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I think the Fujinon GF23mm has better resolution and sharpness than the S24 in my own comparison and experience.

 

Can you post some examples?

The reason I ask is that neither lens should be particularly strained in terms of sharpness, given the pixel density. I'm surprised you could find a consistent "sharpness" difference at all.

 

In my experience, the S lenses really stand-out in terms of how they handle back-lighting, flare, and micro-contrast. They are also unusual for medium format because they deliver full performance wide open (a stop or two faster than the competition, at the wide end). Sharpness doesn't come into play; they are sharp edge-to-edge, at every aperture, until diffraction shows up past f:11.

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Can you post some examples?

The reason I ask is that neither lens should be particularly strained in terms of sharpness, given the pixel density. I'm surprised you could find a consistent "sharpness" difference at all.

 

In my experience, the S lenses really stand-out in terms of how they handle back-lighting, flare, and micro-contrast. They are also unusual for medium format because they deliver full performance wide open (a stop or two faster than the competition, at the wide end). Sharpness doesn't come into play; they are sharp edge-to-edge, at every aperture, until diffraction shows up past f:11.

Like I said before. It might be the synergy with the sensor. The lens produce a crisper look than the Leica S24 on the S007. S24 definitely is among the best there is for wide angle MF.

 

GF23

38154982325_55743a4c9f_k.jpg

 

S24

27969450473_c6ed4a87ec_k.jpg

 

Sorry, subject matter is too different. 

 

And the best bit of the GFX that I have forgot to state, is that for the 1 year I have using it... I have never need to clean the sensor at all and I have never need to do any dust removal in PP.... it's almost god like in repelling dust..... a miracle really considering it's a mirrorless. I don't know what Fuji did to their sensor but it's quite amazing.

Edited by xiaubauu2009
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Doesn't the Fuji have an optical flat in the images path, keeping dust away from the sensor? Mind you, I haven't had any dust issues with the S, but others may have. People blame the flat for the fact that lenses that adapted should cover the sensor aren't quite as sharp as they should be (in theory). That's not an issue with native lenses.

 

It's very had to see any significant difference in sharpness between your two down-sampled files. I will have to take your word that there is a difference, and that it is noticeable.

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Like I said before. It might be the synergy with the sensor. The lens produce a crisper look than the Leica S24 on the S007. S24 definitely is among the best there is for wide angle MF.

 

GF23

38154982325_55743a4c9f_k.jpg

 

S24

27969450473_c6ed4a87ec_k.jpg

 

Sorry, subject matter is too different.

 

And the best bit of the GFX that I have forgot to state, is that for the 1 year I have using it... I have never need to clean the sensor at all and I have never need to do any dust removal in PP.... it's almost god like in repelling dust..... a miracle really considering it's a mirrorless. I don't know what Fuji did to their sensor but it's quite amazing.

I had a complain about 24S WO corner performance(until f8). However, at f11, it clear out, which I used most for my landscape work. At f11, Diffraction is better than 35mm system for the pix density given its bigger sensor. So I will not hesitate using f16 if I need extra DOF or longer shutter.

 

Center performance is top class right from WO. I don’t expect anything better. There is no CA at corner which many SWA lens struggle.

 

I have no experience for FUJI23, and didn’t follow it either so I can’t comment how they two compare.

Edited by ZHNL
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Doesn't the Fuji have an optical flat in the images path, keeping dust away from the sensor? Mind you, I haven't had any dust issues with the S, but others may have. People blame the flat for the fact that lenses that adapted should cover the sensor aren't quite as sharp as they should be (in theory). That's not an issue with native lenses.

 

It's very had to see any significant difference in sharpness between your two down-sampled files. I will have to take your word that there is a difference, and that it is noticeable.

I always have to clean the S for oil spots and dust spot. Every time before a trip and also mid trip. You can see in the sample from the Leica. It has spots on them.

 

The 9mm glass gap on the Fuji does do wonder. There seems to have not much issue with adapted lens as far as I have tried. Nut adapting M lens on it is not that good. But that is yo be expected.

