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Firmware 1.6 incoming

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Guest VVJ

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16 MP isn't enough for you? When did you last produce a wall mural?

 

Could you please not put words in my mouth that I never said...?

 

It is not about what I personally want or not, it is about what the competition offers in comparison to Leica.

 

And releasing a new T with again 16MP when Fuji and Sony have gone to 24MP (and are likely to be cheaper) would IMO be commercial suicide.  

Edited by JorisV

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Could you please not put words in my mouth that I never said...?

 

It is not about what I personally want or not, it is about what the competition offers in comparison to Leica.

 

And releasing a new T with again 16MP when Fuji and Sony have gone to 24MP (and are likely to be cheaper) would IMO be commercial suicide.  

 

 

I've recently acquired a 12.2MP Sony A7S which will knock spots off any Leica ICL camera as regards high ISO low light performance … and many Leica X1 users prefer its 12.2MP image files to those of the X2's 16 MP. High pixel count sensors are not necessarily the 'best' for digital imaging - in fact they can be a liability - especially if users fail to support/hold their cameras properly.   If Leica ever decided to offer a proper low light camera to rival e.g. the Sony A7S II it would likely have a relatively low pixel count. 

 

dunk 

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I've recently acquired a 12.2MP Sony A7S which will knock spots off any Leica ICL camera as regards high ISO low light performance … and many Leica X1 users prefer its 12.2MP image files to those of the X2's 16 MP. High pixel count sensors are not necessarily the 'best' for digital imaging - in fact they can be a liability - especially if users fail to support/hold their cameras properly.   If Leica ever decided to offer a proper low light camera to rival e.g. the Sony A7S II it would likely have a relatively low pixel count. 

 

dunk

 

+ 1

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What I really need in a new firmware is to bring the the right dial to life. I am only using non-Leica and manual lenses. In my case, the right dial is completely dead!... It would be nice and frankly helpful if I could use the right dial to change ISO, or anything else that would help my shooting.

 

I don't have any idea if this is a firmware issue, or mechanical that could only be changed from inside the camera!... But it would really be nice if Leica take that under serious consideration.

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I was downtown Milan today and had opportunity to visit a Leica Store. Asked about the new firmware for the T (I would like the possibility to disable to exposure simulation to use with studio flashes) but the do not know yet anything about it. They told me next week the TL should be in the shop and it could be possible to know how it is implemented. 

 

Meantime they have special offer on the T...

 

robert

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What I really need in a new firmware is to bring the the right dial to life. I am only using non-Leica and manual lenses. In my case, the right dial is completely dead!... It would be nice and frankly helpful if I could use the right dial to change ISO, or anything else that would help my shooting.

 

I don't have any idea if this is a firmware issue, or mechanical that could only be changed from inside the camera!... But it would really be nice if Leica take that under serious consideration.

I have the same wish and i am certain it can be fixed in firmware. Why that did not happen already i do not understand.

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I have the same wish and i am certain it can be fixed in firmware. Why that did not happen already i do not understand.

 

As it seems you have the same setup as mine; there is another thing that could help us enormously. I would love to see that little window in the middle of the frame ( can be movable) that indicates where the exposure is! ... I don't know the exact term for that, but without that, it is always very hard to find the right exposure.

 

I wish those Leica "Big Shots" were checking this site from time to time to see what we are wishing for!

Edited by Louis

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Guest VVJ

I've recently acquired a 12.2MP Sony A7S which will knock spots off any Leica ICL camera as regards high ISO low light performance … and many Leica X1 users prefer its 12.2MP image files to those of the X2's 16 MP. High pixel count sensors are not necessarily the 'best' for digital imaging - in fact they can be a liability - especially if users fail to support/hold their cameras properly.   If Leica ever decided to offer a proper low light camera to rival e.g. the Sony A7S II it would likely have a relatively low pixel count. 

