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M6 - how to know the film is fully exposed and question about rewinding


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I just got my first Leica M6 and am (of course) trying everything out extensively. Unfortunately, I am facing the known problem with the frame counter that is not resetting to zero when opening the bottom of the camera. The camera goes back to the seller next weekend to get this fixed.

In order to discover everything else that might need some attention, I have two silly questions:

1) How do I notice that the film is fully exposed? Even when reaching the max number of frames on the film roll, I can still wind the rapid-advance lever and also press the shutter release button like for normal exposures. I did this five six times before finally rewinding the film.

2) I noticed that it only takes a few winds of the rewind lever to fully rewind the film. Is this normal or is it a sign that the rewind mechanism is not working properly? Or might the prior owner possibly have changed the wind meachanism to two or three stroke? And how could I identify that?

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Pilot error.

You didn't load the film properly and very frugally made all exposures on the first frame.

When the film is properly loaded the rewind crank will turn with each advance (take up the slack first)

 

Loading the film properly is not difficult, but a bit of a trick.

Open the baseplate and the back.

Pull out the film lead a bit and drop the film in/ Make sure that the beginning of the film is well into the three-pronged takeup spool.

Make sure the film engages with the sprockets and close the back. Close the bottom, Advance the film twice, take up the slack in the rewind crank, advance once more and make sure the rewind crank turns.

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It sounds to me that maybe the film didnt get loaded correctly. It is quite normal to get maybe up to 2-3 frames extra but when the whole film is eexposed you shouldn't be able to wind the film anymore. It should also take more than a few winds to rewind the film.

 

It is also quite normal that you don't get the film loaded correctly the first time, it happend to me with my first camera (a Practica) and it happend to me with my first Leica (an M2). One trick to see if the film is loaded is to watch if the film rewind crank moves when you wind the film. If this is indeed the case, one good thing is that you normally only do this mistake once (well I did it twice... but at least with different camera systems)

Edited by MSB
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The film advance lever will not wind on anymore when you reach the end of the film.  Do not force it, or the film may tear off the cassette.

 

It takes many winds to rewind a fully used 24, or 36 exposure film.  I listen and feel when it just leaves the loading sprocket, so I still have a tongue to pull out rather than fishing inside the cassette for the "end".

 

It sounds as if your winding mechanism, counter, etc all need an overhaul...the camera is defective.

 

As pop et al says.  All film users know to watch the rewind crank turn, as you wind on the film...if it doesn't it is not loaded properly and must be reloaded into the take-up sprocket.

 

all best.

Edited by david strachan
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The film advance lever will not wind on anymore when you reach the end of the film.  Do not force it, or the film may tear off the cassette.

 

It takes many winds to rewind a fully used 24, or 36 exposure film.  I listen and feel when it just leaves the loading sprocket, so I still have a tongue to pull out rather than fishing inside the cassette for the "end".

 

It sounds as if your winding mechanism, counter, etc all need an overhaul...the camera is defective.

 

As pop says.  All film users know to watch the rewind crank turn, as you wind on the film...if it doesn't it is not loaded properly and must be reloaded into the take-up sprocket.

 

all best.

Nah - the sprockets didn't engage, and/or the film was insufficiently threaded into the takeup prongs.

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Thanks a lot everyone for the ultra-fast responses. Indeed I did not load the film correctly. I just loaded a new roll, took some spring pictures around the house and when reaching the end of the film, as supposed, the film lever does not advance anymore. And the rewind feels normal as well! So, it looks like I am only dealing with the problem that the frame counter is not resetting to zero. It always goes somewhere between 35 and 40 when opening the bottom.

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Hello Tschulze100,

 

Welcome to the Forum.

 

1 of the nice things about mechanical "M" cameras is that many of the internal mechanical systems are NOT physically connected to each other. Or, at least, not physically connected to each other all of the time.

 

For example: A person can adjust the lens aperture while the shutter is operating. There is no physical interconnect.

 

The frame counting mechanism is something that is not continually connected to the film advance mechanism.

 

This means that SOME of the times when the frame counter is not operating correctly: The problem may have nothing to do with the film advance mechanism.

 

Best Regards,

 

Michael

Edited by Michael Geschlecht
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Thanks a lot everyone for the ultra-fast responses. Indeed I did not load the film correctly. I just loaded a new roll, took some spring pictures around the house and when reaching the end of the film, as supposed, the film lever does not advance anymore. And the rewind feels normal as well! So, it looks like I am only dealing with the problem that the frame counter is not resetting to zero. It always goes somewhere between 35 and 40 when opening the bottom.

 

 

When you open the bottom, it should not go to 0. It should go to 43 when you open the bottom, so that 0 is the first frame ready to take after you have fired one blank loading the camera.

 

If it doesn't, then it is defective. But, if that is defective, I wonder about the condition of the rest of it. The M6 is not a rare camera, and unless is was very cheap, I'd return it and get another that worked properly.

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Yes, but the counter of my camera resets to 37. Do, obviously something is wrong with that.

Are you 100% sure? The numbers go the opposite way to what you'd expect. I often mistake the numbers left!

If it doesn't go back to 43, then I reiterate that I would just return it and get a different one.

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Yes, I am 100% sure.

 

You started by saying it is a 'known problem' when the counter doesn't reset to zero, but I suppose at least Michael temporarily fixed the camera in the conceptual sense. If the place you bought it gave you the information it is a 'known problem' I'd possibly think twice about them fixing it, or ask them to drop in on the forum if they need any tips before ripping it apart.

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I found the information doing my own websearch and following that, the shop digged a little bit deeper. They have someone in Southern Cal who does Leica repairs and who believes he knows what it is about and can do it. Good idea to ask them drop into the forum for advise, I'll ask them to do that.

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