jiheng779 Posted June 7, 2017 Share #1 Posted June 7, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) Call Leica NJ yesterday and they return my call just 20mins before. I told them that my camera send it back on March 21 for ccd corrosion and I want to know the newest update. They are nice and help me to check, but! but! but! Now they do not have any CCD anymore, they are just wait for order. They told me even I already wait 11 weeks but they still did not fix my camera yet, and they do not know when I can get my camera cause they just told me wait couple more weeks and call back. So turnaround date might gonna take more than 12 weeks now? Now I learned: before you take Leica's word, always prepare a backup camera first. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 7, 2017 Posted June 7, 2017 Hi jiheng779, Take a look here Leica NJ does not have any CCD now, turnaround time might take longer. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
jaapv Posted June 7, 2017 Share #2 Posted June 7, 2017 In the matter of sensor spares Leica is completely dependent on the sensor manufacturer. They are made in batches, and small specialist orders have to be fitted in between large orders, so it is quite possible that high demand will exhaust the stock prematurely and cause a hiccup in the supply chain. Not an excuse, but an explanation. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ko.Fe. Posted June 7, 2017 Share #3 Posted June 7, 2017 Correct explanation is known. It is called "snafu". 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
darylgo Posted June 7, 2017 Share #4 Posted June 7, 2017 (edited) It can be frustrating to be without equipment, sorry to hear about your lengthy wait. M9 is my backup camera Edited June 7, 2017 by darylgo 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
darylgo Posted June 7, 2017 Share #5 Posted June 7, 2017 In the matter of sensor spares Leica is completely dependent on the sensor manufacturer. They are made in batches, and small specialist orders have to be fitted in between large orders, so it is quite possible that high demand will exhaust the stock prematurely and cause a hiccup in the supply chain. Not an excuse, but an explanation. I am not trying to be contentious but couldn't Leica be on the leading edge of this supply issue rather than the back end. In my business which happens to be the same as yours, supplies are a lifeline, without them we scramble and many people are inconvenienced. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 7, 2017 Share #6 Posted June 7, 2017 As all producing businesses are. Backorders are a menace in this age of just-in-time supply chains. Leica's problem is that they can only place relatively small orders with the manufacturer and don't have the option (as we do have) to switch supplier. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted June 7, 2017 Share #7 Posted June 7, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) [...] Leica's problem is that they can only place relatively small orders with the manufacturer [...] How do we know that? If Leica can only order small quantities, then is it not true that the manufacturer is overly burdened because it has to interrupt its production for a relatively few sensors? Making many is less expensive than making a few. Set-up is hugely costly. Stop and start over again is silly. Why would a source manufacturer ever agree to such a contract? It makes no sense at all! . 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 7, 2017 Share #8 Posted June 7, 2017 How can Leica order anything else than small quantities when they only build a small number of cameras? Other manufacturers make Leica's yearly production of M cameras in a few days. I'm sure it is reflected in the price. Leica pays over 1500 Euro per sensor... Which also explains why they cannot overstock. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiheng779 Posted June 7, 2017 Author Share #9 Posted June 7, 2017 In the matter of sensor spares Leica is completely dependent on the sensor manufacturer. They are made in batches, and small specialist orders have to be fitted in between large orders, so it is quite possible that high demand will exhaust the stock prematurely and cause a hiccup in the supply chain. Not an excuse, but an explanation. All the customer can take that explanation but just not happy with it. I trust them about 2-3 months or 12 weeks but last mins got the bad news is very unacceptable. But what can I do, right? I have to be more patient.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiheng779 Posted June 7, 2017 Author Share #10 Posted June 7, 2017 Correct explanation is known. It is called "snafu". haha, so ture. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiheng779 Posted June 7, 2017 Author Share #11 Posted June 7, 2017 It can be frustrating to be without equipment, sorry to hear about your lengthy wait. M9 is my backup camera Best things is I bought a Ricoh GR2 last week for backup. I knew something gonna happen at last mins.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted June 7, 2017 Share #12 Posted June 7, 2017 (edited) How can Leica order anything else than small quantities when they only build a small number of cameras? Other manufacturers make Leica's yearly production of M cameras in a few days. I'm sure it is reflected in the price. Leica pays over 1500 Euro per sensor... Which also explains why they cannot overstock. Better to question the economics of scale as well as manufacturing metrics that I posted. If Leica could statistically anticipate the return numbers. and they can, they could negotiate an accurate number of sensors to be made. Why cannot Leica do that, or why do they decide to not to do it, possibly to discourage customer returns, customers actions? Or do they have a brain dead accountant? Think like a capitalist. The answer will come to you. Edited June 7, 2017 by pico 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted June 7, 2017 Share #13 Posted June 7, 2017 Given that it took a bean counter mentality to create the recent policy, one would think that there would be enough of that to calculate supply needs. Or maybe the bean counters simply don't account for customers. Jeff 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 8, 2017 Share #14 Posted June 8, 2017 Better to question the economics of scale as well as manufacturing metrics that I posted. If Leica could statistically anticipate the return numbers. and they can, they could negotiate an accurate number of sensors to be made. Why cannot Leica do that, or why do they decide to not to do it, possibly to discourage customer returns, customers actions? Or do they have a brain dead accountant? Think like a capitalist. The answer will come to you. I smell oversimplification here. In Dutch we have a saying: The best helmsmen are standing on the coast... We don't know the lead times, we don't know the variability in demand, we don't know the timing of management decisions, nor the reasons behind them, the production parameters, etc. Exactly the same problems beset the sensor manufacturer. They have to keep control of the silicon wafers coming in, the microlens supply, the optical glass for the filters, keep multi-million dollar machines running, and much more, again without tying up capital in overstocking. It is not like running out of crisps at a barbeque party with a 7-Eleven next door. As Darylglo mentions, in other businesses we do have similar experiences with supply lines being snarled up, capital being tied up in stock, variability in demand, etc. At least we are not normally tied to one single supplier. A good example is the case about half a year ago when the entire world ran out of an essential (Thyroid IIRC) medicine because of a manufacturing problem in the only factory that makes them. Slightly more important than a few weeks extra wait for a camera in my book. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jager Posted June 8, 2017 Share #15 Posted June 8, 2017 I have little doubt that Leica had very accurate information regarding CCD sensor consumption leading up to the recent policy change. A summer intern with Excel, a couple spare hours, and the monthly repair report summaries could have mapped that quite precisely. And it would be equally as easy to ascertain how many new CCD sensors could be sourced, when... as that information is probably explicit in the contract. The policy change has, of course, thrown all that into disarray. Either Leica was blissfully ignorant of the consequences of that policy change - a notion that itself is profoundly disturbing; or else they simply didn't care. I'm not sure which is worse. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 8, 2017 Share #16 Posted June 8, 2017 Or the decision was made (forced?) after the projection was made, and the lead time has turned out to be too long... Aditionally it would be easy to calculate the percentage in retrospect, but it was probably quite unknown how many corroded sensors were out there with the owners blissfully unaware. Those will have been flushed out by now. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
almoore Posted June 8, 2017 Share #17 Posted June 8, 2017 Leica pays over 1500 Euro per sensor... How do you know the price that Leica pays per sensor? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 8, 2017 Share #18 Posted June 8, 2017 It is no company secret. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
almoore Posted June 8, 2017 Share #19 Posted June 8, 2017 That doesn't answer my question. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 8, 2017 Share #20 Posted June 8, 2017 It does. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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