Seeking quick advise: MP BP vs M6 TTL BP NSH

[Tytan]

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Plasticman , Henry ..

 

I've not encountered any flare issues on my M7.

It's just that I've read about the flare issue on some M6s, and wanted to know if the finders on the Millennium BP editions might suffer from it.

 

Henry, thanks for your post in the I LIKE FILM thread

 

Truth be told, I'm still going back and forth between the MP and the Miillennium BP...

[Mute-on]

Get the MP. It's newer, arguably better made, and has simpler metering electronics should a repair ever be required. It is also modeled after the M2, the most perfect expression of Leica M ever

Also, I want one and can satisfy this vicariously through your purchase.

 

Cheers

 

J

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Edited June 1, 2017 by Mute-on

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[Doc Henry]

Get the MP. It's newer, arguably better made, and has simpler metering electronics should a repair ever be required. It is also modeled after the M2, the most perfect expression of Leica M ever

Also, I want one and can satisfy this vicariously through your purchase.

 

Cheers

 

J

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

I agree with J.

MP one of the best M camera (with M3)  with  a redoutable mechanical precison.

In a link I sent you above Tytan, some parts of M6 are in plastic, not the case of MP !

You have equivalent in Leica SLR ,  it's Leicaflex SL same principle all mechanical except the battery

for lightmeter but without lightmeter and F16 rule , you obtain wonderful pictures specially in color

Best

Henry

Edited June 1, 2017 by Doc Henry

[Martin B]

This is one of those religious questions about M cameras - some people seem to find 'finder flare' a constant problem forever hindering their photographic creativity, while others (like me) are not really sure whether they've ever seen it. I've used an M7 with the newer finder and several M6s and M2s with the older finders, and never really noticed any difference. But I'm probably not looking for this problem. My pet hate is vertical alignment that's out, but flare hasn't ever bothered me.

 

You would know if you had this issue in any of your cameras - it can be annoying. The center focus rectangle is blanking out in the viewfinder when it happens (or gets sort or reddish not allowing any focusing anymore in this field on my M6). Little shaking of the camera brings all back to normal, but you might have lost a shot in the meantime. Likely you use a newer M7 which doesn't has this issue anymore and maybe also a M6 where the rangefinder patch was replaced by a former owner? I see this issue often on my M6 and more rarely also on my M7. Fortunately the M3 doesn't has this issue at all......

[Wayne]

I am going to go way off base and recommend you look at M5 as possible second body.

 

1. Despite oddity related to overall appearance and feel, it works very well and is reliable.

2. VF/RF is outstanding.

3. Does include meter, although manual, and without AE feature.

4. If you look for one, it can be obtained at a laughably low price.....for such a well built piece of precision engineering.....My perfectly functional "3 lugger" set me back less than 70 rolls of HP5.

5. Low price allows you to treat it like a true "second camera." Mine lives under the seat of my car; is always present.

 

Best,

 

Wayne

[plasticman]

You would know if you had this issue in any of your cameras - it can be annoying. The center focus rectangle is blanking out in the viewfinder when it happens (or gets sort or reddish not allowing any focusing anymore in this field on my M6). Little shaking of the camera brings all back to normal, but you might have lost a shot in the meantime. Likely you use a newer M7 which doesn't has this issue anymore and maybe also a M6 where the rangefinder patch was replaced by a former owner? I see this issue often on my M6 and more rarely also on my M7. Fortunately the M3 doesn't has this issue at all......

Thanks for the explanation Martin - I've never experienced it. 

[Chuck Albertson]

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If you're used to shooting with the M7, then get the TTL. Having the shutter speed dial work in the same direction will save you a lot of frustration day-to-day. I like my MP a lot, and part of that is due to the shutter speed dial working in the same direction as my earlier M6s (non-TTL).

 

Also, the TTL had/has a rep for staying "in spec" much better than the earlier M6 models, requiring fewer trips to the repair shop.

