timothy Posted June 17, 2007 Share #1 Posted June 17, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) I'm almost psychologically ready to purchase the M8. I'm going to try purchasing through B&H and having the camera shipped to my parents in the States. I'll be traveling to the States for my annual family visit (Seattle is nicer to visit during the summer). So, my shopping cart looks like this so far: 4795.00 USD (1) Leica M8 (Black) 0109.95 USD (1) Leica Battery M8 Rechargeable Lithium-Ion Battery 0163.80 USD (4) Sandisk 2GB Extreme III Secure Digital (SD) Card 0379.99 USD (1) Voigtlander Wide Angle Nokton 40mm f/1.4 Aspherical 0374.95 USD (1) Voigtlander Wide Angle Color-Skopar 21mm f/4.0 P 5823.69 USD Sub-Total What other accessories do I need? How helpful is the hand grip? What about filters? I'm thinking about foregoing the IR-cut filters but getting some polarizer filters. The Voightlander lenses I've chosen have filter sizes of 43mm and 39mm, respectively. Remember, I'm just a punk kid and hourly minimum wage earner; I don't even own a bike much less a car or a house; I walk everywhere to save on bus fare; this is one giant leap for Timothy. The reason I emphasize try is that I will have to choose Bill Me Later and cross my fingers that B&H partner CIT Bank will approve a loan to me for the amount financed to pay for my purchase. Call me a pessimist, but I have my doubts that they'll go for it. I have some credit history, but . . . hey, we'll see. If approved, the idea is to use the M8 to make enough money to pay for itself in 6 months. I've already been talking with local bands, social networking, and whatnot. If refused, the tentative plan is to cut back on expenses by, for example, going on a diet consisting of only unsweetened peanut butter, quinoa, and spirulina, and saving every last penny until I can make the purchase in cash. I don't know if/when/how long that will be. Like I said, I'm crossing my fingers. If anyone has any creative financing ideas, let me know. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/26817-m8-in-the-shopping-cart-lets-talk-accessories-and-financing/?do=findComment&comment=283012'>More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 17, 2007 Posted June 17, 2007 Hi timothy, Take a look here M8 in the shopping cart: let's talk accessories . . . and financing. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
timothy Posted June 17, 2007 Author Share #2 Posted June 17, 2007 This is supposed to be called "M8 in shopping cart: let's talk accessories . . . and financing." Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted June 17, 2007 Share #3 Posted June 17, 2007 The grip is good. I never had one on any M camera before the M8 and since I got one for the M8 I have bought one for my M3. I have 2 M8's and at this time only one grip. I can really feel the difference between the 2 cameras. The one I have the grip installed on just feels better and I get a much better hold of the camera with the grip. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
carstenw Posted June 17, 2007 Share #4 Posted June 17, 2007 Given that the M8 itself is the major expense, there isn't much you can do to reduce the total price. However, the Extreme III cards are not really necessary. You could save a bit by going with the Ultra II cards, or even by buying two Transcend 150x 4GB cards instead (I think that will be cheaper, but you will have to check your dealer). You could also get away with one battery for a while, but maybe that is too risky. The Voigtländer 21mm lens is one of the less well regarded lenses in their lineup. Perhaps a 25/40 or 25/50 setup would do the trick? Good luck! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tashley Posted June 17, 2007 Share #5 Posted June 17, 2007 The grip is useful but you could make a sling, like Wilson Laidlaw did, by getting an old camera strap made of webbing and cutting it to about 5 inches long. Then make it into a 'B' shape so that your right hand (where pinkie is first) second and third fingers fit tightly but comfortably through the two loops of the B. Punch a hole with a hot soldering iron through the point where the two points of the B meet between the fingers, going through three layers of fabric (the mid B, and each of the two ends but not quite at the ends). Then position the three lined up holes over the strap lug on the right of the camera, push them down hard and struggle to thread a normal keyring through the lug. You now have a very viable replacement hand grip, which leaves your fourth finger free to press the shutter. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Polarisers are not easy to use since you have no TTL vision. Better get the IR filters - if you shoot gigs there be a LOT of IR around. Fake polariser effects in software for now. My two lens choices would be the CV 15mm and the screw-fit CV35mm. Get just one IR filter and share it between the two (they are both 39mm but you'll need to make a Heath Robinson setup to keep it in place on the CV15 which has no thread: the filter sites inside the hood and needs to be wedged in with something like a thin strip of velvet glued around the edge of the filter. Then use the money you would have spent on the handgrip on two John Milich codable adaptors. Save money on slower cards, they are dirt cheap. And enjoy. The shooting experience is liberating! Tim ps where are you travelling from? In the UK, if you know the right people, you could get an M8 new and slightly cheaper than that... Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Polarisers are not easy to use since you have no TTL vision. Better get the IR filters - if you shoot gigs there be a LOT of IR around. Fake polariser effects in software for now. My two lens choices would be the CV 15mm and the screw-fit CV35mm. Get just one IR filter and share it between the two (they are both 39mm but you'll need to make a Heath Robinson setup to keep it in place on the CV15 which has no thread: the filter sites inside the hood and needs to be wedged in with something like a thin strip of velvet glued around the edge of the filter. Then use the money you would have spent on the handgrip on two John Milich codable adaptors. Save money on slower cards, they are dirt cheap. And enjoy. The shooting experience is liberating! Tim ps where are you travelling from? In the UK, if you know the right people, you could get an M8 new and slightly cheaper than that... ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/26817-m8-in-the-shopping-cart-lets-talk-accessories-and-financing/?do=findComment&comment=283188'>More sharing options...
DaveEP Posted June 17, 2007 Share #6 Posted June 17, 2007 IMHO the grip is worth having. I have one on both my M8s, and it means I can comfortably hold the M8 in my right hand without having to squeeze hard to maintain grip. Like Carsten I would skip the Ultra III cards. Some people (including me) have had problems with them in the M8. The Ultra II works OK - but has proved to be quite a bit slower than the Transcend. I use all Transcend cards in the M8 now. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisC Posted June 17, 2007 Share #7 Posted June 17, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Timothy - You don't say where you are based, if it is in Europe beware of your nice new equipment being hit for VAT and import duty when you return. As regards accessories, the single most important purchase with your poverty peanut butter diet must be Whole Earth [crunchy] Original peanut butter, simply the best there is and more addictive than little black lenses. Other than that, my only accessories are a tripod [carried in a shoulder bag] with Manfrotto Junior Geared Head, Linhof quick release plate that stays on the camera for aided hand holding stability and quick tripod use, cable release, and mini hot shoe mounting spirit level [inexpensive, from Jessops UK]. By committing at your age to Leica, you are doing what I wish I had done 30 years ago. I think you and the camera will do fine. Good luck. ......................Chris Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sirvine Posted June 17, 2007 Share #8 Posted June 17, 2007 Some people will disagree with me, but I don't recommend the Nokton 40. It's an awkward focal length and it does ugly stuff to points lights etc. The bokeh can be nice, though, if that's your primary reason for getting it. IMO, not worth going into debt for that lens. Honestly, I don't recommend buying an M8 on borrowed money at all. If your plan is to make the money back in short order, you'd be better off buying used M-system film gear and using that for your commercial jobs until you can afford an M8. You'd be better off spending the money on lenses than an M8, since digital bodies have an inherently shorter "half-life" than lenses do. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisC Posted June 17, 2007 Share #9 Posted June 17, 2007 ...., I don't recommend buying an M8 on borrowed money at all. If your plan is to make the money back in short order, you'd be better off buying used M-system film gear and using that for your commercial jobs ........ I disagree Sol. Timothy - I can only talk of the professional environment I know [and yours, or Sol's may be different]. Where I am, film is not an option for commercial work, and no client is willing to pay the added costs of shooting film, processing, and scanning before working images in the essential digital environment. Film is good stuff, but likely to make properly costed professional work unsustainable. You are young, if you are healthy; back your talent and go for it. The worst that can happen is getting nackered working hard to pay your debts. ..............................Chris Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sirvine Posted June 17, 2007 Share #10 Posted June 17, 2007 Point well taken, Chris. R-D1s is less than half the price of an M8 and still allows for collecting M lenses. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidStone Posted June 17, 2007 Share #11 Posted June 17, 2007 ...The Voigtländer 21mm lens is one of the less well regarded lenses in their lineup. Perhaps a 25/40 or 25/50 setup would do the trick? I can only say that I have the CV 21 and I use it a lot as a 'substitute' 28mm. I find it produces excellent results and is very sharp, even at f/4. You'll need a 28mm finder of course, although the whole viewfinder frame in the M8 is quite a good approximation (and cheaper too). In the real world of photography - rather than lens tests - the vignetting this lens produces is minimal and can be ignored. Amazing value for the price. David Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
