logan2z Posted October 19, 2017 Share #1 Posted October 19, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) I recently purchased my first Leica M camera, an M-A. I've only owned it for a short time but I'm already in love with it. I just started to make my first darkroom prints and have been enjoying the learning process thus far. The first few prints I've made are 8x10s. I didn't want to crop my images at all so I've been scaling down the image slightly on the enlarger so as to print the full frame on an 8x10 easel. I noticed that my prints all had rounded corners rather than sharp 90 degree corners. I took a look at my negatives under a loupe and see that the corners of the exposed images do, in fact, have round corners. I don't see this in the scans of my images and I'm guessing that the scanner's negative carrier is masking off the corners and producing nice 90 degree angles. So, my question is, is this normal or is there something out of whack with the camera? Or is there some novice mistake I'm making that may be responsible for this? If it's relevant, I've used a 35mm Summarit ASPH lens with hood attached to shoot all of my photos with the M-A and they all show this characteristic. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 Hi logan2z, Take a look here Leica M-A Negatives - Rounded corners?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
logan2z Posted October 19, 2017 Author Share #2 Posted October 19, 2017 I probably should have mentioned that I'm shooting Tri-X 400. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Geschlecht Posted October 19, 2017 Share #3 Posted October 19, 2017 Hello Logan, Welcome to the Forum. When you look at the film frame in the camera, when you open the bottom & lift up the back: What do the corners of the film frame look like?Best Regards, Michael Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
logan2z Posted October 19, 2017 Author Share #4 Posted October 19, 2017 (edited) Hello Logan, Welcome to the Forum. When you look at the film frame in the camera, when you open the bottom & lift up the back: What do the corners of the film frame look like? Best Regards, Michael Thanks Michael. I took a close look at the corners of the film frame and, lo and behold, they certainly look rounded to me. I guess I should have thought to look before posting. The next obvious question is, is that normal? I did spend some time searching for other discussion threads that mentioned this but came up pretty empty. It is pretty subtle until you blow up the negative on an enlarger. Edited October 19, 2017 by logan2z Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Geschlecht Posted October 19, 2017 Share #5 Posted October 19, 2017 (edited) Hello Logan, I just went & checked: Nice square corners here with an M3. By "rounded" do you mean rounded as it would be in a Kodachrome slide or on the 50mm frame of an M3 range/viewfinder? Or do you mean: Just a tiny rounding in each corner? How many times did you enlarge the image in order to see the rounding? By the way, do you have an instruction booklet? If you do: It should have a section devoted to what the film gate looks like. Do you have a way to put a photo of your film gate here in this Thread? Curious. Please follow up & continue here. Best Regards, Michael Edited October 19, 2017 by Michael Geschlecht 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abram Posted October 19, 2017 Share #6 Posted October 19, 2017 I'll check out some of my M-A negatives when I get home from work and report what I find. I think it also is somewhat lens dependent because I recall that when I was using a 21mm Super Angulon the frame spacing was almost non-existant where using something like a 50mm Summicron or Elmar produced more distinct spacing (and edges). 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
logan2z Posted October 20, 2017 Author Share #7 Posted October 20, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hello Logan, I just went & checked: Nice square corners here with an M3. By "rounded" do you mean rounded as it would be in a Kodachrome slide or on the 50mm frame of an M3 range/viewfinder? Or do you mean: Just a tiny rounding in each corner? How many times did you enlarge the image in order to see the rounding? By the way, do you have an instruction booklet? If you do: It should have a section devoted to what the film gate looks like. Do you have a way to put a photo of your film gate here in this Thread? Curious. Please follow up & continue here. Best Regards, Michael It's a pretty subtle rounding in each corner when looking at the film gate (and the negatives), but much more pronounced when the image is enlarged. Not exactly sure how many times the image was enlarged, but it filled up a good portion of an 8x10 sheet of photo paper. So a pretty decent amount of magnification. I checked the instruction booklet and don't see any detailed information or images relating to the film gate. I'll see if I can get a good enough photo of the corners of the film gate and post it here. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
logan2z Posted October 20, 2017 Author Share #8 Posted October 20, 2017 I'll check out some of my M-A negatives when I get home from work and report what I find. I think it also is somewhat lens dependent because I recall that when I was using a 21mm Super Angulon the frame spacing was almost non-existant where using something like a 50mm Summicron or Elmar produced more distinct spacing (and edges). That would be great, thanks so much! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