[philipus]

Buying a camera, and most certainly a Leica M, is a very personal thing so I hesitate to say this. But I have difficulty understanding why you'd want to spend that much on a camera that can be had for less and be the real thing, in this case the real Millennium. In my view, all the other, company-branded "Millennium" models are just that, company-branded. The M6TTL Black Paint, as the Millennium model is actually called, is Leica's celebration of the new millennium. That, at least to me, means something. The NSH, dragon, ICS and others don't, again to me, have that or even any meaning. But we're all different.

 

If it's the 0,85x finder you want (and as a 50mm shooter myself I don't see the need for that; 0,72x is perfect) then spend the (rather significant) money on changing it. One thing I like in particular about my Millennium is the TTL function. It's sublimely simple and amazingly accurate. Having this has truly extended my camera into a new photographic domain. But not everyone needs or wants this. The MP is just a more restricted camera, function-wise. And I personally don't accept that it has any of that "cachet" of the model on which it is based. Just marketing. 

 

My camera suffered BADLY from white-out. After installation of the MP viewfinder upgrade (which is the one thing the MP has going for it, but it's not worth the premium of the MP as such) there is no flare at all.

 

br

Philip

 

Hi all,

Am looking quickly to get a 2nd film body.
(My only other Leica film body is a M7, which I like plenty, but it's just been sent off to Wetzlar for an adjustment.)

Visited a few stores.

Sorta narrowed down to 2 bodies:

Regular MP Black Paint 0.72x
- Used. Light signs of use, but no brassing. 8.5/10
- ~ $3350

M6 TTL Black Paint Millennium (NSH edition of 400) 0.85x
- Used. Light signs of use, but no brassing. 8.5/10
- ~ $3200

My own thoughts:
- From a design/look/size point of view, I prefer the MP.
- I'm primarily a 50mm shooter. The 0.85 will suit me well, but I can make do with a 0.72 (my M7 is a 0.72 and I use a 1.25x magnifier with a 50mm comfortably)
- The larger dial on the M6 is a plus.
- I will use the camera for sure, am not quite a collector. But still got to ask .. from a resale point of view, which might fetch a higher value?

Thanks in advance for any insights/advise.

 

 

Another consideration/question ... does the M6 TTL Millennium suffer from whiteout finder flare?

[Tytan]

Buying a camera, and most certainly a Leica M, is a very personal thing so I hesitate to say this. But I have difficulty understanding why you'd want to spend that much on a camera that can be had for less and be the real thing, in this case the real Millennium. In my view, all the other, company-branded "Millennium" models are just that, company-branded. The M6TTL Black Paint, as the Millennium model is actually called, is Leica's celebration of the new millennium. That, at least to me, means something. The NSH, dragon, ICS and others don't, again to me, have that or even any meaning. But we're all different.

 

If it's the 0,85x finder you want (and as a 50mm shooter myself I don't see the need for that; 0,72x is perfect) then spend the (rather significant) money on changing it. One thing I like in particular about my Millennium is the TTL function. It's sublimely simple and amazingly accurate. Having this has truly extended my camera into a new photographic domain. But not everyone needs or wants this. The MP is just a more restricted camera, function-wise. And I personally don't accept that it has any of that "cachet" of the model on which it is based. Just marketing. 

 

My camera suffered BADLY from white-out. After installation of the MP viewfinder upgrade (which is the one thing the MP has going for it, but it's not worth the premium of the MP as such) there is no flare at all.

 

br

Philip

 

I hear you regarding the company-branded Millenniums vs the 'real' thing. It isn't that I'm seeking out the NSHs, ICSs. It just so happened that when I started this thread, the M6 Millennium that was available to me (in the condition that I was satisfied with) happened to be an NSH edition. Then, there wasn't a 0.72 BP Millennium available for my consideration. The 0.85 vs 0.72 isn't a big factor for me. I'm very happy with my 0.72 M7.

 

I am, though, quite concerned about the viewfinder white-out problem. 

 

Philip, I take it that your M6 that suffered badly from white-out was the Black Paint Millennium? 

[Tytan]

I dropped by the shop yesterday, fiddled with the MP for abit .. at that point, I was leaning towards getting the MP.

I will say this ... shutter dial in 'wrong' direction aside, I found the small dial pretty difficult/uncomfortable to rotate with just my index finger while shooting. 

