OIS on or off?

[Stonewall Brigade]

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Being a long-time Olympus micro 4/3 user, I was accustomed to regularly using the in-camera image stabilization.  Except for tripod-mounted flower macro photography, when I turned image stabilization off, I have always found image stabilization technology to be useful and reliable.  Now with the Leica Q, I'm reading conflicting opinions among different reviews and forum embers about keeping OIS turned off for hand-held photography.  Is it really true that the Leica Q actually slightly degrades image quality when using OIS, as I keep reading?  Doesn't seem logical that Leica would offer OIS but that Q users are split on it being desired. Thanks in advance for all replies.

[matlep]

It says in the manual that OIS might degrade image quality. So for the pixelpeepers = OIS ALWAYS OFF for the rest of us: OIS ON if necessary or if you don´t bother.

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[Herve5]

... So for the pixelpeepers = OIS ALWAYS OFF for the rest of us: OIS ON if necessary or if you don´t bother.

Concise and funny at the same time -I approve :-D

[viramati]

I have it off nearly all the time but have one of my presets set up to have it on when needed

[Stonewall Brigade]

Being a long-time Olympus micro 4/3 user, I was accustomed to regularly using the in-camera image stabilization.  Except for tripod-mounted flower macro photography, when I turned image stabilization off, I have always found image stabilization technology to be useful and reliable.  Now with the Leica Q, I'm reading conflicting opinions among different reviews and forum embers about keeping OIS turned off for hand-held photography.  Is it really true that the Leica Q actually slightly degrades image quality when using OIS, as I keep reading?  Doesn't seem logical that Leica would offer OIS but that Q users are split on it being desired. Thanks in advance for all replies.

 

 

Leica's tech support in New Jersey sent me the following explanation about image stabilization with the Q: "When IOS is turned on, the internal lens elements are put into a ready position to compensate for camera movement that is beneficial for the reduction of potential blur during slow shutter speed image capture and visible shakiness during video capture.  However it should be possible to avoid using that function for shutter speeds of 1/30^th and faster so as to allow the lens elements to remain in their optimal position for the highest degree of image sharpness that the lens design can deliver."

[millsart]

Its really quite simple....turn it on when it makes an obvious improvement, such as trying to shoot handheld at a very low shutter speed.

 

When I'm shooting on the beach on a sunny day with fast shutter speeds, I keep it off.  Its not needed.

 

When I'm shooting on a tripod, I keep it off, it's again, not needed

 

When I'm trying to shoot in low light, or a longish exposure, handheld, and I'm either already at a high ISO, or want to keep the ISO low, its a useful tool and I turn it on.

 

I do the exact same thing with all the lenses I own that have OIS.

[Stonewall Brigade]

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Its really quite simple....turn it on when it makes an obvious improvement, such as trying to shoot handheld at a very low shutter speed.

 

When I'm shooting on the beach on a sunny day with fast shutter speeds, I keep it off.  Its not needed.

 

When I'm shooting on a tripod, I keep it off, it's again, not needed

 

When I'm trying to shoot in low light, or a longish exposure, handheld, and I'm either already at a high ISO, or want to keep the ISO low, its a useful tool and I turn it on.

 

I do the exact same thing with all the lenses I own that have OIS.

 

However, in my opinion it is not logical for Leica's OIS technology to be arbitrary about using.  Look at Olympus digital micro 4/3 cameras with built-in image stabilization.  Regardless of the fast or slow shutter speed, Olympus cameras now have up to 5 f/stops of added stability when using image stabilization and hand-holding the camera.  That is regardless of the shutter speed being fast or slow. The same is true for Fuji, Pentax, Sony and other mage stabilized camera bodies or lenses.  OIS is used with those cameras regardless of shutter speed, except for tripod use. Only Leica gives a vague rationale about turning OIS on or off, which is my observation about the Q's OIS technology - why is it there is if sometimes hurt the image quality? Not logical.

[pop]

....  Regardless of the fast or slow shutter speed, Olympus cameras now have up to 5 f/stops of added stability when using image stabilization and hand-holding the camera.  That is regardless of the shutter speed being fast or slow. .... which is my observation about the Q's OIS technology - why is it there is if sometimes hurt the image quality? Not logical.

Every single setting of a camera sometimes hurts the image quality. Take the aperture, for example. In a setting which calls for a large aperture a small aperture will hurt the quality of the resulting image and vice versa. Choosing a long exposure time where a short one is called for will do it, too. And so on.

 

The effect of OIS is mainly observable when using longer exposure times. When exposing for a very short time, the blurring of the picture will not be as noticeable as when exposing for longer times. Holding your camera steady always will yield better results unless you deliberately want blurry pictures.

