wlaidlaw Posted February 25, 2019 Share #41 Posted February 25, 2019 Advertisement (gone after registration) Dunk, What concerns me is not the lenses failing but the R8/9 cameras. Since my researches earlier this month, discovered that there seem to be zero spare parts available and no designated repairer, I feel that making a major investment in R lenses would be foolhardy. Over the last 12 months, there have been a number of threads started by folks with R8/9 problems. Given the finite life of electronics on these mostly 15 years old or more cameras, this should come as no shock. The late and fast ROM lens prices are about or not far short of the same prices as SL lenses, which I am sure are even better than the R. In a recent interview by Thorsten Overgaard of Peter Karbe, PK claimed that the SL lenses would have no problem with providing enough resolution, not to be the limiting factor on a 100MP FF sensor. Although the R lenses are good, I doubt they are quite that good. With the 5 R fit lenses I have, 24/2.8, 50/2, 80/2.8 (TS-Hartblei), 80-200/4 and 2X APO Extender, I cover a pretty good range. The only R lens I will probably add, is the 21-35 Vario-Elmar R. Wilson Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted February 25, 2019 Posted February 25, 2019 Hi wlaidlaw, Take a look here R Lens Prices. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
dkCambridgeshire Posted February 25, 2019 Share #42 Posted February 25, 2019 Wilson, Leica R8/R9 cameras' potential fragility is a 'known' and it's unfortunate that repairs are difficult and in some cases impossible. However, there are alternatives e.g. the R6.2 … in fact all the R3-R7 series can safely be used with ROM lenses. I have an R9 and an R8 - purely for DMR use - but the R8 is the 'spare' in case the R9 fails. If they both fail, I'll likely buy another - they're reasonably priced and for the envisaged amount of use will likely be OK for more than a few years. The s/h R8/R9 supply chain is still pretty good. SL lenses offer superior performance to R lenses - but how many Leica enthusiasts really need future proofing for 100MP cameras? I'm more than happy with my Sony A7SII's 12.2MP which will likely 'whoop' any current digital Leica camera in low light situations - and enable A3+ prints - and provide a mirrorless platform for my R lenses. Modern mirrorless cameras, both Leica and non-Leica, maintain the demand for R lenses - and likely more so than Leica R film cameras. The more sought after ROM lens exotica is expensive but that's because the demand is there - and it shows no sign of waning. Buy an expensive 'exotic' R lens knowing that it's usable on just about any FF mirrorless camera … and that is has good resale potential. Furthermore, some non-exotic R lens designs are almost identical to the equivalent M lenses - but the R versions can cost far less. Best wishes dunk 2 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted February 25, 2019 Share #43 Posted February 25, 2019 You can buy R4 bodies in working order for £100 so I don't see lack of parts a major issue. I guess at some point R body prices will start to climb as the number in working condition dwindle. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ulluru Posted February 27, 2019 Share #44 Posted February 27, 2019 (edited) On 2/24/2019 at 4:56 PM, dkCambridgeshire said: Which R lens do I regret buying? 35-70/4 R … designed by Leica and made by Kyocera … it's hopeless for city night photography due to its ineffective lens hood . I just bought one of those... still on its way... Is it really that bad? Is there too much difference (IQ) betwin R and the SL lenses? Edited February 27, 2019 by ulluru Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bags27 Posted February 27, 2019 Share #45 Posted February 27, 2019 (edited) Just received the 80-200 f/4 and quick shots with the CL show how very sharp it is, and beautiful colors. Delivered for under $1k US. The 2x converter (around $500) is sitting in the postoffice waiting to be picked up. With the CL, it will be 240-600mm f/8 at an extremely reasonable price. Jono had some good things to say about the R mount (scroll down). https://www.reddotforum.com/content/2015/01/a-year-with-the-leica-t-typ-701/ I have heard that even better than the 60 macro is the 100 macro, which some say may be the finest macro lens ever built. Both can take an adapter for true 1:1. And, if the R mount 35-70 f/4 is a bit slow, the Angenieux 35-70 f/2.5-3.3 (R mount) is supposedly pretty much as good optically and I believe weighs only a few ounces more (plastic parts, I think) and costs even less. Louis used to use that to great success on the CL thread. I'm thinking about this as a c. 50-100 mm travel lens on the CL. Edited February 27, 2019 by bags27 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ulluru Posted February 27, 2019 Share #46 Posted February 27, 2019 bags27, Actually, i got my 80-200 f/4 last week and i'm loving it so far! I was thinking to get the 2x extender, but... there are 2 of them... which one did you get? Could you share some pictures when you get it please? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bags27 Posted February 27, 2019 Share #47 Posted February 27, 2019 Advertisement (gone after registration) 17 minutes ago, ulluru said: bags27, Actually, i got my 80-200 f/4 last week and i'm loving it so far! I was thinking to get the 2x extender, but... there are 2 of them... which one did you get? Could you share some pictures when you get it please? I got the ROM (11269)--at least that's what's promised. Crossing my fingers when I pick it up. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ulluru Posted February 27, 2019 Share #48 Posted February 27, 2019 Good luck! Hope you can post some pictures when you ge it! 😃 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted February 27, 2019 Share #49 Posted February 27, 2019 I too just bought the 2X extender for use with my 80-200/4. I went for the non-ROM APO on the basis that it is identical optically to the ROM version and the only upside of the ROM version is corrected -2EV reporting of aperture in the VF of an R8 or 9. The Non-ROM Extender was over £200 cheaper than the APO. I am not a big user of long lenses, so it will be a very occasional lens. If you are going to use the Extender with the R adapter L on either an SL, CL or T camera, please see this thread I started about the mounting procedure you have to follow or the lenses will not mount. I think the APO extender does reduce contrast noticeably and accentuates any haze on the 80/200, which given that it was designed for the APO 180 and APO 280 lenses, rather than zooms, should not be a great surprise. If you use it on a tripod, there is a benefit therefore, to using a polarising filter or at least a UV filter. I have just purchased one of the new B+W Nano coated UV filters, as my previous e60 UV filter was at least 50 years old and had seen better days. I already had a E60 polariser for using with my 50/0.95 Noctilux. Wilson Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hektor Posted February 27, 2019 Share #50 Posted February 27, 2019 Wilson, your 11 262 Apo-Extender-R 2X might need cleaning. I have tested mine very carefully on the back of the same lens, the Vario-Elmar-R 1:4 / 80-200 and find both faultless. My Vario-Elmar-R 1:4 / 35-70 had to go back under warranty as an internal element was decentered. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boojay Posted February 27, 2019 Share #51 Posted February 27, 2019 2 hours ago, bags27 said: I got the ROM (11269)--at least that's what's promised. Crossing my fingers when I pick it up. Makes no difference ROM or not - only if using on R8 or R9. Enjoy, nice to have that extra reach available. What advantages does the ROM-version of the APO-Extender 2x offer? The ROM chip on the tele-converter makes it possible to transmit certain lens-specific information to the Leica R8 or R9 cameras. However, the strip of electrical contacts on the Extender-R does not have any benefit if used with a non-ROM lens or with a camera other than the R8 or R9. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
masjah Posted February 27, 2019 Share #52 Posted February 27, 2019 12 minutes ago, Boojay said: Makes no difference ROM or not - only if using on R8 or R9. Enjoy, nice to have that extra reach available. What advantages does the ROM-version of the APO-Extender 2x offer? The ROM chip on the tele-converter makes it possible to transmit certain lens-specific information to the Leica R8 or R9 cameras. However, the strip of electrical contacts on the Extender-R does not have any benefit if used with a non-ROM lens or with a camera other than the R8 or R9. Actually, there is an actual disadvantage when using the following combination: (1) R8 or R9 camera (2) ROM 2X Apo extender (3) non ROM 3-cam or single R-cam lens. Under these circumstances the lens aperture setting is not passed to the camera at all. I think this is a design flaw in the logic of the combination. My theory is that, as soon as you mount a ROM extender on the R8/R9, the camera tries to get the lens aperture setting electronically only via the ROM contacts. Then, when you mount a non ROM lens, the extender microprocessor gets no electronic information from the lens to pass on to the camera. I've got an elderly 135/2.8 3-cam R that exhibits this, as do my friend's 3-cam lenses. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted February 27, 2019 Share #53 Posted February 27, 2019 1 hour ago, hektor said: Wilson, your 11 262 Apo-Extender-R 2X might need cleaning. I have tested mine very carefully on the back of the same lens, the Vario-Elmar-R 1:4 / 80-200 and find both faultless. My Vario-Elmar-R 1:4 / 35-70 had to go back under warranty as an internal element was decentered. I had a good look through it with a UV LED torch and it seemed fine. Both end surfaces needed a good clean with a Zeiss pre-wetted lens tissue. I notice the same thing with the very similar Zeiss Mutar II 2X extender. I think it is just a consequence of adding a lot of additional glass and air surfaces between the object and the imaging medium. Wilson Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkCambridgeshire Posted February 27, 2019 Share #54 Posted February 27, 2019 4 hours ago, wlaidlaw said: I too just bought the 2X extender for use with my 80-200/4. I went for the non-ROM APO on the basis that it is identical optically to the ROM version and the only upside of the ROM version is corrected -2EV reporting of aperture in the VF of an R8 or 9. The Non-ROM Extender was over £200 cheaper than the APO. I am not a big user of long lenses, so it will be a very occasional lens. If you are going to use the Extender with the R adapter L on either an SL, CL or T camera, please see this thread I started about the mounting procedure you have to follow or the lenses will not mount. I think the APO extender does reduce contrast noticeably and accentuates any haze on the 80/200, which given that it was designed for the APO 180 and APO 280 lenses, rather than zooms, should not be a great surprise. If you use it on a