Leica T Wedding/Event Photography

[erl]

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Fact is, Hassy was largely the camera of choice by Pros at that time. The trick was to configure the camera's 5 components to one's own ergonomic preference. The auxiliary equipment (lights etc. were the real burden). I later moved on to Leica, which matched the changing style requirement of clientele. Camera type definitely influences the ultimate shooting style. I have recently returned to using my Hasselblad kit, this time for my own indulgence. Any work I accept is still done on Leicas, sometimes accompanied by my Sony A7s, using Leica lenses.

[Apoqualia]

Yes, any camera can be used for weddings; but the guy who comes with the Leica T to shoot weddings, for real, holds in much higher esteem his modern toys and joking attitude than his clients.

 

Respect for the customer comes first. Come to work with heavy duty gear that will assuredly not let anyone down, in any single respect of work or circumstance. Even if it rains or snows all of a sudden, and champagne is spilt all over your equipment. 

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[erl]

Yes, any camera can be used for weddings; but the guy who comes with the Leica T to shoot weddings, for real, holds in much higher esteem his modern toys and joking attitude than his clients.

 

Respect for the customer comes first. Come to work with heavy duty gear that will assuredly not let anyone down, in any single respect of work or circumstance. Even if it rains or snows all of a sudden, and champagne is spilt all over your equipment. 

Unsure about your first paragraph.

In the context of the client's brief (paramount), there are sircumstances where it could be OK.

 

Your second paragraph is OK, (respect for client is a given) but the fact is that any gear, HD or otherwise, will breakdown. The only question is when and it won't be convenient! I have had all those eventualities happen to my Hasselblads and Leicas and they, fortunately did not fail because of it. However, they have all failed as a consequence of natural service. The real imperative is to always have a backup for operative gear, not just the cameras.

[lx1713]

I'm a pro. Not much wedding these days. My comments for what it may be worth.

 

I think your personal style does attract a certain type of clientele and the associated ambience of the culture, and of course your results have a self fulfilling effect on your market. I was doing photojournalistic style when all my friends were working with Hasselblads. Simply because I could not afford a blad, so you shape your market with your pictures with whatever equipment you have to survive professionally.

 

If I'm stuck with a Leica T (after all else has failed), I would pick a 11-23, work close. Shoot manual exposure and use bounced flash to  create mood. And talk a lot and slow down the pace. And keep my eyes on the clock.

 

If the T or the TL2 has a electronic distance scale like the SL, I will frame with my eyes and not depend on the LCD. Prefocus with the lens. This is also partly because weddings tend to be a little crowded in amongst my wedding clients. Average size is about 300 to 500 guests. Only political rallies are worse.

 

While wedding tastes do change, capturing the moment, remains  a key skill. I did do a wedding recently. Decided to just use the SL and forget about the canons. Not a pleasant experience but a few positives came out of it. It was also my first experience with a mirrorless camera. Overall the Canon won but I do like using the Leica SL so I'm toying with getting the TL2.

 

I think a Canon 5D and a Q is a nice combo but I dislike the combination on the basis of colour rendering difference. Else it is nice. I have the Canon 1DIII and 5DIV.

 

Here, if I may make a key point in the equipment choice, if you use flash creatively a lot at f2.8 - 5.6 or more importantly very little enlargements, you don't really need a Leica. Personally I find it extremely hard to capture a brief, impromptu moment at f0.95 or f1.4. As beautiful as the bokeh is, I would pick creating nice light at f2.8 - f4 while I capture the right moment. Part of it is because if you don't live in a country with a beautiful surroundings or interesting well lit background architecture, you need to observe and catch relationships played out. Bokeh is overrated in these circumstances.

 

What I do like with my experience with the SL is the completeness of optical quality for the 24-90. I like how I can use it in any sort of lighting conditions at any focal length. I don't really need anything other than a 90-280 which I have not gotten as yet. And yes, the 11-23 is really nice to have.

 

 My experience maybe very different but I just would not use a T for weddings. A Leica SL, yes, but only because experience helps. It was still a very tough experience.

[FlashGordonPhotography]

Interesting that you found the SL difficult. Can you expand on why?

 

I've been shooting weddings with my SLs for 18 months now and would never go back to a DSLR. After 20 years of Canon and some time with Olympus, Fuji, Sony and M's, I'm home with my SL's.