logan2z Posted October 20, 2017 Author Share #9 Posted October 20, 2017 Here's a quick photo of the corner of my print so you can see the level of roundedness I'm talking about. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Geschlecht Posted October 20, 2017 Share #10 Posted October 20, 2017 (edited) Hello Logan, What portion of how big of an enlargement are we writing about here? !/4, 1/6 1/12 ? OF: 4 X, 10 X, 20 X ? That is to ask: How many centimeters is the right side portion in the photo on this Thread & how many centimeters is the bottom portion of the photo in this Thread. NOT the size of the photo they were abstracted from. Best Regards, Michael Edited October 20, 2017 by Michael Geschlecht Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
logan2z Posted October 20, 2017 Author Share #11 Posted October 20, 2017 Hello Logan, What portion of how big of an enlargement are we writing about here? !/4, 1/6 1/12 ? OF: 4 X, 10 X, 20 X ? That is to ask: How many centimeters is the right side portion in the photo on this Thread & how many centimeters is the bottom portion of the photo in this Thread. NOT the size of the photo they were abstracted from. Best Regards, Michael The right side white border is 2.5 cm and the bottom white border is 1.25 cm. Hopefully I'm answering the question you are asking. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Geschlecht Posted October 20, 2017 Share #12 Posted October 20, 2017 Hello Logan, You are doing just fine. And How many centimeters by how many centimeters is the entire photo. Having asked that question: I am now going to have to change into a pumpkin for a while. I will be back. This gives you time to measure the dimensions of the entire photo. Best Regards, Michael Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
logan2z Posted October 20, 2017 Author Share #13 Posted October 20, 2017 Hello Logan, You are doing just fine. And How many centimeters by how many centimeters is the entire photo. Having asked that question: I am now going to have to change into a pumpkin for a while. I will be back. This gives you time to measure the dimensions of the entire photo. Best Regards, Michael The photo is 15.25 cm wide by 23.25 cm high. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
almoore Posted October 20, 2017 Share #14 Posted October 20, 2017 Here's a quick photo of the corner of my print so you can see the level of roundedness I'm talking about.The rounding comes from the negative carrier. Most negative carriers crop into the image area, which is why a lot of people file them out to show the full frame and also give a black border. Regarding the differing aspect ratio of the film frame and 10x8 paper, A4 is an alternative paper size with the same aspect ratio as the frame. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
logan2z Posted October 20, 2017 Author Share #15 Posted October 20, 2017 (edited) Regarding the differing aspect ratio of the film frame and 10x8 paper, A4 is an alternative paper size with the same aspect ratio as the frame. That was my original thought as well, but I see the rounding on my negatives and didn't see any rounded corners on the negative carrier(s) that I tried. Edited October 20, 2017 by logan2z Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
almoore Posted October 20, 2017 Share #16 Posted October 20, 2017 That was my original thought as well, but I see the rounding on my negatives and didn't see any rounded corners on the negative carrier(s) that I tried. If this was from the full frame of the negative it would print as black on the outer side of the curve. 3 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
logan2z Posted October 20, 2017 Author Share #17 Posted October 20, 2017 If this was from the full frame of the negative it would print as black on the outer side of the curve.Hmm that's true. Maybe the rounded corners I'm seeing on my negatives is a red herring. I did try multiple negative carriers in order to eliminate them as a cause and the prints came out the same. I also didn't see any rounding of their corners. I can't explain it. I guess I'll have another close look at the negative carriers and see if I overlooked something. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
avatar230 Posted October 20, 2017 Share #18 Posted October 20, 2017 I agree with the commenters who say those rounded corners look like the negative carrier not the camera. That said, I have both an M-A and an M4, and while my M4 aperture is close to a perfect rectangle, my M-A aperture wobbles ever-so-slightly slightly on the right and left edges. Not easy to see by eye looking at the aperture itself, but apparent on a full-frame scan. My friend's M-A is the same way. As Leica's apertures are filed out larger than the 36x24mm standard (my M-A is close to 36.9mm x 24.7mm at its widest points), it's not something I worry too much about. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham (G4FUJ) Posted October 20, 2017 Share #19 Posted October 20, 2017 I rather like those rounded corners! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
logan2z Posted October 20, 2017 Author Share #20 Posted October 20, 2017 I rather like those rounded corners! Maybe I should just stop trying to eliminate them then Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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