C sensor, with a ton of interesting features, but that is the game of the japanese cameramakers (Fuji, Olympus, Panasonic). It is a difficult field for Leica. 

 

Leica will not follow that route, in any of their systems. Not even the SL system. The only exception could be the S system, a "pro" oriented system for the medium format market. 

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[...] It is possible to design a pro-like camera with L mount and APS-C sensor, with a ton of interesting features, but that is the game of the japanese cameramakers (Fuji, Olympus, Panasonic). It is a difficult field for Leica. Leica will not follow that route [...]

 

Forthcoming SL and perhaps CL bodies will have IBIS soon or late, wanna bet? Leica is just late in the party as usual but it is indeed a small company who can hardly compete with Sony which in turn cannot use M wides w/o sensor stack modification if any. As for aesthetics, love is in the eye of the beholder

 but that of the CL does not hurt this grumpy old Leica user. Remains to see how it looks and feels with accessories like thumb rests or hand grips given the slippery design of the body.  Edited by lct

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Forthcoming SL and perhaps CL bodies will have IBIS soon or late, wanna bet? Leica is just late in the party as usual but it is indeed a small company who can hardly compete with Sony which in turn cannot use M wides w/o sensor stack modification if any. As for aesthetics, love is in the eye of the beholder

 but that of the CL does not hurt this grumpy old Leica user. Remains to see how it looks and feels with accessories like thumb rests or hand grips given the slippery design of the body. 

 

I think more likely to reach 1.5X crop cameras like TL2 and Cl first but Sony has made it feasible for 35mm sensors so it's possible for the SL2 to have it.

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I think with the TL and Cl, Leica does have an attractive lens and body combination that's really compact and light. Something that I realised is a very big issue for existing Leica users. Particularly M users. They have been moving to m43 cameras and their lenses. As it is the CL and all the current TL lenses aren't huge compared to M43 and Fujifilm lenses.

 

To put in OIS and add the fast aperture in TL lenses would certainly bulk up the combination.

 

Maybe a Mini SL(1.5X and IBIS) could come with much bigger OIS and fast lenses. It might be a reasonably safe market for Leica to delineate in the future. Just not yet.

 

And the SL as the topper in the TL ecosystem. 

 

It can make the TL system very attractive to new users if this is the case.

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Forthcoming SL and perhaps CL bodies will have IBIS soon or late, wanna bet? 

 

 

It is far more likely in the SL than in the TL/CL cameras. 

 

(it is technically easier for a smaller format, but only if you allow an increase in body volume).

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IBIS is a great feature but if you already use an OSS- a stablilized Sony/Zeiss lens, it may not be neccessary likewise if you dont shoot much telephoto and have a steady hand , :-), in jest the last item.

 

I have decided to cancel my pre order with the kit 18-55 lens, and on wait list for body only will get the 11-23 mm, and continue to read all the CL related posts, no doubt it is a good Leica APSC camera but the price creep to $4700 with non kit zoom makes me think more before I make the purchase when thebody becomes available. Thanks for sharing the missing features, pop up flash for one, the large SF40 vs the small Sony I use on the A7R, I am using the Sony my Christmas gathering snapshot camera. The M10 will have the SF40.

 

In case some have not seen this long thread I started three weeks ago, comparing CL with A6000 (A6500) and a compare to A7R when I had a hands on with the cL at the Las Vegas Leica store. 


Edited by tonyniev

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It goes for lenses too. The MFT Panasonic 12-60 is a lot bigger than the Leica APS-C 18-56, for instance. But still....

Jaap, have you tried your olympus 75-150 on CL? Curious.

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Jaap, have you tried your olympus 75-150 on CL? Curious.

 

How would you do that? Do you mean an MFT lens or an old OM lens, for which there may well be an adapter. I would doubt if the image circle of an MFT lens would be big enough and I don't know the relative Flange Focal distances to see if an infinity focusing AF adapter could be made. 

 

Wilson

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Jaap, have you tried your olympus 75-150 on CL? Curious.

Not yet, maybe this  weekend

Watch the long lenses thread.

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How would you do that? Do you mean an MFT lens or an old OM lens, for which there may well be an adapter. I would doubt if the image circle of an MFT lens would be big enough and I don't know the relative Flange Focal distances to see if an infinity focusing AF adapter could be made. 

 

Wilson

I was referring to FF lens. It is a relatively light weight and smallish sized FF zoom lens by Olympus.

https://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/hardwares/classics/olympusom1n2/shared/zuiko/htmls/75150mm.htm

 

Leica's 55-135 TL weighs almost same and has AF therefore there is not much advantage for the zuiko 75-150, however it is FF and can be used on M as well as on CL.

Edited by jmahto

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I bought the Leica R to L adapter on a Black Friday sale. This is to use my Leica 80-200 ROM lens with the CL. It works perfectly. The CL automatically shows the correct lens as soon as you mount it. What is a pleasant surprise and one I did not expect, is that it auto-zooms as soon as you move the focus ring. It is quite a neat combo and far easier for me to manage than the 90-280 on the SL. Yes it would be nice to have IBIS or OIS but I managed for years with my film cameras, so I should be OK with this arrangement on digital. You just have to find something or someone to lean on. I also have a nice carbon fibre lightweight Manfrotto monopod, which will be fine with it. 

 

Wilson

 

 

 

 

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