 

Gordon

[Archiver]

Interesting that you found the SL difficult. Can you expand on why?

 

I've been shooting weddings with my SLs for 18 months now and would never go back to a DSLR. After 20 years of Canon and some time with Olympus, Fuji, Sony and M's, I'm home with my SL's.

 

Gordon

Gordon, can you expand on the SL's qualities that have made you switch from all the others?  I've only played with a SL once at a dealer, and wasn't able to make any real assessment.

[lx1713]

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Interesting that you found the SL difficult. Can you expand on why?

I had been on a constant yearly upgrade path from 1998 till 2007 then I stopped with the Canon 1DIII and Leica M8. They both served me very well and just retired 5 months ago. So the SL is a massive change for me rather any fault of its design. It's basically unfamiliarity 

 

I still use Canons though but not in the last 5 weeks. Sadly, the new 5DIV has only 5 - 6 jobs to it's credit.

 

I shoot fast during events, the SF64 is barely able to keep up bounced. With Canon flashes, I could bounce off a surface 30m away but not with the SF64. I'm still learning to adjust the power settings to match. My usual settings aren't effective. So I'm changing my habits a little to accommodate.

The long press to switch on/off a flash is a sad sad thing for me. It's when I'm shooting a well lit stage and switching the view to catch audience reactions in a poorly lit hall that I will switch on the flash but it takes too long.

So the flash is insufficient to my usual needs.

 

There's the preview of exposed shot after triggering. How do I get rid of it? Slows me down.

 

Long presses on the rear buttons slow me down and had many mis-takes when I meant to short press and not long press. This is of course a matter of habit, I will get use to it.

 

I'm trying to get into the habit of checking an exposed shot with the LCD instead of EVF. My camera slows down considerably enough  for me to miss shots. Also, I get strange looks from clients who are waiting for my next shot   when I'm actually checking the shot in the EVF. In a darkened concert hall however its a life saver.

 

Unlike the 1DIII, I do find that bumps against the SL tend to change settings. Maybe I need to change how I bump into it. I think the top dial is a little too large maybe?

 

The handgrip is a needed addition (particularly shooting continually for 15 hours) but with a fault. The video pin hole at the bottom of the grip is correct for camcorder quick release plates but not the SL's video pin hole   Somewhat weird.

 

I like how I can easily switch from shooting video to stills with flash on the SL. Which is the reason to pick the mirrorless SL and get to grips with overcoming my limitations (coming from an M8 and 1DIII, I'm definitely limited)

An interesting fact if you shoot video and would trigger a few shots for stills. The SF64 doesn't flash during those stills. However if you plug in a pc terminal flash, it still works. the flash will work but not TTL of course and limit locked to the video exposure settings.

 

I will get a TL2 ....only because I have TL lenses but I would prefer a 1.5X crop factor SL that uses SL batteries. If Leica builds an electronic gimbal / gyrostabiliser into it and market it as a super 35mm video device (> 29 minutes limit), it might open new markets.

 

On the other hand a TL2 is still very usable for professional needs because not all things are events or weddings. It's as professional as it gets if I match it with a novoflex tilt shift bellows and a good macro lens and much smaller than my Sinar C2.

 

Apologies for the verbosity. I'm thinking through my operational methods and use cases. Hopefully I can solve some problems along the way. The LUF had been a great help in the days of the M8 and a great benefit.

 

I'm getting used to the Leica SL. Not quite at home with EVF, image stabilisers, video, wifi, GPS, touch screen capabilities, display switching(confusing when my nose decided to do that under very tight conditions). And the differences with AF and flash exposure performance. Everyone's posts helped a lot, thanks!  . And yes, maybe getting back to a DSLR is a little difficult. But my profoto flashes, pocket wizard remote triggers (cannot trigger a Leica remotely), Canon TTL flash remind me of the Leica relative limitations. Nonetheless, massively impressive for a young system.

[FlashGordonPhotography]

Gordon, can you expand on the SL's qualities that have made you switch from all the others?  I've only played with a SL once at a dealer, and wasn't able to make any real assessment.

 

Apologies. Getting off topic here. Feel free to skip to the next post.

 

The short version is I just like using them. Buttons where I want them. Doesn't get in the way. With the Fuji, Olympus et al. I still find I need to stop and workout how to change a setting. The SL is totally instinctive to me. Not to many buttons and not to few. Easy to find without looking. Highly customisable to exactly my tastes. The joy stick. Oh... the joystick.... I like the way it fits into the hand. The grip is great. Batteries last more than 8 seconds.

