How bad is flare with Leica 180mm Telyt APO 3.4?

[inglis]

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How bad is the flare when using a Leica 180mm Telyt APO 3.4 when out and about?

 

Does anyone have recommendations for how to deal with flare when using a a late model E60 on a Sony A7IIR?

 

Light sources and bright areas outside the visual area cause flare on my Leica 180mm Telyt and I wonder how bad this can get.

 

I am debating whether to bring this lens for travel to Europe for architecture and landscape, or a f4 80-200 with less flare. It would be wonderful use the Telyt because it is so light, and also a f2 90mm, but the flare worries me.

 

John

[jaapv]

Why should a lens flare more in Europe than in the rest of the world?

When I had the APO-Telyt it did not strike me as particularly flare-prone, maybe your example needs a proper window cleaning? Given its age, the same goes for the Vario-Elmar, which is indeed remarkably flare resistant - for a zoom of that era.

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[Hugh 38]

I have    ben  using  the  180mm f3.4  Apo  Telyt  for   at least  10  years  and   never  noticed the  flare . Lovely  lens  to  use . 

[inglis]

Thanks, I will rephrase by quandary.

 

Sites like the following note that the 180mm Telyt has some of the worst flare of a tele lens, "nasty flare"

 

http://slrlensreview.com/web/reviews/leica-lenses/leica-telephoto/423-leica-apo-telyt-r-180mm-f34-e60-lens-review?showall=&start=2

 

https://www.apotelyt.com/photo-lens/leica-apo-telyt-r-180mm-34

 

I see no flare on my 80-200 f4. I include an example below from my very clear and clean Telyt, which makes me doubt whether it is worth bringing for two months to Europe.

 

Once there I would be stuck with it and not able to switch it out. I thought perhaps members here would have experienced such visible flare and have recommendations on the usability of the lens for travel.

 

Perhaps I should just bring the 80-200, but have been thinking recently that it might be better to have the Telyt and a f2 90mm for low light use. Weight wise I would do one or the other. Has no one here experienced this sort of flare with a Telyt 180mm?

 

The flare below is caused by light coming though windows right and left on a cloudy day outside of the frame of the photo, so just stray light on the front lens or lenses.

 

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I am bringing a Leica R6.2 for provia 400 slide film, because projection with slide film remains so much better than digital projection, and a Sony A7RII for digital.

Edited May 11, 2017 by inglis

[ph.]

I have not been bothered with flare on my ancient 180\3,4, but always use the hood. Maybe the light has been constantly benign. The 80-200 is quite large, fills less than bringing several single focal lenghts and saves changing lenses in a hurry if the need arises.

 

When travelling, I prefer to keep optics in jacket pockets rather than having a huge zoom on the camera. A rainproof jacket usually has fairly rainproof zipped pockets where the 180 can fit. The small 21-35 and the 60 also fit there (or on the camera), but not the large zoom, so that stays home. 

 

p.

[TomB_tx]

Flare on long lenses can be bad if the light baffle lining the inside of the barrel behind the optics gets damaged or left out after a CLA. Off-axis light sources will reflect off the sides of the barrel and look like the example photo, and can explain why one sample lens can be much worse than others of the same model.

I picked up a 90 Elmar that had similar terrible flare, and just holding it up towards a light source off the camera could see the reflections off the inside of the barrel. When compared to another I could see the baffle had been removed. I made a replacement baffle of flat black paper used to line telescopes, and the flare disappeared.

I don't know the layout of the 180 APO, but Telyts typically have the optics forward, so the barrel lining behind the optics could be the problem.

[jankap]

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I have this lens too. It was not used very often, bought and used for a safari tour.

There are glass elements at the backside too. That is why the 1.4 extender cannot be used with it.

My cameras have a crop sensor (APS-C).

 

I did not notice an increased sensitivity for flare.

But look here, found in "slrlensreview".

Jan

 

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Edited May 12, 2017 by jankap

[jaapv]

Yes, but then the question arises: were the lens elements clean, or did they have the (almost invisible) haze that many decades-old lenses accumulate? In my experience it provokes a lot of flare. Mine never flared like that.

[Hugh 38]

Interesting  reading  .  I have never  encountered   the  problems  shown . 

I  am  some times  a  bit  unsure of  test  reports as I  sometimes  wonder how  often   anyone  does  some of the   things  they  mention. 