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I had a complain about 24S WO corner performance(until f8). However, at f11, it clear out, which I used most for my landscape work. At f11, Diffraction is better than 35mm system for the pix density given its bigger sensor. So I will not hesitate using f16 if I need extra DOF or longer shutter.

Center performance is top class right from WO. I don’t expect anything better. There is no CA at corner which many SWA lens struggle.

I have no experience for FUJI23, and didn’t follow it either so I can’t comment how they two compare.

One thing about gfx is that f16 should avoided. Diffraction is very obvious. I think it has to do with with 5 something micron sensor pitch.

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One thing about gfx is that f16 should avoided. Diffraction is very obvious. I think it has to do with with 5 something micron sensor pitch.

Whats Deffraction please?

Neil

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When light goes through a small aperture, it spreads out like water waves passing through a narrow break in a barrier. This makes lenses slightly blurrier at high f-numbers. For MF, f/8 or f/11 is fine. After that it gets noticeable. But if you need depth of field, a little blur is preferable

Matt

Edited by mgrayson3
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Thanks Matt and ? For the explanation. I’ve been shooting my S and Hassy at around f16 and can’t really say I’m seeing anything funny. I will look out for it though

Neil

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Neil,

 

People go crazy over the least important things. I wouldn't hesitate to use f/16. Diffraction blur cleans up very well with a little sharpening. Something blurry because it's too far from the plane of focus is much harder to fix.

 

The current S and SL have 6 micron pixels. Your 100MP has 4.9 micron pixels, so diffraction will be more visible. The next S will have, I believe, 4.5 micron pixels, and so the issue will be slightly more pronounced.

 

But it really is way down the list of things to be worried about as far as IQ is concerned, let alone photography.

 

Matt

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Neil,

 

People go crazy over the least important things. I wouldn't hesitate to use f/16. Diffraction blur cleans up very well with a little sharpening. Something blurry because it's too far from the plane of focus is much harder to fix.

 

The current S and SL have 6 micron pixels. Your 100MP has 4.9 micron pixels, so diffraction will be more visible. The next S will have, I believe, 4.5 micron pixels, and so the issue will be slightly more pronounced.

 

But it really is way down the list of things to be worried about as far as IQ is concerned, let alone photography.

 

Matt

 

 

I have used Zeiss 120mm f/4 macro with f11 and f16... the IQ dropped quite significantly on the GFX smaller sensor pitch. It is un-fixable by a little sharpening or de-hazing...

f8-f11 is so pin sharp but once you go to f16, the IQ drops off the cliff. 

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Thanks Matt and ? For the explanation. I’ve been shooting my S and Hassy at around f16 and can’t really say I’m seeing anything funny. I will look out for it though

Neil

 

I think the bigger sensor pitch and also the way the micro-lens is designed will have less impact.... I consistently shoot the IQ3-100mp at f16 and notice no significantly lost of IQ, but not so on the GFX. Leica S is fine too at f16, the degradation is not as bad.

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Neil,

 

People go crazy over the least important things. I wouldn't hesitate to use f/16. Diffraction blur cleans up very well with a little sharpening. Something blurry because it's too far from the plane of focus is much harder to fix.

 

The current S and SL have 6 micron pixels. Your 100MP has 4.9 micron pixels, so diffraction will be more visible. The next S will have, I believe, 4.5 micron pixels, and so the issue will be slightly more pronounced.

 

But it really is way down the list of things to be worried about as far as IQ is concerned, let alone photography.

 

Matt

To be Fair, for this particular diffraction matter: The microcontrast of  image will be lost when diffraction happen. Sharpening can helps definitely but the multi-thousands dollar prime lens will be similar as zoom lens at f16 in term of IQ.

 

My best lens always perform best at f2~f5.6 cross frame, most Leica S glass can reach peak at f5.6 cross frame, some even earlier. S24 is not, but the thing is for my SWA use, either WO for other stuff on center or f8~f16 for landscape, I seems always mainly fighting with DOF for foreground stuff, so this(unsharp corner before f8) is again not an issue. 

Edited by ZHNL
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