 

The lenses suit me. I prefer a 24-90 over a 24-70. The 50 is superb as is the 90-280. I have the 85 Art and a WATE. That's all I need for an entire wedding (I also have T/S lenses for my commercial work) plus a couple of TTL flashes and a short TTL cable and I'm done.

 

I'm in Oz. So I'm very likely to be shooting an outdoor wedding on a bright sunny day. ISO 50 is invaluable. The shutter sound is quiet. Plus I can have silent shutter now (but without flash).

 

Mirrorless is the future. Being able to review an image in the EVF on a sunny day. A live histogram to get exposure spot on, all the time. A built in spirit level and grid. EVF's are easier to use in a dim reception. AF is fast and super accurate. This isn't the Olympics. I don't need super tracking but I do want a camera that's responsive.

 

And finally. I've been doing this for a long time. I shoot with camera I like, just because. I'm under no illusion my clients notice or care what cameras I own. I see no technical advantage over a Fuji or a Sony. But at the same time I reached sufficiency with the 5D mk1. We're well past needing more image quality. I shoot SL's because I like shooting them. Simple as that. 

 

Gordon

[FlashGordonPhotography]

I had been on a constant yearly upgrade path from 1998 till 2007 then I stopped with the Canon 1DIII and Leica M8. They both served me very well and just retired 5 months ago. So the SL is a massive change for me rather any fault of its design. It's basically unfamiliarity 

 

I still use Canons though but not in the last 5 weeks. Sadly, the new 5DIV has only 5 - 6 jobs to it's credit.

 

I shoot fast during events, the SF64 is barely able to keep up bounced. With Canon flashes, I could bounce off a surface 30m away but not with the SF64. I'm still learning to adjust the power settings to match. My usual settings aren't effective. So I'm changing my habits a little to accommodate.

The long press to switch on/off a flash is a sad sad thing for me. It's when I'm shooting a well lit stage and switching the view to catch audience reactions in a poorly lit hall that I will switch on the flash but it takes too long.

So the flash is insufficient to my usual needs.

 

There's the preview of exposed shot after triggering. How do I get rid of it? Slows me down.

 

Long presses on the rear buttons slow me down and had many mis-takes when I meant to short press and not long press. This is of course a matter of habit, I will get use to it.

 

I'm trying to get into the habit of checking an exposed shot with the LCD instead of EVF. My camera slows down considerably enough  for me to miss shots. Also, I get strange looks from clients who are waiting for my next shot   when I'm actually checking the shot in the EVF. In a darkened concert hall however its a life saver.

 

Unlike the 1DIII, I do find that bumps against the SL tend to change settings. Maybe I need to change how I bump into it. I think the top dial is a little too large maybe?

 

The handgrip is a needed addition (particularly shooting continually for 15 hours) but with a fault. The video pin hole at the bottom of the grip is correct for camcorder quick release plates but not the SL's video pin hole   Somewhat weird.

 

I like how I can easily switch from shooting video to stills with flash on the SL. Which is the reason to pick the mirrorless SL and get to grips with overcoming my limitations (coming from an M8 and 1DIII, I'm definitely limited)

An interesting fact if you shoot video and would trigger a few shots for stills. The SF64 doesn't flash during those stills. However if you plug in a pc terminal flash, it still works. the flash will work but not TTL of course and limit locked to the video exposure settings.

 

I will get a TL2 ....only because I have TL lenses but I would prefer a 1.5X crop factor SL that uses SL batteries. If Leica builds an electronic gimbal / gyrostabiliser into it and market it as a super 35mm video device (> 29 minutes limit), it might open new markets.

 

On the other hand a TL2 is still very usable for professional needs because not all things are events or weddings. It's as professional as it gets if I match it with a novoflex tilt shift bellows and a good macro lens and much smaller than my Sinar C2.

 

Apologies for the verbosity. I'm thinking through my operational methods and use cases. Hopefully I can solve some problems along the way. The LUF had been a great help in the days of the M8 and a great benefit.

