Leica CL Announced - Mirrorless APS-C Camera with EVF

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So, I have ordered a CL and, after a couple of years' dithering, have finally decided against the Q. It will be interesting to see if this impacts Q sales. I think it might well.

 

Probably  – not just because it's the 'latest and greatest' as reviews suggest – but because it seems to offer much greater flexibility (though no inclusive macro ability) and significant cost saving.

[jaapv]

I think the CL will just about kill Q sales. The CL with pancake and the added versatility of interchangeable lenses is much more competitive. I guess Leica has decided that they have sold about all the Qs they ever will.

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The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

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Another question might be 'is the new 18mm autofocus lens a match for the extraordinary 28 1.7 on the Q (at comparable apertures of course)'.

[wattsy]

I think the CL will just about kill Q sales. The CL with pancake and the added versatility of interchangeable lenses is much more competitive. I guess Leica has decided that they have sold about all the Qs they ever will.

 

 

Possibly but I think that is because all those who were likely to buy a Q (a significant proportion being existing Leica customers) will have already done so rather than because of the CL being a more attractive product. Not all customers will want a system camera.

[helged]

I think the CL will just about kill Q sales. The CL with pancake and the added versatility of interchangeable lenses is much more competitive. I guess Leica has decided that they have sold about all the Qs they ever will.

A higher-res Q may temporarily differentiate the Q from the CL, but then the new Q needs to be out sooner than later, and certainly well before the next incarnation of the CL...

 

With the T, CL and SL systems sharing the same mount and to some degree software, and serving a good chunk of various photogr groups, it's hard to see that the Q - irrespective of it's popularity up to now - can offer something truely unique compared to the L-systems.

 

With the well received M10, the next systems for Leica to upgrade are possibly the S and SL, not the Q. It will be very interesting to see what Leica thinks about the S (sensor resolution, optical/electronic VF, mirror/mirrorless, etc). This in contrast to the SL2 where we can expect more/larger/quicker/etc compared to the existing system.

Edited November 23, 2017 by helged

[ropo54]

The pricing of the Q is not substantially different than the pricing of a stand-alone 28mm summilux lens, so for those wanting a Leica full frame compact camera (with AF as an option)  it certainly fits the bill.

Edited November 23, 2017 by ropo54

[helged]

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The pricing of the Q is not substantially different than the pricing of a stand-alone 28mm summilux lens, so for those wanting a Leica full frame compact camera (with AF as an option) it certainly fits the bill.

Point taken. But the optically very fine to technically outstanding TL/SL lenses, not to mention all manual M, R, etc. lenses, will last 'forever', irrespective of the digital body. This cannot be said about the Q, obviously.

[ropo54]

Point taken. But the optically very fine to technically outstanding TL/SL lenses, not to mention all manual M, R, etc. lenses, will last 'forever', irrespective of the digital body. This cannot be said about the Q, obviously.

 

Yes, but, will the AF mechanism within the TL/SL lenses last forever?    

Edited November 23, 2017 by ropo54

[helged]

Yes, but, will the AF mechanism within the TL/SL lenses last forever?    

 

 

No, not forever, but possibly 'forever' as stated in my post.

 

I would think that AF lenses, with the exception for continuous and very hard use, will survive several generations of digital sensors. And if/when the AF fails, it can be fixed as long as the needed parts are available. Many of the S-users have experience with AF failure (myself included), so this is nothing new for Leica, or other vendors, I assume.

 

It would be interesting to know how many years after production one can expect to get a lens fixed for AF failure. Quite some years, I would believe, but I don't know. So 'forever' in quotation marks is long compared to a typical lifespan of a digital sensor, Q included, but certainly not forever.

[LocalHero1953]

Off to collect my CL from Leica Mayfair :-)

No 18mn yet :-(

[Go Figure]

If Leica had any love or consideration for the working photographer 

we would have a "LEICA QL" by now 

not another Panasonicesque derivate ... go figure!

Edited November 23, 2017 by Mark Ebert

[jaapv]

I would say that, if any "real" Leica camera can be said to be a Panasonic derivate, it would be the Q. Open it up and you will see "Panasonic" plastered over just about every component. (Not my observation, but of a top-level Leica expert) - certainly not a bad thing, either.

The X-series, which appears to have donated quite a bit of its DNA to the CL, is considerably more a Leica in-house design.

[thighslapper]

Off to collect my CL from Leica Mayfair :-)

No 18mn yet :-(

 

..... by implication does that indicate there is general shipping of units going on ...... ??? 

 

Leica are notoriously vague about releases, numbers, actual distribution and timings..... 

 

No doubt it will be the usual  one or two (if very lucky) for most of the bigger dealers worldwide and then a famine for 6-8 weeks whilst they wait for the 'lucky few' to tell them if the lugs fall off or not (or worse), before they make any more ..... 

 

Have fun  !

Edited November 23, 2017 by thighslapper

[LocalHero1953]

They have 4 in a shipment today, all of which have buyers.

They mentioned that Red Dot also had stock that they had sold.

[wlaidlaw]

They have 4 in a shipment today, all of which have buyers.

They mentioned that Red Dot also had stock that they had sold.

 

Hopefully that means my dealer should have mine very soon. 

[thighslapper]

They have 4 in a shipment today, all of which have buyers.

They mentioned that Red Dot also had stock that they had sold.

 

......that's quite encouraging for those with acute GAS.

[scott kirkpatrick]

My dealer has to wait for Leica USA, never the most organized of folks, to break things down and send them out.  And I may not be the very first in the line.

[jmschuh]

I would never change my Q for a CL with the 18mm F2.8 pancake lens.
 
The CL is missing a 35mm full frame sensor, the aperture ring, the fixed shutter speed dial and fixed exposure correction dial which never change function in relation to the camera mode as with the CL, the built in image stabilizer, the higher resolution viewfinder and the ultra short flash synchronisation.
 
The 18mm F2.8 pancake isn't as good as the Q-Summilux (reviews of the 18mm are online now and more will follow) and will only look like a full frame 28mm F4 in terms of depth of field. With this 18mm F2.8 I need a higher ISO setting at a low light level with a sensor which is more noise prone because it´s APS-C (compare the Sony APS-C vs. Q sensor at DPReview with high ISO)  and even more high ISO, because of the need of a shorter shutter speed because of the missing image stabilizer. 
 
Why should I pay the same prize for a worse solution?
 
The CL will not cut the Q sales. Two different concepts for different customers. The CL can be a supplement to the Q, but never a replacement.
 
And for jaapv: Look at the CL Firmware and menus und you will see, that the CL has the same DNA as the Q. The CL looks from outside like a modern X, but the inner values of the CL are far away from the X line. The CL was developed in cooperation with panasonic as the Q, no difference.
 

I guess Leica has decided that they have sold about all the Qs they ever will.

 
 
If so, Leica would not have just released a new version of the Q.

[AndreasB]

If the Q-ooc-jpegs would be nicer (for me), I would buy it once more. I liked it otherwise very much. Its a fantastic camera.  I liked it so much for available light use!!!!!

So the CL has for me the main advantage that its more compact for my special use. Without my special need the Q would be a big advantage for me.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[jaapv]

Available light? OOC JPG? Hmmm...