carstenw Posted June 17, 2007 Share #12 Posted June 17, 2007 I can only say that I have the CV 21 and I use it a lot as a 'substitute' 28mm. I find it produces excellent results and is very sharp, even at f/4. You'll need a 28mm finder of course, although the whole viewfinder frame in the M8 is quite a good approximation (and cheaper too). In the real world of photography - rather than lens tests - the vignetting this lens produces is minimal and can be ignored. Amazing value for the price. David I don't mean that it is a bad lens, just that it isn't as good as several other, excellent Voigtländer lenses. Several people here have 21mm copies which never really get perfectly sharp in the corners. A couple of others have ones which do. The 25 never has this problem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbarker13 Posted June 17, 2007 Share #13 Posted June 17, 2007 I'm using the Transcend 150 2gb cards. They work great. And they were a lot cheaper than those Extreme IIIs. I'd say the handgrip would be sort of a luxury item that i wouldn't want to finance on a credit card. Just wrap your hand up in the camera strap - the camera will be quite secure. It would cost you a litle more, but a great 2-lens combo would be the CV 28 ulton and the CV 50 Nokton. I may be wrong here, but I get the sense you might be doing some low-light shooting. And those two lenses are really wonderful for that, and priced pretty well. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted June 17, 2007 Share #14 Posted June 17, 2007 Tim, are you really wanting for a 1,4 standard lens (i.e.the Nokton) ? I ask this for I think that for less money you can find a very good Summicron C 40, it's f2, of course, but is in my op. one of the best choice for a budget solution on M8; well I admit the I am definitely a Leicaphile... and consider a pity to have M8 without at least one Leica lens... but I have often seen in this forum that the Cron 40 is appreciated a lot. And... I even suppose that for the (good anyway) price of the Nokton you can almost find a Summicron 40 + Elmar or Elmar-C 4/90... lenses you can trust on if you are more interested in content than deep considerations on sharpness: and for the Elmar 90 (E39 filter, BM) I have tested by myself it can do well on M8. Besides this... take the IR/UV filter you need: they are REALLY necessary in the situations thay have been made for (a problem exists regarding the filter on Cron 40... but thanks to the forum member named "Ict" can be easily solved) The hand grip is not so essential in my personal opinion. I wish you sincerely to sell a lot of pictures and go on with M8: it's less than a month I have it, but it's a pleasure to use: it seems to me (judging on your posts) that you are already well inside the digital process: so better fo you ! I work in ICT, but had not a single experience on digital pic before the acquisition of my M8... lot of things to learn... Best whishes again, your pictures show a personal style that can evolve to something relly good. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken_tanaka Posted June 17, 2007 Share #15 Posted June 17, 2007 Timothy, My opinion, for what it's worth: A young person with limited financial resources or prospects needlessly taking on $6,000+ of unsecured, high-rate debt is just plain 20-something stupid. Really stupid. You're being overcome by fetishism. There are many more reasonably-priced, and more versatile, cameras available today. The images you showed above, presumably that you enjoy or have created, are mainly Photoshop products, anyway. Get a grip on yourself. Walk away from the whole matter for a couple of weeks. Then see if you're still obsessed with this notion. BTW, yes, I do have an M8. But I'm probably older than your parents and have resources sufficient to make such a purchase easily. But I also worked many years to accumulate those resources. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted June 17, 2007 Share #16 Posted June 17, 2007 Timothy,My opinion, for what it's worth: A young person with limited financial resources or prospects needlessly taking on $6,000+ of unsecured, high-rate debt is just plain 20-something stupid. Really stupid. You're being overcome by fetishism. There are many more reasonably-priced, and more versatile, cameras available today. The images you showed above, presumably that you enjoy or have created, are mainly Photoshop products, anyway. Get a grip on yourself. Walk away from the whole matter for a couple of weeks. Then see if you're still obsessed with this notion. BTW, yes, I do have an M8. But I'm probably older than your parents and have resources sufficient to make such a purchase easily. But I also worked many years to accumulate those resources. Ken, maybe you're right, and maybe it can happen that in 12-18 months our beloved M8s are worth less than half the current price, and one can easily find one... the digital world moves at a speed we were not accustomed: my generation ('56) was luckier in this respect... I was 23 when got struck by Leica dream... and it was easy to finance the old M4 I still have... they were times in which the rule was photo=SLR, and the collector market was not yet heating. But, Tim, when one is young it is also the time to do something you wouldn't do 10 or 20 years after... many times, in the last years, happened sometimes that I said to myself "damn I really CAN afford a Hasselblad set..." and then "well, Luigi, do not make stupid things... you are no more than a standard amateur..." Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
larry Posted June 17, 2007 Share #17 Posted June 17, 2007 Timothy, I have to agree with Ken's advice. Unless your dream is so important that it outweighs good economic sense, you should consider other alternatives. I've owned every type of camera imaginable, but never owned a Leica until three years ago -- it was worth the very long wait. However, I can say with confidence that not having a Leica won't make you less of a photographer, but having one certainly won't make you a better photographer. Good luck with whatever you decide. Larry Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
timd. Posted June 17, 2007 Share #18 Posted June 17, 2007 Timothy,My opinion, for what it's worth: A young person with limited financial resources or prospects needlessly taking on $6,000+ of unsecured, high-rate debt is just plain 20-something stupid. Really stupid. You're being overcome by fetishism. There are many more reasonably-priced, and more versatile, cameras available today. The images you showed above, presumably that you enjoy or have created, are mainly Photoshop products, anyway. Get a grip on yourself. Walk away from the whole matter for a couple of weeks. Then see if you're still obsessed with this notion. i can't add too much to what is said above. what equipment do you use right now? what pictures you have in mind doing with the m8 in the next six months are impossible with the stuff you're using? what do you guess are welfare organizations and local band paying for the pictures intended (to my mind these two kinds of customers are not the ones wanting to finance a $5000-investment within half a year, but i may be wrong). what about the other side of your digital machinery, e.g fast computer for dealing with bigger dng-pics, photoshop, calibrated monitor etc. you will need this if you want to keep up post-processing on m8-level. otherwise it would be pure fetishism to use a cam like that. thought about taxes you will have to pay when going professional (and you are going professional if you earn that much in such a little time). sorry for boring you with all those worries, but at over 30 i'm allowed to do so. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
philipotto Posted June 17, 2007 Share #19 Posted June 17, 2007 Timothy, I second the recommendation of shooting and selling your work with a lesser camera until you can purchase an M8 outright. I have an M8 fund myself. As for the current setup, I would replace the two CVs with the 28mm F2.8 elmarit ASPH and the 50mm F2.8 elmar. I would also replace the sandisks with Transcend 150x SD cards. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Mondello Posted June 17, 2007 Share #20 Posted June 17, 2007 Timothy, I also think an M8 in your situation is probably unwise. Debt is an awful (and ridiculously expensive) thing and should be avoided unless absolutely necessary. Been there, don't want to go back! Seriously, pick up a used Epson R-D1 instead. It is a terrific camera and you can get three of them (used) for the price of an M8. Neither would I buy those 2 CV lenses first (I own both of them). If you do, you've left out the LTM to M adapter $59 and a 28mm VF $130+ which you'll also need. Having already done this, I'd likely do it a little differently now and look at these lenses first depending of course on how you like to shoot. 35mm Ultron 1.7 (just discontinued) 15mm Super Wide Heliar 4.5 75mm Color Heliar 2.5 50mm Nokton 1.5 each of the above requires a $60 LTM>M adapter the CV 25mm (now available RF coupled in an M mount through Camera Quest) is about as wide as you can use on the M8 without a separate finder and would probably be a good place to start coupled either with the 75 (my choice) or the 50 above. In your thinking and budgeting don't neglect upgrading your computer system. My experience was that I soon needed additional software, plug ins, more HD space (LOTS) and big back up drives, I added RAM, I put in a new video card, etc. I agree that IF you can put it off for a week or two and then see if you still feel that you want to spend this much money at this time, that it is a good idea to take a breath, step back and be certain. Post back and let us know what you decide! And seriously, I'm sure we all wish you the best of luck! HTH, Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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