Even if I could 'program' myself to deal with the 'wrong' direction, I could foresee getting frustrated with the rotating bit, plus it kinda hurts the index finger a little when you're just using that one finger. 

The back & forth continues .. 

[Mute-on]

I dropped by the shop yesterday, fiddled with the MP for abit .. at that point, I was leaning towards getting the MP.

I will say this ... shutter dial in 'wrong' direction aside, I found the small dial pretty difficult/uncomfortable to rotate with just my index finger while shooting.

Even if I could 'program' myself to deal with the 'wrong' direction, I could foresee getting frustrated with the rotating bit, plus it kinda hurts the index finger a little when you're just using that one finger.

The back & forth continues ..

I use both thumb and index finger to rotate the shutter dial on my MP, and find it very comfortable to use this way. It is quite firm, though it has loosened up a little with use. In any event, I don't really notice it any more.

 

The MP does not have a flare prone viewfinder. However, under the right (wrong) conditions, it can happen but not enough to be a bother.

 

Just get the camera that feels right in your hands. This is really what it's all about. Otherwise you won't use it, and will resent all the money you spent on it. Mind you, I haven't met a Leica I didn't like

 

Cheers

 

J

Edited June 3, 2017 by Mute-on

[Budfox]

I bought the M6TTL because of the shutter dial being the same as my digital M. The opposite direction would have bugged me I think.

 

The only downside is I heard (after purchase) that the M6 light meters can no longer be replaced if they malfunction. The MP's are still serviceable of course. My research suggests keeping the M6 dry is the best protection.

[plasticman]

I've googled a bit about finder flare, and it seems like a thing that I used to experience occasionally with a CL I sold - the second image just disappearing sometimes while focussing - does that sound right? I've either been very lucky or too stupid to see it on the M6.

 

Tytan - you've had so much advice I'm guessing you've gone off the idea of buying either of these cameras by now? 

[Tytan]

(would like to thank everyone who shared their insights/thoughts/experiences...)

a decision was made ...

Edited June 4, 2017 by Tytan

[plasticman]

Great choice! 

[Doc Henry]

Nice black paint Tytan  !

What lens ?

Henry

[Mute-on]

That's gorgeous! basically an MP with a big shutter speed dial AND a red dot. MP fully loaded

 

Anyway, enough about the camera, tell us about the lens! Beautiful.

 

Enjoy wearing them both out over many rolls and experiences.

 

Cheers

 

J

[Jollicoe]

I went the same route and couldn't be happier. The millennium is a very handsome camera

[Tytan]

Nice black paint Tytan  !

What lens ?

Henry

 

 

That's gorgeous! basically an MP with a big shutter speed dial AND a red dot. MP fully loaded

 

Anyway, enough about the camera, tell us about the lens! Beautiful.

 

Enjoy wearing them both out over many rolls and experiences.

 

Cheers

 

J

 

 

Thanks Plasticman, Henry, Mute-on, Jollicoe.

 

The lens is a 50mm 1.4 Summilux M Black Paint. 

 

I've put a roll of film through the camera ... initial thoughts:

- Having been very comfortable with the M7 in AE mode, having to rotate the shutter dial will take a little getting used to, but i'm sure (hoping, really) I'll get used to it soon.

- Have not encountered any complete viewfinder white-out yet, but i did realize that on certain occasions, the focusing box did go a little 'translucent', making focusing a tad difficult but not impossible. May consider upgrading to the MP VF at some point.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[Doc Henry]

Thanks Plasticman, Henry, Mute-on, Jollicoe.

 

The lens is a 50mm 1.4 Summilux M Black Paint. 

 

I've put a roll of film through the camera ... initial thoughts:

- Having been very comfortable with the M7 in AE mode, having to rotate the shutter dial will take a little getting used to, but i'm sure (hoping, really) I'll get used to it soon.

- Have not encountered any complete viewfinder white-out yet, but i did realize that on certain occasions, the focusing box did go a little 'translucent', making focusing a tad difficult but not impossible. May consider upgrading to the MP VF at some point.

 

Hi Tytan,

 

About the rotation of Isos disc , I just post this , in "I love my MP" thread :

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/267593-i-love-my-mp/?p=3288938

Henry