Leica R-Adapter-L Issue

[relms]

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A few days ago I acquired an R 280mm f/4-TELYT-R ROM (late #374...) lens in mint condition, virtually indistinguishable from a new one.  This is my first R lens, and I acquired it in lieu of the excellent Leica 90-280 Vario-Elmarit-SL for reasons unrelated to this topic.  Needing an adapter, I purchased the Leica R-Adapter-L, instead of a less costly third party adapter.

 

Today marked my first outing with the lens, and I couldn't be more pleased with this setup, except for one issue I encountered.  The fit between the camera and the adapter is snug, with no movement whatsoever; however, the fit between the adapter and the lens is not so perfect.  When fully engaged, I can twist the lens and it exhibits some slight back and forth movement between the lens and the adapter, perhaps less than one degree, but enough to cause concern, especially given the snug fit at the camera end. This is the only R lenses I own, and so I cannot test the setup with other lenses.

 

I have both the Leica M-Adaper-L and the S-Adapter-L, and I have found no issues with either of them.

 

I am sure that there are others with this R-Adapter-L setup, and I would love to hear from you.  Has anyone else encountered this issue?  

 

Thanks,

Robert

[ropo54]

A few days ago I acquired an R 280mm f/4-TELYT-R ROM (late #374...) lens in mint condition, virtually indistinguishable from a new one.  This is my first R lens, and I acquired it in lieu of the excellent Leica 90-280 Vario-Elmarit-SL for reasons unrelated to this topic.  Needing an adapter, I purchased the Leica R-Adapter-L, instead of a less costly third party adapter.

 

Today marked my first outing with the lens, and I couldn't be more pleased with this setup, except for one issue I encountered.  The fit between the camera and the adapter is snug, with no movement whatsoever; however, the fit between the adapter and the lens is not so perfect.  When fully engaged, I can twist the lens and it exhibits some slight back and forth movement between the lens and the adapter, perhaps less than one degree, but enough to cause concern, especially given the snug fit at the camera end. This is the only R lenses I own, and so I cannot test the setup with other lenses.

 

I have both the Leica M-Adaper-L and the S-Adapter-L, and I have found no issues with either of them.

 

I am sure that there are others with this R-Adapter-L setup, and I would love to hear from you.  Has anyone else encountered this issue?  

 

Thanks,

Robert

 

I have the Novaflex R to M adapter for the SL601 along with 3 R lenses (80 1.4, 80-200, 60 2.8 macro); all of the R lenses fit perfectly without any "back an forth".

Rob

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[ramarren]

What causes the side to side movement is a bit of extra clearance between the bayonet locking pin and the slot on the lens flange. Most of my lenses, which are old, show a very little bit of this ... wear from their age and use. While the slot on the lens flange could be slightly oversize and slightly out of tolerance, it is much more likely that the pin on the lens is worn from use and age.

 

A little bit of slop is nothing to worry about. A lot is worriesome as it might mean the pin is badly worn. Examine the pin on your lens and measure it ... see how it matches another couple of R lenses. If you try another couple of R lenses on it and they all show "too much" slop, exchange the adapter for another and see if it goes away.

[helged]

I can confirm that there is a slight twist on my 280 f4 APO R as well, but as long as this doesnt develop (it hasn't over 5 years of use), I don't think about it at all... Lovely piece of glass!

[relms]

Thank you, helged, rammeren, and ropo54, for your comments and suggestions.  Upon further testing, I have confirmed that the issue is real and not to be ignored.  I had a few minutes yesterday and today to do some testing, and I have confirmed that a light leak is happening at the joint between either the lens and the adapter, or between the adapter and the camera, and not where the ND10 filter attaches to the lens at the front end. I took a 45-second exposure using the Lee Big Stopper, and here is the resulting image:

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Next, I took the same 45 second exposure with my hand covering the camera-adapter-lens joints, and I got no leaks. I will do more testing tomorrow by taping first one joint and then the other to determine which joint is the the source of the leak.  

 

If the leak happens at the joint between the adapter and the camera, then obviously the lens is not at fault; however, if the leak occurs at the joint between the lens and the adapter, then I will still be unable to determine if the problem is with the lens or with the adapter without trying a different R lens, which I do not have. I suspect that the leak is occurring at the lens-adapter joint since this is where I find some play that does not occur at the camera-adapter joint.

 

Your thoughts and suggestions would be appreciated.

 

-Robert

[ropo54]

Assuming no local camera shop to test options, you might consider ordering a new adapter which might help isolate the problem. If your adapter is "bad" return it and keep the newly purchased one. Obviously, if it is the lens, you will know what to do.

