roelandinho Posted June 22, 2016 Share #61 Posted June 22, 2016 Advertisement (gone after registration) I don't recall photos from them with the combination of such resolution, without hypersharpness, and the presentation of textures. Of course, you might have just shown us an example. You're correct, it's not a Canikon image. If I told you it was shot with a digital Leica rangefinder camera and a Leica M-lens, would you be able to guess which combination? :-) Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 22, 2016 Posted June 22, 2016 Hi roelandinho, Take a look here Does the Leica lens look appear most at a certain focal length?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
CharlesL Posted June 22, 2016 Author Share #62 Posted June 22, 2016 ...it's not a Canikon image. If I told you it was shot with a digital Leica rangefinder camera and a Leica M-lens, would you be able to guess which combination? :-) The camera is not a Monochrom. All I can guess is that the lens is modern, that is, from the time when Leica uses computers to work out the consequences of alternative design decisions. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roelandinho Posted June 22, 2016 Share #63 Posted June 22, 2016 The camera is not a Monochrom. All I can guess is that the lens is modern, that is, from the time when Leica uses computers to work out the consequences of alternative design decisions. It's an M8 with a 35 Summilux Asph (pre-FLE). Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 22, 2016 Share #64 Posted June 22, 2016 The only image I ever took that was accused of having the Leica Look by a photographer that I respect greatly: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Challenge: camera and lens.... 7 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Challenge: camera and lens.... ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/261674-does-the-leica-lens-look-appear-most-at-a-certain-focal-length/?do=findComment&comment=3066441'>More sharing options...
CharlesL Posted June 22, 2016 Author Share #65 Posted June 22, 2016 It's an M8 with a 35 Summilux Asph (pre-FLE). With a good filter to cut the infamous infrared of the M8, or are there hints of it in her skin and the floor planks? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted June 22, 2016 Share #66 Posted June 22, 2016 Let us look at all the images our enthusiasts who have made self-portraits in a mirror with a Leica. Is there a self evincing Leica look? I think not. . Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlesL Posted June 23, 2016 Author Share #67 Posted June 23, 2016 Advertisement (gone after registration) Excerpts from a fascinating essay: Historical Perspective On Minolta Lens Design Philosophyby David Kilpatrick, 2007...Leica, for whom Minolta made lenses, elements, prisms and focusing screens had never attempted to match colour or contrast and you will find radical differences between (for example) a six-element and seven-element Summicron. What they attempted to do was balance microcontrast and overall contrast (boosting MTF figure finer than 60 cycles at the expense of the important 10-30 cycles range). They also taught this concept to Minolta. It tends to produce a 'liquid, three- dimensional' look because overall tones are quite soft, but textures and surfaces are rendered far better.Zeiss went in a different direction and picked a cutoff point for MTF, using equipment able to measure up to 400 cycles per mm (beyond the resolving power of any film, and theoretically unusable). They would decide that a particular range of lenses should maintain 60 per cent contrast at 80 cycles - or whatever - and then work like hell on the glass, the design, the coatings to achieve this target and never fail. They also tested each individual lens (in Germany) and retained a certificate against its serial number stating the actual figure for that one lens. Then, if returned for repair, they could instantly spot whether elements had become decentered. I do not believe the Kyocera-Zeiss team ever did this!...the [Zeiss T*] coating was so effective they often got high microcontrast plus high overall contrast, when Leitz was claiming the two functions were traded against each other....Since the mid-1990s all you have is the heritage of these policies. ... Leica started trying to copy Zeiss;...https://sites.google.com/site/seevve/historical-perspective-on-minolta-lens-design-philosophy 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roelandinho Posted June 23, 2016 Share #68 Posted June 23, 2016 With a good filter to cut the infamous infrared of the M8, or are there hints of it in her skin and the floor planks? I didn't use the UV/IR filter for this one, but it's not really noticeable here I think. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 23, 2016 Share #69 Posted June 23, 2016 Well, the skin tones would have been better... Well spotted by Charles. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted June 23, 2016 Share #70 Posted June 23, 2016 What might be termed interesting is that here it is 35mm images have been chosen to illustrate a 'look' and that the pre-aspheric Summilux has distinct characteristics whilst the pre-FLE aspheric is also 'rated' for its 'bokeh'. The later FLE lens is not. Which would tend to suggest that post 67 is on the right lines in that some older Leica lenses have very specific 'looks' (which vary and of which only a select few have distinct characteristics) but new Leica lenses are far more sophisticated and much more 'precise' designs with a very different design philosophy (aided by much more advanced computerised design). Which leaves us where we were - knowing that older 'characterful' lenses were not as well designed as current lenses are. FWIW my favourite combination is my M9 and 35 pre-aspheric Summilux. This offers a small, neat, compact and highly ergonomic package whilst delivering images which I am more than satisfied with. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roelandinho Posted June 23, 2016 Share #71 Posted June 23, 2016 The only image I ever took that was accused of having the Leica Look by a photographer that I respect greatly: mozamb321.jpg Challenge: camera and lens.... I like this one, Jaap! My totally uneducated guess: M9 with 50 Summilux Asph! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 23, 2016 Share #72 Posted June 23, 2016 Spot-on. And M9. And IR filter 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roelandinho Posted June 23, 2016 Share #73 Posted June 23, 2016 Spot-on. And M9. And IR filter I've been using this combination for most of my photography for a while so I'm quite familiar with the look :-) Do you feel there is a need for an IR filter on the M9? I still have one, but haven't used it since my M8's shutter broke. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 23, 2016 Share #74 Posted June 23, 2016 Excerpts from a fascinating essay: Historical Perspective On Minolta Lens Design Philosophy by David Kilpatrick, 2007 ... Leica, for whom Minolta made lenses, elements, prisms and focusing screens had never attempted to match colour or contrast and you will find radical differences between (for example) a six-element and seven-element Summicron. What they attempted to do was balance microcontrast and overall contrast (boosting MTF figure finer than 60 cycles at the expense of the important 10-30 cycles range). They also taught this concept to Minolta. It tends to produce a 'liquid, three- dimensional' look because overall tones are quite soft, but textures and surfaces are rendered far better. Zeiss went in a different direction and picked a cutoff point for MTF, using equipment able to measure up to 400 cycles per mm (beyond the resolving power of any film, and theoretically unusable). They would decide that a particular range of lenses should maintain 60 per cent contrast at 80 cycles - or whatever - and then work like hell on the glass, the design, the coatings to achieve this target and never fail. They also tested each individual lens (in Germany) and retained a certificate against its serial number stating the actual figure for that one lens. Then, if returned for repair, they could instantly spot whether elements had become decentered. I do not believe the Kyocera-Zeiss team ever did this! ... the [Zeiss T*] coating was so effective they often got high microcontrast plus high overall contrast, when Leitz was claiming the two functions were traded against each other. ... Since the mid-1990s all you have is the heritage of these policies. ... Leica started trying to copy Zeiss;... https://sites.google.com/site/seevve/historical-perspective-on-minolta-lens-design-philosophy Interestingly, Zeiss lenses tend to have individually shimmed lens elements, which makes them more vulnerable to decentering on mechanical impact, and as Will van Manen told me a nightmare to repair if the furthest element shifts (as my ZM 21 did) Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 23, 2016 Share #75 Posted June 23, 2016 I've been using this combination for most of my photography for a while so I'm quite familiar with the look :-) Do you feel there is a need for an IR filter on the M9? I still have one, but haven't used it since my M8's shutter broke. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk I photograph quite a bit in Africa in the hot season. Without it I get virtually irrepairable yellow-orange casts on dry landscape shots with the sun overhead and blue blotches on African skin. Caucasian skin will show magenta and yellow-orange blotches. With the M240 the same. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roelandinho Posted June 23, 2016 Share #76 Posted June 23, 2016 I photograph quite a bit in Africa in the hot season. Without it I get virtually irrepairable yellow-orange casts on dry landscape shots with the sun overhead and blue blotches on African skin. Caucasian skin will show magenta and yellow-orange blotches. With the M240 the same. Is this only in Africa or could this also happen in Europe? :-) Maybe I will try adding the filter for a while and check if I can see a difference. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LocalHero1953 Posted June 23, 2016 Share #77 Posted June 23, 2016 I've had this problem with the M9 and particular types of hot lighting, most notably in a shot of my daughter and son-in-law in a Parisian cafe, which gave them both intense magenta lipstick. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mp58 Posted June 23, 2016 Share #78 Posted June 23, 2016 When I saw your photograph, Jaapv, my first thought was also M9 and 50 summilux asph. I love that combination. Beautiful photograph, btw. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 23, 2016 Share #79 Posted June 23, 2016 Is this only in Africa or could this also happen in Europe? :-) Maybe I will try adding the filter for a while and check if I can see a difference. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Yes, anywhere where light has a substantial IR content. Flash can be quite bad too. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fursan Posted June 23, 2016 Share #80 Posted June 23, 2016 (edited) pico, roel, otto, jaap, paul.. Thank you all for the images and your inputs. I am better informed because of the images/explanations. Kind regards to all. Edited June 23, 2016 by fursan 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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