 

I  take my   Apo  180  3.4  on my travels  and it  is  great . It loves  going on  ships,  make  sense  as it  was  designed  for  nautical  use . In  the  late  afternoon light , leaving  a port  it  produces   lovely slides which   almost  come  alive and  have an extra  dimension . The  lens  was  especially  good  with  Kodachrome  , but  the  Agfa  Precisa  is  good . I like  my  slides  even if no one  else  does. 

 

One  of the  reports   mentions  the close  focus   is  not   so  good  ,I  think  that  has  only  once   caused   a  problem  , likewise  for    portraits  , move  your  feet  if  you  can . 

 

The  only  thing  I  dislike  about  the  lens  is  at  times  I  find  the  focus  ring is  a  bit  too  close to the   body .  I  find the   Elamrit  180   a  bit  easier  to handle ,  though have  limited  experience  with  it .

[jaapv]

It is indeed true that the lens was originally  designed as an observation lens, so best performance will be at infinity. At closest focus distance the quality drops slightly, but it will be more than sufficient for any non-pixelpeeper, especially when closed down one or two stops.

[wizard]

Why should a lens flare more in Europe than in the rest of the world?

When I had the APO-Telyt it did not strike me as particularly flare-prone, maybe your example needs a proper window cleaning? Given its age, the same goes for the Vario-Elmar, which is indeed remarkably flare resistant - for a zoom of that era.

 

I second that. My copy is not flare-prone at all. Use the built-in lens hood, and you should not have any problems. Every lens may produce flare under adverse conditions.

[Cwnprwll]

I have used my 180mm APO-Telyt outdoors regularly since the 90s and flare has not been an issue for me.  I cannot say how it compares to other telephotos.  I have also used it with the X2 APO extender with great results.  I really love this lens.

 

If I recall correctly, the weight of the lens exceeds the M240 recommended weight.  I support the lens with my hand or a tripod not stressing out the M240 mount.  I have used it on an RE and R3 in the past without issues.

[jaapv]

Anyway, I would suggest that  for travel in Europe 135 mm is plenty long enough for the vast majority of photographs.

Take either the Apo- Telyt 135 M or the Tele-Elmar 135 if you are using an M-compatible camera.

Small, light, and even better quality than the 180. Otherwise an 135-R.

[inglis]

Will stop of in Hong Kong and want to get some lotus shots in gardens that require some reach, so will need a 180 or the 80-200 plus a 2x. I am using R lenses both for slides on an R 6.2 and digital on a Sony A7RII, since the R wides work so much better than the Ms for digital on the Sony.

 

Thanks for the reflections!

Edited May 17, 2017 by inglis

[jaapv]

In case you are going to do close-ups with your tele, I would certainly not recommend the 180/3.4 Apotelyt R. Not only would you be using the lens at its least optimal setting, the closest focus is 2 m IIRC.

[W124]

Moin,

 

it is possible to use the Elpro 1:2 -1:1 from the Apo Makro Elmarit 100mm on the Apo Telyt 180mm, I posted in another thread

 

Hummel by hen. ry, auf Flickr

 

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/187926-sony-a99/?p=2408080

Edited July 16, 2017 by W124

[a.noctilux]

I have just mount the set-up Elpro 1:2-1:1 (id 16545) on Apo-Telyt-R 3.4/180.

With the protuded rear element, I wondered how to attach the Elpro to the lens.

The Elpro's hood is the answer when attached to the lens.

 

May I doubt the usefulness of the set-up.

It's like an almost fixed focus/field about 3 to 4cm of field.

The focussing ring has little effect to change that.

 

...

Jaapv, Apo-Telyt-R 180mm has minimal focus only to 2.5m.

 

...

Never been bothered by flare on my sample of more than 20 years old.

The built-in hood is very efficient.

[jankap]

In case you are going to do close-ups with your tele, I would certainly not recommend the 180/3.4 Apotelyt R. Not only would you be using the lens at its least optimal setting, the closest focus is 2 m IIRC.

 

With an Elpro you emulate infinity for the lens, I think.

So herewith you can take good close-ups with a lens, that is optimized for infinity.

 

Of course the extension of the lens works in a small extend in close-ups only. It seems to be fixed focus, but that are the physics laws. The distance adjustment is not a linear one.

Jan 

Edited July 16, 2017 by jankap