 

If you have the M to SL adapter, it might be a tad less expensive to simply add the R to M adapter. (My novaflex R to M cost about $225 from B&H).

 

Good luck.

Rob

[steppenw0lf]

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This error message makes me wonder where the problem sits.

We will see, but I rather do not expect to see the problem with the adapter (after all it is original equipment).

Rather I wonder about the 4/280 lens.

Because they are "famous" many have tinkered around with them and e.g. adapted them to Nikon or other mounts - for example with the leitax system.

At the end, when they had enough and wanted to sell the lens at the best price, they turn everything back and reinstall the R mount. But who knows if this has been done with the necessary precision.

Of course all these lenses are "in perfect order" and usually people do not mention that they have been used on other systems. 

I have actually never seen in any auction a single lens that was "re-mounted" - though we know that many users did exactly that.

 

In this case you might actually have to send it to Leica to get it "serviced".

 

I am really interested to hear what the problem is.

[graeme_clarke]

Hello,

 

I've just checked my Leica R-L adapter with both a R f2.8 100mm ROM  macro and a R f2.8 180mm ROM.  Neither have been adapted for other fittings.  There is a slight movement where the round pin of the adapter fits into the slot on the lens which, on close examination, is caused by the slight side to side  movement of the round spring-loaded pin where it protrudes from the hole in the adapter body. I don't know what the tolerances are but there will have to be sufficient to allow clearance for the spring loaded pin in the adapter body or it will stick, and also I assume for it to fit into the slot in the lens to allow for slight differences in the bayonets.  

 

I've not tried it with a big stopper but I've no problem with light leakage on long exposures with the macro lens (up to 12s)

 

I did have a Novoflex adapter to fit R lenses to a Sony A7R (E mount).  It leaked light both where it fitted onto the body, and where the lens fitted onto it.  Sony was aware of the problem and produced a "solution" -  a rubber ring that went over the adapter-body joint and release button, and I used a wide rubber band over the lens-adapter joint.  It was the only way to handle exposures over 1s!!!

 

If you are sure your lens is OK, and the fit of the spring loaded pin in your adapter is too sloppy and letting in light then I think you should ask for a replacement...

 

Graeme

[phongph]

Hello,

 

I've just checked my Leica R-L adapter with both a R f2.8 100mm ROM macro and a R f2.8 180mm ROM. Neither have been adapted for other fittings. There is a slight movement where the round pin of the adapter fits into the slot on the lens which, on close examination, is caused by the slight side to side movement of the round spring-loaded pin where it protrudes from the hole in the adapter body. I don't know what the tolerances are but there will have to be sufficient to allow clearance for the spring loaded pin in the adapter body or it will stick, and also I assume for it to fit into the slot in the lens to allow for slight differences in the bayonets.

 

I've not tried it with a big stopper but I've no problem with light leakage on long exposures with the macro lens (up to 12s)

 

I did have a Novoflex adapter to fit R lenses to a Sony A7R (E mount). It leaked light both where it fitted onto the body, and where the lens fitted onto it. Sony was aware of the problem and produced a "solution" - a rubber ring that went over the adapter-body joint and release button, and I used a wide rubber band over the lens-adapter joint. It was the only way to handle exposures over 1s!!!

 

If you are sure your lens is OK, and the fit of the spring loaded pin in your adapter is too sloppy and letting in light then I think you should ask for a replacement...

 

 

Graeme

Hi Graeme_clarke!

Please post some images of R Apo 180 f2.8 on SL 601, esp. the portrait!

Ps: your len is v1 or v2?

Have a nice day!

Many thanks!

Edited August 30, 2017 by phongph

[graeme_clarke]

Hi Graeme_clarke!

Please post some images of R Apo 180 f2.8 on SL 601, esp. the portrait!

Ps: your len is v1 or v2?

Have a nice day!

Many thanks!

 

Hello,

 

I'll do my best to reply to your questions.

 

I'm unsure about the version of my 180 lens - it is  Apo-Elmarit -R f2.8 180 number 3840313. Focus turns past the infinity mark.

 

I've attached 5 images.  Here are

L1030320 is with the 100 macro.  60s at f22 iso 100

L1030325 is with the 100 macro   24s at f22 iso 100

 

These two are in the next post

L1050909 is with the 180 1/500s at f6.8 iso 640

L1050913 is with the 180 1/400s at f 6.8 iso 1600

 

This one is in the post after the next!