 

I'm getting used to the Leica SL. Not quite at home with EVF, image stabilisers, video, wifi, GPS, touch screen capabilities, display switching(confusing when my nose decided to do that under very tight conditions). And the differences with AF and flash exposure performance. Everyone's posts helped a lot, thanks!  . And yes, maybe getting back to a DSLR is a little difficult. But my profoto flashes, pocket wizard remote triggers (cannot trigger a Leica remotely), Canon TTL flash remind me of the Leica relative limitations. Nonetheless, massively impressive for a young system.

 

1. Get Eneloop Pro's for your flash. Things will improve dramatically.

2. The power button on the SF64 sucks as does the touch screen. Sometimes I just pull it out of the hotshoe cause it's quicker. You can do FEC from the camera instead and set it to a long press.

3. Turn off Auto review in the settings part of the menu.

4. Spend some time and customise the long press functions to taste. If there's a button you keep getting mixed up turn the long press off for that button.

5. Fast cards make a difference for image review. On my cameras it's very fast.

6. If you don't like the grip try a RRS plate. I have one glued to each of my bodies. My Leica grip is in a drawer.

7. If you use a sling strap you'll change functions less. I'm using the QD mount on the RRS plate and it's fantastic.

8. You can remotely trigger an SL from your phone. And it has live view.

9. Not all adaptors that work on the SL work on the TL. Check the adaptor you want to use on the TL2 actually works first. For example Leica's own S to L adaptor does not function on the T/TL2.

10. The SL has more DR than most Canons (except 5D4) so with flash you can go a stop faster in ISO and get good colour and DR. Noise is about the same though.

11. Auto mode on the SF64 and 58 operate a little differently than you're used to and can be very very useful. In auto mode on the SF64 and 58 ISO and aperture are still sent from the camera. the change is that the sensor in the flash reads the exposure instead of the sensor. this can help eliminate any pre-flash and is more reliable for backlight fill.

 

Gordon

[lx1713]

Many thanks Gordon, I will run thru each of these items. I appreciate the trouble you took. 

[lx1713]

1. Get Eneloop Pro's for your flash. Things will improve dramatically.

2. The power button on the SF64 sucks as does the touch screen. Sometimes I just pull it out of the hotshoe cause it's quicker. You can do FEC from the camera instead and set it to a long press.

3. Turn off Auto review in the settings part of the menu.

4. Spend some time and customise the long press functions to taste. If there's a button you keep getting mixed up turn the long press off for that button.

5. Fast cards make a difference for image review. On my cameras it's very fast.

6. If you don't like the grip try a RRS plate. I have one glued to each of my bodies. My Leica grip is in a drawer.

7. If you use a sling strap you'll change functions less. I'm using the QD mount on the RRS plate and it's fantastic.

8. You can remotely trigger an SL from your phone. And it has live view.

9. Not all adaptors that work on the SL work on the TL. Check the adaptor you want to use on the TL2 actually works first. For example Leica's own S to L adaptor does not function on the T/TL2.

10. The SL has more DR than most Canons (except 5D4) so with flash you can go a stop faster in ISO and get good colour and DR. Noise is about the same though.

11. Auto mode on the SF64 and 58 operate a little differently than you're used to and can be very very useful. In auto mode on the SF64 and 58 ISO and aperture are still sent from the camera. the change is that the sensor in the flash reads the exposure instead of the sensor. this can help eliminate any pre-flash and is more reliable for backlight fill.

 

Gordon

 

Just to feedback on your good advice.

1. I'm already on eneloops pro, thanks.

2. Done. Followed your earlier posts. Very helpful.

3. Feel like an idiot about this but yes this cured a range of issues I had with responsiveness.

4. Done. Again from posts of you pioneers

5. Got more of the UHSII cards. It was better on a job yesterday.

6. I do like the grip very much when I'm on the 24-90 otherwise adapted lenses or TL ones live on gripless SL

7. I'm not that happy as yet with this style. The back buttons are activated pretty often which makes me nervous    I have a different RRS plate with the same QD mount but I don't use the QD as yet.

8. Another post regarding SL triggering helped but I'm actually thinking of triggering TL2s, 5-6 remote bodies. They are a lot cheaper and more appropriate to the deployment. High resolution, High DOF, low ISO, a better combo than an SL. But not hardware connections.

9. Thanks! Good to know.

10. Agreed. 5DIV has chroma noise that surprisingly cannot be removed in my fav raw developer Iridient Developer. While SL files are a dream. I'm not sure if my judgement is right but it seems to me that direct flash has a nicer effect than Canons which has a pretty dead flat look that says flash.

