Martin Horne Posted November 26, 2017 Share #1 Posted November 26, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) Have just found a virtually NIB M9 with under 250 actuations. Guess the fact that the camera is virtually unused is no guarantee that the sensor won’t be problematic? It’s from a non franchised dealer and is a good price if the camera is what they say. What recourse would I have if the camera arrives and it turns out the camera sensor is defective apart from just returning it? Buyer beware I know but I’ve waited for ages for a good one and not want to miss it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted November 26, 2017 Posted November 26, 2017 Hi Martin Horne, Take a look here New in box M9. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Guest Posted November 26, 2017 Share #2 Posted November 26, 2017 (edited) Factor in the cost of a new sensor £750 approx. If it comes with 12 months warranty I would not pay more than £1250 / £1500 max It’s only a good one if the price is right.If you pay £1500 plus £750 the camera will have cost you £2250. Factor in 3 to 4 months at Leica while the sensor is replaced. Also bear in mind if you traded it in say in 12 months time you would get max £1200 for it and only then if the sensor had been replaced. Edited November 26, 2017 by Guest Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denys Posted November 26, 2017 Share #3 Posted November 26, 2017 (edited) Welcome to the forum! My two-penneth.. If I understand the root problem with the first-generation sensor, it wasn’t so much how / where the camera was used; rather a simple manufacturing error. My camera had sensor corrosion and that was replaced with another first-generation sensor, that also corroded and had also been replaced with the second-generation one. Of course, it seems there are many more problem free cameras that problem cameras. First thing I would do is determine whether the sensor is already showing signs of corrosion. Probably unlikely, but if there is a problem it would be easy to either walk away or get the dealer to pay for replacement. If OK, the cost of replacement is now down to the owners and is around half the value of the body. I guess it depends on what warranty the dealer is offering.. ..but if the sensor will corrode, it may be after, say, six months. Maybe the dealer will be prepared to offer a ‘special case’ guarantee covering the sensor. Although having an almost brand new body is appealing, personally - with the M9 - I would be happier with a less than mint body with a second-generation sensor. Good luck! Edited November 26, 2017 by Denys Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frase Posted November 26, 2017 Share #4 Posted November 26, 2017 Depends what a good price is, there is no shortage of M9s. I think a well used one with a receipt of sensor replacement is worth more than a as new one with no evidence of sensor change. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Horne Posted November 26, 2017 Author Share #5 Posted November 26, 2017 Thanks all. I’ve bought successfully from the dealer before without issues. The camera is at the upper end of that price spectrum to be honest. My fear is that it’s clean as a whistle and that the dealer can justifiably say so but once I starting using it then the corrosion comes along and I’m paying to have it fixed. I’m never going to able to afford to buy new and without risk so getting a good user in mint condition has always been the dream. For context I’ll still be saving for a lense once I buy the camera. Then there’s the thought of getting the sensor done and having an as new M9 with new sensor for around £2,250 which I’d probably pay If I saw it in a store. I’ll see what the dealer says and go from there. Thanks for the replies. Very much appreciated. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean-Michel Posted November 26, 2017 Share #6 Posted November 26, 2017 Buying an M9 with an original sensor would be a costly mistake. Leica replaced my sensor twice, once with a simple replacement and then with the new one, both at no cost to me except for the wait. My M9, with thousands of activations, would be a better choice than the one offered to the OP, but it is not for sale. My dealer, in Canada, occasionally lists cameras with the new sensor at good prices with a guarantee from a reputable dealer. I would find a similar dealer near you and let them know of your interest in acquiring a used M9. I have an MP but also have no plan to get rid of the M9. Both work well enough. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted November 26, 2017 Share #7 Posted November 26, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) Not all sensors show the corrosion issue but it's a risk that it might, and that's costly and lengthy to put right. As long as the sensor is fine now, and you negotiate a price to allow for some element of risk then that's about the best you can hope for. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Horne Posted November 26, 2017 Author Share #8 Posted November 26, 2017 (edited) Update. Dealer has just called following my mail. He has current confirmation from a Leica dealer saying that the camera is unaffected and he will stand by that which seems fair. I’ve a dealer local to me and he’s happy to send the camera to me and for the dealer to take a second look and he will take the return if necessary - he says it won’t be so I’m going to have a look at it. Edited November 26, 2017 by Martin Horne Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwesi Posted November 26, 2017 Share #9 Posted November 26, 2017 Just my 2 cents here but unless you specifically want an M9 AND the price is such that you can absorb the cost of sensor replacement, I would stay away. Bottom line is sooner or later you will need a new sensor, secondly its going to be very hard for you to sell at a later date if you decide to upgrade. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mby Posted November 26, 2017 Share #10 Posted November 26, 2017 Update. Dealer has just called following my mail. He has current confirmation from a Leica dealer saying that the camera is unaffected and he will stand by that which seems fair. I’ve a dealer local to me and he’s happy to send the camera to me and for the dealer to take a second look and he will take the return if necessary - he says it won’t be so I’m going to have a look at it. Ask for the serial no. and check with Leica HQ in Wetzlar with regards to the camera's current sensor status... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denys Posted November 26, 2017 Share #11 Posted November 26, 2017 Then there’s the thought of getting the sensor done and having an as new M9 with new sensor for around £2,250 which I’d probably pay If I saw it in a store. Wow - if that price is including a replacement sensor (and associated service) then that’s good for a mint example! If you’re lucky, you won’t need to replace the sensor.. ..but bear in mind if you get unlucky many years from now you may find Leica has no replacement sensors! Bit of a balancing act! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 27, 2017 Share #12 Posted November 27, 2017 Red Dot cameras who advertise in this forum are showing stock of a M9 with a recently replaced sensor and about 2000 actuation for £2300. They usually inc 6 month warranty and they ship worldwide if you are not in the UK. Unless the one you have seen is very cheap as in £1000 to £1100 I would not touch it.When the M10 becomes more readily available the M9 prices will drop further. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted November 27, 2017 Share #13 Posted November 27, 2017 Some US dealers will not sell M9 based cameras without a new sensor. They believe in their warranty. I recently bought an original Monochrom from one of them. Jeff Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DigitalHeMan Posted November 28, 2017 Share #14 Posted November 28, 2017 Update. Dealer has just called following my mail. He has current confirmation from a Leica dealer saying that the camera is unaffected and he will stand by that which seems fair. I’ve a dealer local to me and he’s happy to send the camera to me and for the dealer to take a second look and he will take the return if necessary - he says it won’t be so I’m going to have a look at it. I assume the confirmation he has received means 'currently unaffected', rather than completely unaffected. The only way it would be completely unaffected is if it has already had a sensor replacement Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdlaing Posted November 28, 2017 Share #15 Posted November 28, 2017 I assume the confirmation he has received means 'currently unaffected', rather than completely unaffected. The only way it would be completely unaffected is if it has already had a sensor replacement Not quite true. I have two friends with M-9’s and original sensors. No signs of corrosion yet. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted November 29, 2017 Share #16 Posted November 29, 2017 Not quite true. I have two friends with M-9’s and original sensors. No signs of corrosion yet. Add two more M9s with no corrosion, mine. . Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tobey bilek Posted November 29, 2017 Share #17 Posted November 29, 2017 I have one with no corrosion. Careful cleaning has been my policy, air, then lens pen and loupe if required. Careful and quick lens changes are part of my regimen. In fact the lens pen is my choice for all sensor cleaning although I do wet clean if necessary. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB_tx Posted November 29, 2017 Share #18 Posted November 29, 2017 My M9 sensor was fine for 7 years, but in June I checked closely because of the coming end of free replacement, and found a couple of very small dots that had the characteristics. I would not have noticed them normally. I sent the camera in, and Leica agreed and replaced the sensor. I never wet cleaned the sensor, and it was treated gently. It took 7 years for corrosion to start, so I would assume others that still do not show corrosion may do so at some future time. However, 7 or more years life out of an electronic product of such complexity is still commendable. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DigitalHeMan Posted November 29, 2017 Share #19 Posted November 29, 2017 Not quite true. I have two friends with M-9’s and original sensors. No signs of corrosion yet. Exactly, hence why I said 'currently unaffected'. There's nothing to rule it out from happening at some point in the future unless the sensor has been changed Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
martin_horne Posted November 29, 2017 Share #20 Posted November 29, 2017 I know have the camera and it is as advertised. As new in box and 234 actuations - its a 2010 model going by the serial number. The instruction pack is unopened and all of the warranty cards are there although unfortunately not completed (although i'd imagine this is moot given the age of the camera). I'm talking to Leica about the status of the camera and registering it and have had a positive response so far and have arranged to make a trip to Leica Manchester (who have been very helpful) to have the sensor checked. If its duff it will unfortunately go back under guarantee if not I'll keep it and use it for as long as I can. I've also asked Leica UK about getting the sensor changed in the future and what my/the camera's status will be too and am hoping for a sympathetic response given the camera appears to have been unused for most of its life - lets see... Hoping for a good outcome from my visit to Manchester and then saving for a lens instead of a sensor.. Thank you for all of the advice - I do appreciate I may be taking a risk. Thank you for informing it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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