Off camera HSS with Priolite?

[jto555]

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Anybody know why that works, that the cameras sync speed doesn't matter? What in technology changed making this possible.?

......excuse my ignorance, my knowledge of modern strobe tech stopped in 2000

On this flash unit the flash duration is so long that the shutter opens and closes while the flash is still firing.

[Alo Ako]

... Compatible with Nikon, Canon..

 

Both are compatible with TTL HSS on these systems only. The non-TTL-HSS is for use with any camera supporting a studio flash including Leica; the same with Priolite. Maybe you don`t understand the difference of TTL HSS vs HSS...

 

For use with Leica (in my experience with SL) I take the Nikon trigger. It works fine with my Priolite, and I discussed all that stuff with Priolite. They have no technical strength over Bowens, Jinbei and others in the case of HSS.

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[Exodies]

On this flash unit the flash duration is so long that the shutter opens and closes while the flash is still firing.

To belabour the point - at faster than flash sync speeds the shutter doesn't open and close but a narrow gap between the two shutter curtains moves across the frame. This takes 1/200 second (I presume as this is the flash duration mentioned in the product web site) even for a shutter speed of 1/4000. I'm having trouble understanding how 1/200 second can freeze motion.

[ECohen]

I actually don't get it either. I found this link that seems to explain HSS but I haven't had a chance to study it yet.
https://fstoppers.com/originals/demystifying-high-speed-sync-68527

 

The examples don't seem to show stop action as much as letting you use wider f/stops to control, the background...I guess that would stop the action too?

 

I'm interested to learn about the technology......long retired from this kind of work but am still curious

[pop]

To belabour the point - at faster than flash sync speeds the shutter doesn't open and close but a narrow gap between the two shutter curtains moves across the frame. This takes 1/200 second (I presume as this is the flash duration mentioned in the product web site) even for a shutter speed of 1/4000. I'm having trouble understanding how 1/200 second can freeze motion.

The flash duration is 1/180, not 1/200. While the difference is small from technical point of view, using a number which is close to the correct one might confuse members trying to follow the topic.

 

Taking a photograph with an M (Typ 240) in plain daylight at 1/4000 sec will certainly freeze motion, even though the exposure takes 1/180 sec. It does so because every bit of the frame is exposed during 1/4000 of a second.

 

Objects that move at an appreciable speed will shown shortened, elongated or skewed, depending on the direction in which they move. This is because the shutter forms a small slit which is moved within 1/180 of a second over the whole frame. Thus, the bottom border of the frame is exposed approx. 1/180 of a second before the top one.

 

Replacing the sun by a flash which can shine during all of the 1/180 will produce the same behaviour.

[Exodies]

The flash duration is 1/200 sec. See http://priolite.lighting/cart.php?action=add&product_id=113

"They therefore have a long and even flash duration of 1/200 second which is needed for focal plane shutters using such speeds."

[Priolite]

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Hi everyone, I just wanted to clear a few things up regarding Priolite strobes. First, yes our Hot Sync strobes sync with Leica with Leica M and SL cameras.

 

They do this via a long and even flash duration of 1/200th of a second which is the length of time it takes for the shutter curtain to move across the sensor regardless of the shutter speed. There is no loss of power, you get the full 500watts or 1000watts respectively

 

The triggering of the flash has to be absolutely perfect which is why we fine tune each of our triggers to the different camera systems they serve.

 

There is no loss of power such as you would see with a HSS system which pulses light several times while the shutter exposes.

 

The key benefit is that these strobes allow you to freeze motion with the shutter. You are freed from the typical shutter speed limitations of your cameras sync speed. You can expose for ambient light while freezing motion which isn't possible in almost any situation with traditional strobes.

 

Priolite is the only company that offers this solution for Leica users as far as I know

 

Here is a review that was recently posted which explains the system. 

https://fstoppers.com/originals/any-speed-any-power-fstoppers-reviews-priolite-hot-sync-strobes-171780

[jto555]

 

 

For use with Leica (in my experience with SL) I take the Nikon trigger. It works fine with my Priolite, and I discussed all that stuff with Priolite. They have no technical strength over Bowens, Jinbei and others in the case of HSS.

From what you are saying the Bowens and Jinbel will sync with Leica all the way to 1/4000 sec? That is wonderful news. Have you experience with either of the systems? If so what trigger did you use? I am not having a go at you, I just would like a few options for HSS with my M. Also, there is a Bowens main dealer quite close to where I work.

