Using M246 w macro, rather than scanner for Film

[Avatar]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

I've been using my M6 and while the Epson 850 scanner, which is very good for medium format, for 35mm, I am looking to get something better.

 

Rather than buy an expensive scanner, it occurred to me to simply photograph the film.

 

I've read up on the option and have heard of some excellent results with this technique with various cameras and lenses.

 

I want to try this concept taking pictures of 35mm black and white film with an M246.

 

That brings me to start reseaching  lens options, including an R lense if need be..

 

Thanks for reading and any suggestions appreciated!

Edited July 27, 2017 by Avatar

[105012]

i've had good results with a Heliar 50/3.5 using a BEOON, LED light box and an enlarger attachment which keeps the negative flat and allows easy movement to the next frame. However, the PAKON makes it so easy to scan film that I rarely use the BEOON these days...

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[Avatar]

i've had good results with a Heliar 50/3.5 using a BEOON, LED light box and an enlarger attachment which keeps the negative flat and allows easy movement to the next frame. However, the PAKON makes it so easy to scan film that I rarely use the BEOON these days...

 

 

That's great information 105012. Very appreciated and exactly what I am looking for. 

[105012]

My pleasure Avatar, let me know if I can help you further.

[Avatar]

I sort of expected something like this existed but hadn't yet stumbled on it yet. Instead I was devising ways to pretty much do the same thing. I think Leica did a better job that I would have. 

 

Just have to find one.

 

I'm very curious to see results of black and white film shot on M6 and then digitized with M246. Now I have to figure out what lense to get. I see a new Macro adapter from Leica and not exactly sure what lens or combination makes best sense for this project.

[a.noctilux]

Look here for results with BEOON, work well for M8 (no LV and crop) and "better/easier" with cameras using Liveview:

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/230886-m8-and-beoon/

 

I have used M8/M9/Monochrom + 50mm with BEOON.

Now with M240/M10 it's much faster with LV to frame precisely and focus peaking aid.

I don't see big difference when copying my slides or negatives with 10 Mb , 18 Mb, or 24 Mb.

Best results are with enlarger lenses: Focotar 4.5/50mm for example.

 

Macro lenses are second choices, those are for 3D subjects not optimum for copying flat slides/negatives.

I used Macro-Elmarit-R 60mm, Macro Planar S 60mm, Nikkor 3.5/55mm, Pentax Macro 50mm, and more.

 

My project is to "scan" my thousands slides, but this would take me long time (if never...) to complete.

[250swb]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

 

My project is to "scan" my thousands slides, but this would take me long time (if never...) to complete.

 

I think the BEOON has become the buzz word simply because it has 'Leica' written on it. But if you want to copy thousands of slides you need a proper slide copier such as a Bowens Illumitran. 

 

http://members.bitstream.net/tlmartin/copiers.html

 

As well as the usual slide copying attachment you can also get unmounted film adapters, and adapters for many cameras including the M mount. You could of course simply edit the slides you need to copy, only copying the best one (unless you are lucky enough to have thousands of 'best ones'), and buy a Plustek 35mm scanner. Check eBay for Bowens Illumitran, there are plenty about.

Edited July 30, 2017 by 250swb

[a.noctilux]

Thanks Steve for your Illumitran advice.

 

Some decades ago, at film day, I used one Bowens just because there was no other choice to duplicate my Kodachrome (only hundreds by then) with Ektachrome 5038 (E4) or later SO-366 (E6) .

Just a thought, those Ektachrome slides fade away not as stable as Kodachrome colors.

I'm now happy that I mainly used by then Kodachrome or Velvia (some small shift colors with this, or it's my eyes )

 

BEOON was used same time as copying device for coins, old papers or stamps etc.

 

Time has changed ...

Now, after trying for years some film dedicated scanners, the lack of speed (about 10 to 20 times of "beoon's scans"), my last attemp is with this Leitz genius accessory.

Leica or other digital camera are for me the best tool to attemp this challenge ( some slides I rediscovered when scanning are very "fresh and beautiful" remind of past days ).

 

And nice also to "scan" my newer 24x65 slides or negatives from Xpan, using 1:1.5 or 1:2 .

Edited July 30, 2017 by a.noctilux

[a.noctilux]

Challenging also, "scanning" those negatives with wide and contrasting light.

 

.

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

 

 

..

 

Original from M3 + Noctilux, TMZ 3200

"scan" with Monochrom at 320 ISO, Summar 42mm "repro/macro" lens

Edited July 30, 2017 by a.noctilux

[Guest]

I think the BEOON has become the buzz word simply because it has 'Leica' written on it. But if you want to copy thousands of slides you need a proper slide copier such as a Bowens Illumitran...

 

250swb - Not sure that it's only the Leitz brand on it that has made the BEOON so sought after for digitalizing film. First, it's a simple copying stand with little that can go wrong, as long as the unit you buy has no deformation in the 1:1 holder: one that I had to return had an enlargement in the little hole in the base into which the pin on the holder fits — that made it impossible to position the negative correctly, resulting in surprisingly large triangles of offset in the image when digitalized. The other advantage, for me, is that the BEOON is so small that I can take it with me on my annual move between North America, Europe and the Far East.

 

Nevertheless, I this morning I looked into the Bowens Illumitran, since I could leave it in one place and have the BEOON in another. Looking at manuals for the model C and C3, I couldn't find the specifications of the focus and "modeling bulbs", so that I don't know whether replacement bulbs are available. Also, the C3 manual showed that there is a film strip holder, but I couldn't tell from a few of the eBay listing whether this was included in the units offered. Also, I think it would be necessary to get a converter for the Leica-M mount.