[viramati]

However, in my opinion it is not logical for Leica's OIS technology to be arbitrary about using.  Look at Olympus digital micro 4/3 cameras with built-in image stabilization.  Regardless of the fast or slow shutter speed, Olympus cameras now have up to 5 f/stops of added stability when using image stabilization and hand-holding the camera.  That is regardless of the shutter speed being fast or slow. The same is true for Fuji, Pentax, Sony and other mage stabilized camera bodies or lenses.  OIS is used with those cameras regardless of shutter speed, except for tripod use. Only Leica gives a vague rationale about turning OIS on or off, which is my observation about the Q's OIS technology - why is it there is if sometimes hurt the image quality? Not logical.

 

I'm no expert in the tech area but I should imagine that the small sensor size of the the Olympus plus it's slightly lower resolution also would help to mitigate any slight loss in definition.    My finding are that any loss of IQ is hard to see but I just keep OIS off anyway and can quickly turn it on if needed with y'low light' preset in the fn menu

[jmschuh]

However, in my opinion it is not logical for Leica's OIS technology to be arbitrary about using.  Look at Olympus digital micro 4/3 cameras with built-in image stabilization.  Regardless of the fast or slow shutter speed, Olympus cameras now have up to 5 f/stops of added stability when using image stabilization and hand-holding the camera.  That is regardless of the shutter speed being fast or slow. The same is true for Fuji, Pentax, Sony and other mage stabilized camera bodies or lenses.  OIS is used with those cameras regardless of shutter speed, except for tripod use. Only Leica gives a vague rationale about turning OIS on or off, which is my observation about the Q's OIS technology - why is it there is if sometimes hurt the image quality? Not logical.

 

As a former Olympus OMD owner I can tell you that the ISIS in the Oympus cameras can degrade the image quality at faster speeds. I´ve never owned another camera system where I had to switch the IS on and off so often to prevent a loss of image quality. Regulary I got blurry images at higher shutter speeds which were perfectly sharp without the IS (at shutter times where the IS is usually not needed). Always on and off, what a pita. Same with the Olympus PEN. This was one of the main reasons to leave Olympus. I´ve never experienced this phenomenon with Canon, Fujifilm or the integrated OIS in Panasonic lenses. Only with the camera in body stabilization of Olympus.

 

With this bad experience I´ve testet the degrading effect of the image stabilizer with the Leica Q. I can´t find it. It works perfectly also at higher shutter speeds. On the other hand the Q high ISO capability are perfect until up to 6400 ISO for me, so I nearly never use shutter speeds longer than 1/30 sec. So my IS is mostly switched off in order to save power.

[millsart]

However, in my opinion it is not logical for Leica's OIS technology to be arbitrary about using.  Look at Olympus digital micro 4/3 cameras with built-in image stabilization.  Regardless of the fast or slow shutter speed, Olympus cameras now have up to 5 f/stops of added stability when using image stabilization and hand-holding the camera.  That is regardless of the shutter speed being fast or slow. The same is true for Fuji, Pentax, Sony and other mage stabilized camera bodies or lenses.  OIS is used with those cameras regardless of shutter speed, except for tripod use. Only Leica gives a vague rationale about turning OIS on or off, which is my observation about the Q's OIS technology - why is it there is if sometimes hurt the image quality? Not logical.

 

Your assumptions are actually incorrect, and as a current owner of a Fuji X system, along with being a former m4/3 owner, as well as a Nikon DSLR shooter with many VR lens, I always turn OS, VR et al., off when shooting at higher shutter speeds, because it is detrimental to the image quality, AF speed and such.

 

You can get touch of blur, differences in the overall rendering of the background etc when you compare with it on/off.  The system is designed to compensate for slight movements, aka hand shake, over the duration of a longer exposure.  When your exposure is faster, the system is working a bit outside the environment its designed for. 

 

It why there is a switch to turn it on/off, as needed on all those bodies/lenses, just like Leica has provided.

 

 

If you want to leave your OIS turned on all the time, then go ahead and do it.  I personally don't think its gaining you anything, and as has been pointed out, it is making a slightly compromise in overall image quality. 

 

I don't really get what your complaining about even....if you wanted a camera with full time IBIS you could of bought an Olympus.   If you want your Q to have OIS always turned on,  then turn it on and leave it on.

 

Most of us seem content to leave it off, and turn it on, only when needed, which is what Leica intended.  Simple as that.

 

Really the only "issue" that I can see which would really of warranted complains is if Leica made the OIS always active, WITHOUT an option to turn it off.

[Mr.Q]

I have it on most of the time. I only turn it off for use on tripods.

[Stonewall Brigade]

Your assumptions are actually incorrect, and as a current owner of a Fuji X system, along with being a former m4/3 owner, as well as a Nikon DSLR shooter with many VR lens, I always turn OS, VR et al., off when shooting at higher shutter speeds, because it is detrimental to the image quality, AF speed and such.

 

You can get touch of blur, differences in the overall rendering of the background etc when you compare with it on/off.  The system is designed to compensate for slight movements, aka hand shake, over the duration of a longer exposure.  When your exposure is faster, the system is working a bit outside the environment its designed for. 

 

It why there is a switch to turn it on/off, as needed on all those bodies/lenses, just like Leica has provided.