 

dunk 

 

As you point out not raising the number of MP can be a well thought out design decision. The identical number of MP on the TL however appears to me to be more the result of Leica putting the T on hold for 3 years and focusing on R&D for the  SL, Q and M10 instead.  The new TL is basically the camera that should have been in the box 2.5 years ago and that in the meanwhile was also made available through firmware upgrades.  My guess would be that we will not see a TL2 before the SL is upgraded (as to not impact SL sales) and I would say an upgrade of the SL is at least two years away, so I would expect a TL2 2.5 to 3 years from now.  By that time with the current specs I am afraid the TL will be on life support.  This is obviously just my 2 cents.  I don’t claim to be right, I appreciate that other people have a different opinion/view on this and I actually hope I am completely wrong with regards to the street date of the TL2...

 

With regards to  better high ISO support I am not expecting A7s performance.  I had the A7s as well and compared to my Fuji cameras at the time it did 3 stops better, ie. ISO 12,800 to 51,200 was still very decent.  I quite honestly would already be glad if the high ISO performance of the T was on par with the first generation Fuji X cameras which it currently isn’t and which leads to me not using the camera so much because quite frankly the SL and the Q (which I also own) have much better high ISO performance.  I was looking for an upgrade putting the T on par with those 2 cameras  and Leica simply did not deliver that, nor did they deliver any under the hood improvements that would make the camera more responsive...  Right now the main value proposition of the T (again for me personally and taking into account the other cameras that I own) is the ability to use a long zoom lens.  The SL offers that ability as well but 90-280 is a huge lens and probably not something I would want to travel with. 

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Nobody really knows what's going on with TL plans but given that the original T launch predated the SL it's reasonable to assume the TL2 will predate the SL2 … but maybe there's an excess load of polished slow selling T bodies requiring some ooomph to shift before any TL2 is announced … hence the titanium finish makeover to make them more appealing? 

 

dunk

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Nobody really knows what's going on with TL plans but given that the original T launch predated the SL it's reasonable to assume the TL2 will predate the SL2 … but maybe there's an excess load of polished slow selling T bodies requiring some ooomph to shift before any TL2 is announced … hence the titanium finish makeover to make them more appealing? 

 

dunk

 

As I had posted in one of the other threads: I am told that the newly announced "TL" was really not intended to be the launch of a revised camera, but was rather due to a lawsuit over a copyright issue concerning the use of the name "T" .  Hence, the renaming of the system to "TL".

 

Usual Leica product line revisions are in the 3+ year range, so expect more dramatic improvement of the TL down the line.

 

(This from my local Leica store).

 

Rob

Edited by ropo54

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Guest VVJ

I googled this briefly but was unable to find anything.  Shouldn't there be public records of this then?

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Kyocera is the only camera manufacturer which registered 'T' model cameras i.e. the Contax T and Yashica T series - but whether the trade mark /brand name is still registered after the demise of Contax / Yashica is another matter. 

 

dunk

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It's about trade marks rather than copyright. Hence, if you're the first to use a single letter as a label for - say - a photographic camera, then you can legally prevent others from using the same letter for their cameras.

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This is all interesting, T or TL and trade marks points. But back to firmware 1.6has anyone idea when we'll be able to know if there will be any practical difference with the actual firmware, like the possibility to disable the exposure simulation in order to use the camera with studio flashes?

robert

PS: I asked the question in a Leica Shop a few days ago and they didn't know it.

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Today - in a German Leica Store - they don't know about a release date. But I saw the TL and checked the firmware: It's 2.1. So that's the proof, that there will be different versions for the T and the TL in the future. Maybe the TL is more different (inside) than we thought?

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Guest VVJ

Interesting!  Normally an increase in major version number would imply a major update which does not appear to be the case...

 

From RedDot: "The only notable differences are the expanded internal memory of 32GB, up from 16GB, along with faster AF performance and the ability to use image stabilization on OIS-equipped SL lenses."

 

I should have the opportunity to visit a Leica boutique next week.  I will try to find out more as well.

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Guest VVJ

I visited the Leica boutique in Las Vegas this week.

 

They hadn't received the new Leica TL yet, so I didn't ask the 2.1 version number question I had in mind

 

They did mention the lawsuit/copyright issue...

 

It seems to be the story that Leica is feeding their stores but without giving any details or specifics to the stores...

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