 

I also found that there is a somewhat similar slide copy was sold as a Honewell or Asahi Pentax Repronar 805A. That has a focus bulb, which is available  as a GE 2556, for about $150. However, I couldn't find the specs for the other bulbs used in the unit. Also, there was a separate Repronar Film Strip Kit, of which I saw a picture in an Asahi Pentax catalogue, but did not find one for sale anywhere. One of the manuals states a T converter would be necessary for the Pentax to Leica-M mount.

 

So, quite a bit of searching would have to be done before going for these on of these slide copiers, unless you know the answers to these questions.

_______________

Alone in Bangkok essay on BURN Magazine

[Guest]

...I'm very curious to see results of black and white film shot on M6 and then digitized with M246. Now I have to figure out what lense to get. I see a new Macro adapter from Leica and not exactly sure what lens or combination makes best sense for this project.

 

Avatar - I've been using the BEOON with the M9 for color and with the M-Monochrom for B&W film. On the BEOON at first I used the DR Summicorn-50. This was good, but the Leica Focotar II enlarger lens I now use gives better corner performance. For the Focotar or other 50mm enlarger lenses, you use the B+C+D extension rings and get perfect framing with the 1:1 mask. There are several threads here on the BEOON and also on RFF that give more information.

 

​I haven't tried the Plustek, but it's dMax is only 3.6. With the BEOON and M-Monochrome I get close to the 4.2 dynamic range of my old Imacon Precision III scanner — as well is, in the look of the digitalizations, close to its maximum true optical resolution of 6,300ppi.  

 

Below are a couple of Tri-X shots digitalized with the M-Monochrome:

 

 

M6 | DR Summicron | Tri-X @ ISO 400 | f/5.6 | Stand development with Rodinal

Chiang Mai

 

 

M6 | DR Summicron  |Tri-X @ ISO 400 | Developed in D76

Chiang Mai

 

_______________

Alone in Bangkok essay on BURN Magazine

[250swb]

 

 

So, quite a bit of searching would have to be done before going for these on of these slide copiers, unless you know the answers to these questions.

_______________

Alone in Bangkok essay on BURN Magazine

 

 

People who are able to click on the link I gave they will discover an Illumitran page with things such as modelling bulbs and accessories for sale.

[Guest]

250swb - Thanks, but I did look and found that the Illumitran 35mm unmounted film strip holder had been sold. Also, perhaps mistakenly, I got the impression that the site might be inactive and, if not, was concerned whether the two types of bulbs needed were on sale regularly, or whether the seller just had a few; same for the Leica M (bayonet) camera body and lens adapters set and the M39 enlarger lens adapter. Of course, I could send an email and find out. The other problem was that I couldn't figure out if the few units  on sale on eBay had all the standards parts or not. 

 

These potential issues, and the electronic and mechanic complexity of the Ullimitran compared to the complete simplicity and effectiveness of the BEOON, made me prefer to get the latter as a second unit that I could leave abroad. The trouble was, though, that there was only one BEOON for sale on eBay and it had some pretty grungy makes and lacked the focusing loupe.

_______________

Alone in Bangkok essay on BURN Magazine 

[bocaburger]

Some years ago I happened on this contraption among some used items at now-defunct local camera store for $5.  I mount the camera w/macro lens on a copy stand (although a tripod could work if I used a spirit level) and center it over the copier box.  I use an off-camera flash cord, pointing the small flash into the box through the trap door on the side (seen facing).  There's an angled reflector inside that directs the flash upward.  Works really well.  There never was any marking on the box as to who made it or where, unfortunately, so it would be hard to google it I suppose.  I've never seen another one.  It also came with an adapter to sandwich a neg between 2 pieces of glass. 

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Edited August 4, 2017 by bocaburger

[250swb]

I think even a non-working Illumitran could be adapted very easily along the lines of bocaburger's example, especially if an M mount adapter could be found (or adapt a cheap Chinese coded flange?). All the elements are there, a box that can contain a light source and flash, and focusing bellows. I don't see how a DIY cobbled together job would be worse than using a BEOON, but there's a lot of scope as here in Europe as non-working Illumitran's are very, very cheap

[Peter Wright]

I have been using an M246 (and an M240 and Olympus OMD EM1 mkii) for scanning B&W and colour reversal respectively.  I have tried Epson flat beds, Nikon scanners, and recently, a Plustek 120.  The camera solution is the best technically, and the fastest operationally.  I use a Novoflex Digi-Copy to take the film which attaches to a Novoflex Castel macro rail.  (Both from B&H or locally to me).  This goes on a tripod with the camera mounted on the macro rail.  The film is lit by a flash gun behind the film.  The lens I use is a Nikon mount Zeiss Macro Planar 50mm f/2.0.  with a Novoflex adaptor for the Olympus or Leica as necessary.

 

Because the Zeiss is only a 2:1 semi-macro I would need an extension tube to 'scan' 35mm on the Leica, so I use the Leica for 120 and the Oly for 35mm.  (I tried the Zeiss on an extension tube but the resolution fell apart in the corners).

 

I get excellent results with this method.  You do of course need to unsure the camera sensor is exactly parallel to the film being copied, but that is fairly easy with this setup.  It is also necessary to ensure that the lens you choose has NO focus shift as it is important to focus at max aperture, and shoot at about f/8.0.  Once I'm set up it goes very fast.

 

To finish, I load the files into PhotoShop and invert them all (for B&W) using an Action.  Some final adjustment in curves etc. and I'm done.