 

 

If you want to leave your OIS turned on all the time, then go ahead and do it.  I personally don't think its gaining you anything, and as has been pointed out, it is making a slightly compromise in overall image quality. 

 

I don't really get what your complaining about even....if you wanted a camera with full time IBIS you could of bought an Olympus.   If you want your Q to have OIS always turned on,  then turn it on and leave it on.

 

Most of us seem content to leave it off, and turn it on, only when needed, which is what Leica intended.  Simple as that.

 

Really the only "issue" that I can see which would really of warranted complains is if Leica made the OIS always active, WITHOUT an option to turn it off.

 

There is no "complaining". Wrong word choice you used.  My comment about image stabilization is that I've only seen Leica suggest that using it's own OIS technology may actually make a photographic image worse. Whereas Olympus, Fuji, Pentax and other camera brands that offer image stabilization market OIS technology as adding extra f/stops of sharpness (regardless of shutter speeds being too slow to hand-hold a camera) to improve the percentage of "sharp" photographs. I think the owners of those camera brands also assume that the percentage of "sharp" images made with those cameras is improved when the image stabilization is used (other than tripod use). what I'd ideally like to see Leica put in writing, in the Q's instruction manual, is a comment like "using OIS at shutter speeds faster than 1/30 sec will worsen the image quality (due to some technical reason related to the lens elements, etc.) Then I be able to say "OK", I understand and accept that odd reasoning. But right now Leica is rather vague on when to use OIS and when to not use it.

[colonel]

In my understanding all cameras, and lenses, with IS are less sharp with it on, which is why I rarely use it.

It's not just the optimal position of the elements, it's also the tiny adjustments the stabilisation system is making all the time, which means it effects all cameras including sensor based IS systems. This is why all manufacturers say you must turn the system off when on a tripod.

 

This is nothing particular to the Q. It's just that Leica is more honest in the manual.

 

It's very useful when you don't need the picture to be at it's sharpest but you need the assistance. Typically, for me, when the subject is more static (IS is for the photographer, not the subject) but you have to shoot quickly. So for fairly static street scenes for example, or when your platform is not completely stable, e.g. Standing on a small vibrating bridge.

 

Best rgds

[benpisati]

I can definitely confirm that with OIS activated photographs are not sharp, there is a slight blur, the same situation with OIS disabled photos are perfect. For example, I often shot wedding pictures, in the church my setting is auto-iso and 1/125 safety speed. Sometimes the photos are inexplicably blur, often when I moved slow the camere following the subjet. I'm sure much better with IOS disabled. I verified this. Very frustrating.

[MT0227]

I agree.  The only time I use IS, whether it be Leica's or with my Nikon VR lenses, is when my shooting platform is not 100% stable (vibrating bridge, moving car..etc)

 

or when your platform is not completely stable, e.g. Standing on a small vibrating bridge.
 

[Stonewall Brigade]

I can definitely confirm that with OIS activated photographs are not sharp, there is a slight blur, the same situation with OIS disabled photos are perfect. For example, I often shot wedding pictures, in the church my setting is auto-iso and 1/125 safety speed. Sometimes the photos are inexplicably blur, often when I moved slow the camere following the subjet. I'm sure much better with IOS disabled. I verified this. Very frustrating.

 

Thanks, interesting.  I can confirm as being a former long-time Olympus micro 4/3 shooter, Olympus markets their in-camera image stabilization technology as something that is like magic, and can always be used, all the time (except for tripod shooting).  Olympus owners receive no caution from the company that use of image stabilization yields images that are actually less sharp due to using "image stabilization" for hand held photography. That's why I first said is appears rather not logical that Leica says the Q's OIS technology may worsen the image quality in some instances. Few Olympus or Fuji users get that advice from their camera makers. Regards.

[Sulis]

As with the various Focus Modes, I would find switching between IOS and non-IOS a lot more useful if that was an option available in one of the FN or AEL buttons (or the to me redundant Video button). If I can't switch quickly and securely (ie. knowing that I have switched, and being able to know what state the camera will be in after I've turned it of and then on again) then it rather defeats the point.

 

It's great that Leica have included these useful tools, but at the moment I am having to use up all my User Profile slots just for different focus modes!

[Guest jvansmit]

^{I always keep OIS on as I can't see any difference in IQ when I've tested the same scene with OIS on and OIS off. (disclaimer...I nearly always shoot at ISO1600 or 800 so haven't tested using other ISO values)}

Edited January 20, 2017 by jvansmit

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica Q

[colonel]

^{I always keep OIS on as I can't see any difference in IQ when I've tested the same scene with OIS on and OIS off. (disclaimer...I nearly always shoot at ISO1600 or 800 so haven't tested using other ISO values)}

Wow! I though I was narrow

 

Since it's show and tell, I mostly use:

f1.7, f2 and f8 and f9. Can't be bothered much with the in between

ISO 100, 200 or 1600, 3200

 

Same story

Edited January 20, 2017 by colonel