tripod, there is a benefit therefore, to using a polarising filter or at least a UV filter. I have just purchased one of the new B+W Nano coated UV filters, as my previous e60 UV filter was at least 50 years old and had seen better days. I already had a E60 polariser for using with my 50/0.95 Noctilux. Wilson 1 hour ago, wlaidlaw said: I had a good look through it with a UV LED torch and it seemed fine. Both end surfaces needed a good clean with a Zeiss pre-wetted lens tissue. I notice the same thing with the very similar Zeiss Mutar II 2X extender. I think it is just a consequence of adding a lot of additional glass and air surfaces between the object and the imaging medium. Wilson The R 80-200/4 built-in lens hood is not impressive having just 35mm depth. I'm awaiting an adapter ring enabling use of a Lee hood on my lens … maybe not everyone's cuppa but experience with other lenses has proved its worth … and it's not so heavy as it appears. dunk Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/275905-r-lens-prices/?do=findComment&comment=3692060'>More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted February 27, 2019 Share #55 Posted February 27, 2019 I have a double Cokin hood for their P filter system, which I will try but I am not sure if I have a 60mm ring. I may have a 62 ring and a 60-62 step up ring. What I do have is the large hood with suckers on it, for taking pictures through glass without reflections and that might be the easiest and best answer. Now just off to take my Morgan Three Wheeler to the transport contractors in south west London to get it out to France on a truck, before the Brexit nonsense might impact. Wilson 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bags27 Posted February 28, 2019 Share #56 Posted February 28, 2019 (edited) Just picked up my extender from the postoffice. Right, I meant that the key is APO, which this is (as well as ROM, which is, as folks say, useless for me). Really, really clean and mint-like for a bit over $500 from an excellent ebay seller in the U.S. with lots of Leica products, so I'm happy. I'm in the house today, so looking for birds out the window. All I could see is my plastic owl on my porch 😀 (with the CL, 80-200 r mount, and extender; 800 ISO; 1/1250; f/4) shot through a glass window. Didn't quite nail the eye--need some practice with this kit. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Edited February 28, 2019 by bags27 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/275905-r-lens-prices/?do=findComment&comment=3692805'>More sharing options...
ramarren Posted March 3, 2019 Share #57 Posted March 3, 2019 On 2/25/2019 at 12:10 AM, wlaidlaw said: Dunk, What concerns me is not the lenses failing but the R8/9 cameras. Since my researches earlier this month, discovered that there seem to be zero spare parts available and no designated repairer, I feel that making a major investment in R lenses would be foolhardy. Over the last 12 months, there have been a number of threads started by folks with R8/9 problems. Given the finite life of electronics on these mostly 15 years old or more cameras, this should come as no shock. The late and fast ROM lens prices are about or not far short of the same prices as SL lenses, which I am sure are even better than the R. In a recent interview by Thorsten Overgaard of Peter Karbe, PK claimed that the SL lenses would have no problem with providing enough resolution, not to be the limiting factor on a 100MP FF sensor. Although the R lenses are good, I doubt they are quite that good. With the 5 R fit lenses I have, 24/2.8, 50/2, 80/2.8 (TS-Hartblei), 80-200/4 and 2X APO Extender, I cover a pretty good range. The only R lens I will probably add, is the 21-35 Vario-Elmar R. Wilson I had a lovely R8 body, but found I didn't trust it so only rarely used it. I used my Leicaflex SL more. I ultimately sold the R8, but realized that I couldn't use the Super-Elmar-R 15mm on the Leicaflex SL afterwards. So I then purchased an R6.2 body ... Now all my lenses work fine on a Leica SLR as well as on my CL. I've found the R6.2 body to be very ergonomic and second only to the Leicaflex SL with respect to the quality of its focusing system, and I suspect it will be extremely reliable. My lens kit includes 15, 19, 28, 50, 60 macro, 90, 100 macro, 180, and 2x extender. More than enough for my needs. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramarren Posted March 3, 2019 Share #58 Posted March 3, 2019 I wish to hell that this stupid "No Upload Sunday" nonsense didn't constantly inject nastygram notices for even a smiley that the editor auto-places in the text without my doing so. Grrr. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted March 3, 2019 Share #59 Posted March 3, 2019 Never fear Your smiley emoticon will be back tomorrow Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted March 6, 2019 Share #60 Posted March 6, 2019 Having said I was not going to buy any more R lenses, I came across a 500mm Telyt-MR catadioptric lens with an untested R4 MOT for sale on Fleabay at a very low price, I put in quite a low bid of about half what is being asked for most 500 Telyt-MR lenses, let alone plus an R4, not expecting to win. I have won the pair. Now I am assuming since the R4 says "untested", that is usually a euphemism for "broken" but even if it is, getting the 500 Telyt at half price is worth it. If it is a basic mechanical problem, like a stuck mirror, Kelvin at my local camera repair workshop, might be able to get it going again Wilson 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.