11. Thanks, that's a good reminder. I was using my canon 600 EXII RT on auto mode until the SF64 arrived. I actually preferred the canon but I'm determine to keep plugging at overcoming the usability limitations. I've actually went back to pure manual in some conditions. And auto mode for other situations.

 

Once again, many thanks Gordon.

[Paul925]

If the SF64 is still not keeping up after addition to the Eneloop Pros, you may wish to consider looking into the Metz P8 power pack or getting a high energy connector to connect the SF64 to a Quantum Turbo or equivalent Bolt/Flashpoint power packs.  I've not seen a cable specifically for the SF64, but I simply used the one I'd purchased for my SF58.

[zakzavada]

Ok, now that the TL2 is released I'm bringing this thread back to my original question from some months ago. Does anyone have any comments about using a TL2 as a backup body to shoot weddings alongside an m10 + Q? I've now sold all my Canon gear and picked up an m10 + 35 f/2,  50 f/1.4, 90 f/2 and a visoflex. I still feel like it may be important to have an AF body other than the Q as well as something that can use M lenses should something unfortunate happen to my m10. What do you all think? 

[Wojtek]

Zakzavada, I don't have much experience with wedding photography (much more with events) and I love the TL2, but in my opinion

TL2 is too slow. 

 

I mean the lag between seeing what you'd like to photograph, pressing the shutter, ..., ...., and seeing what you could photograph again. And I mean the AF speed. Both are ok. They're fine for slow portraits. But IMO for events and weddings any DSLR will do a better job. 

 

In my opinion TL2 is not there yet for "quick response + many pictures per scene" situations. You can't take 10 "aware" shots from a 10 sec situation which it, which you could with a DSLR

 

If you want to take 1 picture fast, TL2 will be OK

If you want to take few pictures of a scene, that's alright

But if you want to combine the two - take few thought out pictures of a scene rapidly - any DSLR will be a better fit. 

Not quality wise. But it'll be quicker

[BernardC]

Ok, now that the TL2 is released I'm bringing this thread back to my original question from some months ago. Does anyone have any comments about using a TL2 as a backup body to shoot weddings alongside an m10 + Q?

 

The TL2 will work just fine as a backup to your backup (or even as a main camera), as long as it suits your shooting style. The image quality is great, and it can (by all accounts) go up to at least ISO 3200 without objectionable noise. That's all you need from your equipment. The rest comes down to talent, practice, social skills, and common sense; none of which are provided by the camera.

 

People used to shoot wedding with a Press camera and 6 4x5 film holders (12 shots). Don't let anybody convince you that you need some kind of war correspondent's kit to cover the event, you don't. The top wedding photographers in my market don't even use zooms.

[fastfashn]

I'm shooting a wedding in September with a Fuji X-Pro 1 (35mm F1.4) and a Leica T (11-23 zoom) and a Fuji XE-1 (18mm F2). 

Edited August 25, 2017 by fastfashn

[FlashGordonPhotography]

Ok, now that the TL2 is released I'm bringing this thread back to my original question from some months ago. Does anyone have any comments about using a TL2 as a backup body to shoot weddings alongside an m10 + Q? I've now sold all my Canon gear and picked up an m10 + 35 f/2,  50 f/1.4, 90 f/2 and a visoflex. I still feel like it may be important to have an AF body other than the Q as well as something that can use M lenses should something unfortunate happen to my m10. What do you all think? 

 

The lack of being able to use the EVF and a flash at the same time would be an issue for me. AF isn't brilliant when the light levels go down. So probably not for me.

 

However if I "had to", yep I could do it so as a backup I might consider it. Besides the M lenses what are you considering carrying? If the Q goes down you'd have nothing wider than 35mm.

 

Gordon

[erlingmm]

Doing a wedding tomorrow with S007, M10 and TL2. Not so worried about the equipment, more curious about a muslim marrying a christian.

Edited August 25, 2017 by erlingmm

[fastfashn]

I'm shooting a wedding this weekend with a T (11-23), Fuji X-Pro1 (35 1.4), and Fuji XE-1 (18 F2). I'll let you know how it goes. All ambient light, indoors and out (bright sun to incandescent and fluorescent). 

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[fastfashn]

Doing a wedding tomorrow with S007, M10 and TL2. Not so worried about the equipment, more curious about a muslim marrying a christian.

Well? How went?