M10 Banding in high contrast setting

[Overgaard]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Here is another example. This time the TV is the significant light source. I have upped contrast to make the bands more evident.

 

L1001382.jpg

 

 

I would say sensor issue (or electronics). Small chance of SD card error, but more likely some recording from the sensor rows that has a glitch.

 

Send an e-mail with the pictures to Leica Customer service in Wetzlar cs@leica-camera.com and ask them. It's likely their technicians knows immediately what the problem is and how to solve it quickly. 

[pop]

I don't think this is any kind of blooming. The fault reminds me of the kind of stripes the M9 (I believe) used to produce with certain combination of cards and batteries. IIRC, the issue was produced by some componentes drawing too much power while reading out the sensor, and it was kind of solved by changing the sequence of processing steps and by delaying the processing of the pictures after the exposure.

 

Are these samples parts of exposure series, and if so, at what rate did you take the shots?

 

In any event, collect a fair sample of those shots demonstrating the failure and forward them to Leica. This is not as it is supposed to be.

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[jaapv]

Here is another example. This time the TV is the significant light source. I have upped contrast to make the bands more evident.

 

L1001382.jpg

I'm surprised that you're still able to show us new examples. The camera should be in an UPS van on the A48 on its final stretch to Wetzlar by now. And you with a replacement in  your hands

[Viv1857]

Leica have indicated that this looks very much like a problem with the sensor and one that they have not come across before either with the M or SL.

 

So perhaps a unique instance affecting just me unfortunately?

 

I'm expecting a replacement soon.

[PSV]

I think this is a sensor problem, insufficient seal on the edge reference pixels. Return the camera and demand another one.

 

This is what I would do.

[a911s]

Unrelated no doubt... but I'm wondering if anyone has noticed the compressed DNG only feature contributing to reduced color depth in the post-processing of M10 files?

[mjh]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Unrelated no doubt... but I'm wondering if anyone has noticed the compressed DNG only feature contributing to reduced color depth in the post-processing of M10 files?

There is no reduced colour depth. As the compression is lossless, the colour depth is the same as it would be with an uncompressed file.

[mjh]

Leica have indicated that this looks very much like a problem with the sensor and one that they have not come across before either with the M or SL.

 

So perhaps a unique instance affecting just me unfortunately?

I suppose so. While the phenomenon resembles the green streak issue affecting the M8 (and sometimes the M9), this isn’t something one would expect from this sensor.

[luigi bertolotti]

...the phenomenon resembles the green streak issue affecting the M8...

Yes, I remember well the green band issue on M8... Always related to next to edge light source, and not so easy to be reproduced consistently... but it was real and (apparently) not related to a certain batch of cameras : btw, never observed the phenomenon on M240, though having made many tentatives to achieve it....

[digitalfx]

Unrelated no doubt... but I'm wondering if anyone has noticed the compressed DNG only feature contributing to reduced color depth in the post-processing of M10 files?

 

 

The DNG's use a lossless compression...if Leica gave us uncompressed you would not be able to tell the difference, just like with the M240's DNG files.

There is no reason to have the uncompressed version which just slow down the camera with zero advantage.

[jaapv]

Actually, although the compression is lossless, Erwin Puts suggests, and it seems like he is quoting Leica, that it does increase noise.

[sandymc]

Actually, although the compression is lossless, Erwin Puts suggests, and it seems like he is quoting Leica, that it does increase noise.

 

 

Someone would have to talk long and fast to convince me that lossless compression increases noise..... 

 

Sandy

[jaapv]

FWIIW...

 

There are many different lossless algorithms, but all of them have to cope with noise, a method that limits the possible compression.

Now that I reread it, it may be that he means is the other way around, i.e. that noise complicates compression. Puts-exegesis can be difficult

[sandymc]

FWIIW...

 

Now that I reread it, it may be that he means is the other way around, i.e. that noise complicates compression. Puts-exegesis can be difficult

 

 

Ahhh, ok, that would actually make sense. Noise is random, aka has high entropy, so compresses very badly.

 

Puts in translation     

 

Sandy

Edited February 2, 2017 by sandymc

[edwardkaraa]

Ah, that's why compressed noisy files are quite large.

[sandymc]

Ah, that's why compressed noisy files are quite large.

 

 

Exactly right. All forms of lossless arithmetic compression work by exploiting some kind of predictability in the data. Truly random data isn't predictable, so can't be compressed.

 

Sandy

[Budfox]

To the Viv1857 - can you let us know the outcome of your reporting to Leica? Am holding off on ordering pending this not being a more widespread problem.

thanks

[UliWer]

Actually, although the compression is lossless, Erwin Puts suggests, and it seems like he is quoting Leica, that it does increase noise.

Can you tell where Mr. Puts makes this suggestion, or where he suggests just the other way round - according to more advanced exegesis?  

Edited February 2, 2017 by UliWer

[jaapv]

Can you tell where Mr. Puts makes this suggestion, or where he suggests just the other way round - according to more advanced exegesis?

 

IMX-M10

Scroll down.

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[mjh]

Now that I reread it, it may be that he means is the other way around, i.e. that noise complicates compression.

I am sure that is exactly what he meant:

 

Leica has implemented only the option of the compressed files to reduce the size of the image file and enhance the speed of operation when selecting continuous shooting operation. There are many different lossless algorithms, but all of them have to cope with noise, a method that limits the possible compression. The M10 files have a standard size of between ± 25 and ± 30 Mp (at ISO 200 and depending on the amount of detail information), increasing to 40.2 Mp at ISO 50000.