L1050914  is with the 180 1/400s at f6.8 iso 320

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

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[graeme_clarke]

Here are the next two image files

 

L1050909 is with the 180 1/500s at f6.8 iso 640

L1050913 is with the 180 1/400s at f 6.8 iso 1600

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

[graeme_clarke]

And this is the last image:

 

L1050914  is with the 180 1/400s at f6.8 iso 320

[graeme_clarke]

And this is the last image:

 

L1050914  is with the 180 1/400s at f6.8 iso 320

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

[phongph]

Hi Graeme_clarke!

Many thanks for your images!

Could You post some more images of R Apo 180f2.8 at 2.8 on SL 601 for the portrait? I would like to see its bokeh!

Have a good day!

Thanks again!

[graeme_clarke]

Hello Phongh,

 

It is not a lens I use very often at all so I don't have any true portrait images though I may be able to take some in a couple of weeks -  please be patient - careful though as your request may be a diversion from this thread!

 

best wishes,

 

Graeme

[helged]

Thank you, helged, rammeren, and ropo54, for your comments and suggestions.  Upon further testing, I have confirmed that the issue is real and not to be ignored.  I had a few minutes yesterday and today to do some testing, and I have confirmed that a light leak is happening at the joint between either the lens and the adapter, or between the adapter and the camera, and not where the ND10 filter attaches to the lens at the front end. I took a 45-second exposure using the Lee Big Stopper, and here is the resulting image:

L1000370.jpg

 

Next, I took the same 45 second exposure with my hand covering the camera-adapter-lens joints, and I got no leaks. I will do more testing tomorrow by taping first one joint and then the other to determine which joint is the the source of the leak.  

 

If the leak happens at the joint between the adapter and the camera, then obviously the lens is not at fault; however, if the leak occurs at the joint between the lens and the adapter, then I will still be unable to determine if the problem is with the lens or with the adapter without trying a different R lens, which I do not have. I suspect that the leak is occurring at the lens-adapter joint since this is where I find some play that does not occur at the camera-adapter joint.

 

Your thoughts and suggestions would be appreciated.

 

-Robert

 

 

I have not seen this - but I have not been playing with (very) long shutter speeds with SL+280APO at all. But I can run through some tests in the weekend with different adapters to see whether I get the leak.

 

Light leak during long exposers is well known with the M-bayonet, see e.g. this thread, with a black hair band successfully blocking the light leak in post #24. Others use some fabric or a rubber band to 'seal' the bayonet.

Edited August 31, 2017 by helged

[relms]

I have not seen this - but I have not been playing with (very) long shutter speeds with SL+280APO at all. But I can run through some tests in the weekend with different adapters to see whether I get the leak.

 

Light leak during long exposers is well known with the M-bayonet, see e.g. this thread, with a black hair band successfully blocking the light leak in post #24. Others use some fabric or a rubber band to 'seal' the bayonet.

 

helged, I am anxious to learn what you discover with your tests.  I have ordered another Leica adapter to try, but unfortunately due to he Labor Day holiday, it will not arrive before Tuesday.  I feel certain I could solve the leak with a couple of rubber bands, but that would be akin to buying a Porsche, and then using duct tape and baling wire to hold the hood down.  

Edited September 1, 2017 by relms

[relms]

Okay, I have identified the source of the light leak; it is at the upper right quadrant (facing the front of the camera) where the Leica-R-Adapter-L attaches to the APO-Telyt-R 280/4.0 lens.  

 

Using the technique found at the link provided in helged's #16 post, above, I took a 32 second exposure with the lens cap attached while shining a flashlight on the adapter-lens joint.  The resulting image showed a major light leak.  Next, I placed a black hair band (not mine) around the joint, and took another 32-second exposure while using the flashlight as before.  No leak.  None.  

 

I tested the camera-adapter joint and found no light leak there without the hair band covering the joint.  Now, the question becomes, is it the adapter, or is it the lens?  Without another R lens to test, I still can't say.  One thing is certain, the adapter-lens joint is far from perfect.

 

I will have another adapter to test on Tuesday, but in the meantime, I welcome your input, one and all.

 

Thanks,

Robert

[tritentrue]

Robert, some mount modifications of the 280/4 require removal of the black shroud that fits between the mount and the rearmost element.  If the mount was previously changed and the shroud not put back inside the lens, that would explain the leak.

 

I had not commented on this thread previously because my 280 is third cam, not ROM; and I use a combination of the R-Adapter-M and M-Adapter-T with it.  This combination of adapters, used extensively over the past few years, has no looseness nor rotational play and has so far shown no signs of material deterioration.

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Hallo,

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[relms]

I tried another Leica R-Adapter-L, and found that the problem persists.  I am unwilling to resort to gaffer tape and hair bands in order to use R lenses on my SL, and so the 280/4 goes back to the seller.