 

By the way "Maybe you don`t understand the difference of TTL HSS vs HSS..." is a bit of an unnecessary comment, don't you think?

[Priolite]

Guys, here is an excellent article from Elinchrom explaining the differences between HSS and Hi-Sync and how it works. 

 

http://www.elinchrom.com/learn/hss-hs.html

Edited April 13, 2017 by pop
Link fixed

[marchyman]

Link fubared with cruft at the end.   This one works: http://www.elinchrom.com/learn/hss-hs.html

[MJ_in_LA]

I recently got the Priolite 500 Hotsync with the Leica transmitter.  Works just fine on my M240 and SL at all shutter speeds, but does not function on my  M9M at shutter speeds faster than 1/180s.  I use it for fill flash on outdoor portraits.  See enclosed example shot under bright 11 am summer sun at f2, 1/1000s, ISO 100,  Leica SL in manual mode, 75mm prime,  Priolite fitted with a shoot-through umbrella.   Also did a bunch of studio tests to check fall-off across the frame at higher shutter speeds, and could not find anything significant.   Summarizing, it does what I  intended and it has WAY more power than a speedlight.  Downsides--it's pretty big, and because it has an onboard battery, it can be a bit top-heavy--I use a sturdy Manfrotto tripod with a stud in place of a standard light stand, and restrict myself to small-ish modifiers to keep things from tipping if a breeze comes up.

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[sillbeers15]

HSS from speedlites do offer limited ability to overpower the sun in outdoor application as the intensity of light is greatly reduced due to the need to fire multiple pulse of light. On shutter speed of 1/2000 sec and below can still work at close range from the output of one speedlite despite slow recycle time and potential overheating after several shots. You do see some photographers bundling four flash guns together without modifier.

Hi Sync solution offered by Prolite is a more sustainable solution but cons include weight and bulk to carry outdoors.

For amerturers, there is a cheating hyper sync solution without having to invest in Hi Sync lights. For Leica users, we can use a HSS competible flash (on or off hotshoe) to trigger one powerful strobe on Manual mode or several speedlites on Manual mode via optical slave mode to overpower the sun.

[RvN]

On 10/13/2018 at 2:07 AM, MJ_in_LA said:

I recently got the Priolite 500 Hotsync with the Leica transmitter.  Works just fine on my M240 and SL at all shutter speeds, but does not function on my  M9M at shutter speeds faster than 1/180s.  I use it for fill flash on outdoor portraits.  See enclosed example shot under bright 11 am summer sun at f2, 1/1000s, ISO 100,  Leica SL in manual mode, 75mm prime,  Priolite fitted with a shoot-through umbrella.   Also did a bunch of studio tests to check fall-off across the frame at higher shutter speeds, and could not find anything significant.   Summarizing, it does what I  intended and it has WAY more power than a speedlight.  Downsides--it's pretty big, and because it has an onboard battery, it can be a bit top-heavy--I use a sturdy Manfrotto tripod with a stud in place of a standard light stand, and restrict myself to small-ish modifiers to keep things from tipping if a breeze comes up.

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So would i be correct that this Hyper Sync system wil not work faster than 180th at the Leica m8.2, M9 and M9M ?

 

That is not good news cause i just found out about Priolite HS and already had a happy feeling that i found a solution to flash at faster speeds ..

 

 

Edited January 2, 2019 by RvN
wrong typing

[jto555]

On 1/2/2019 at 4:39 PM, RvN said:

So would i be correct that this Hyper Sync system wil not work faster than 180th at the Leica m8.2, M9 and M9M ?

 

That is not good news cause i just found out about Priolite HS and already had a happy feeling that i found a solution to flash at faster speeds ..

 

 

I would suggest getting in touch with Priolite. It could be that the transmitter needs a diferent firmware, hopefully.

[MJ_in_LA]

Sorry about the delay in responding. 

As noted, the Priolite does not work with (my) M9M and the latest firmware beyond 1/180s.  

I also purchased Leica's SF64 speedlight, and while it works just fine in TTL mode at all shutter speeds on the M240 and SL, it does not go beyond 1/180s on (my) M9M.

Leads me to believe that the M9M (and by inference, the whole M9 series of cameras) may have some sort of limitation in syncing at higher speeds.