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Are we beta testers?


IkarusJohn

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Most of us have a great deal of affection for Leica and really want them to be successful and would enjoy contributing to that success. I know about the risks involved in treating customers a little more like partners but I also know that it can pay off, and I'd like Leica to take a few risks of this sort.

 

 

Sorry, but not really.

Why should I like a company ? Affection is for people or pets.

Maybe I like to use some of its products. I have to like to "fondle" the tools I use, to like the lenses. If I find them "ugly" or "repellent" then I cannot concentrate on the fotos.

But do I know Leica or the people behind it ? So why should I like them ? Did I ever like Nikon  - what a weird idea. Or Kodak and the people producing Kodachrome films ? They were crucial for the quality of generations of fotos, but did I ever feel affection ?

 

I want them to be successful, because I invested in this system. Their failure means also my loss.

No tender feelings.

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Sorry, but not really.

Why should I like a company ? Affection is for people or pets.

Maybe I like to use some of its products. I have to like to "fondle" the tools I use, to like the lenses. If I find them "ugly" or "repellent" then I cannot concentrate on the fotos.

But do I know Leica or the people behind it ? So why should I like them ? Did I ever like Nikon  - what a weird idea. Or Kodak and the people producing Kodachrome films ? They were crucial for the quality of generations of fotos, but did I ever feel affection ?

 

I want them to be successful, because I invested in this system. Their failure means also my loss.

No tender feelings.

 

 

 

That's why I said "Most" and not "all".

 

Perhaps I ought to have said "many".  Or just "some".

 

But what is a weird idea to you is evidently not strange to everyone. Too often we think of our own ideas as being representative. There's plenty of evidence in this forum to demonstrate that many people feel quite a connection with Leica, and I don't think "affection" is too strong a word.

Edited by Peter H
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But what is a weird idea to you is evidently not strange to everyone. Too often we think of our own ideas as being representative. There's plenty of evidence in this forum to demonstrate that many people feel quite a connection with Leica, and I don't think "affection" is too strong a word.

 

I don't think one will find too many other forums with threads titled  "I love my (insert Leica camera name)".  Many examples here.  So, if not for the company, there's lots of affection for the products.

 

Jeff

Edited by Jeff S
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I am sure Sony, as only one example, would also like to know what to expect from Leica just as Leica would like to know what Sony and Fuji and everybody else are planning

 

Based on sales volumes and competitive technologies, I don't think Sony even knows Leica exists.

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I don't think anything manufactured which uses electronics in the final product will ever be either 100% perfect or devoid of needing some form of updates.. Even baby buggies have had recalls.. Yes I do love my Leica's, maybe because like others who have plonked down enough cash equivalent to the purchase a new vehicle our physique tells us that this must be love! Maybe not Beta but we are all testers in one way or another.. Leica may well rely heavily on us as opposed to a long R&D gestation period, in return we get outstanding images and gasps as we proudly announce we paid $xxxxxxK for this little box with a piece of glass at the front!! '(^_^)'

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Because mutual endeavour often results in values and behaviour not reflective of any singular endeavour by an individual, but through common effort.

 

 

It's not nice, but finally I have to add this.

After 2009 who would like Leica ? Insiders will know what I mean. Only people completely unaware of the R disaster can continue so blue-eyed.

Stephan

Edited by steppenw0lf
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I guess that rather proves my point - it is only a company, so who could hate it?

 

I was never an R camera user, and I bought into Leica with the M9.  To use your logic against you, it was individuals who made the decision to abandon all those faithful R users, with collections of fabulous R glass.  You can't blame the company ...

 

Or, you can; in which case, you can also give credit where it is due.

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It's not nice, but finally I have to add this.

After 2009 who would like Leica ? Insiders will know what I mean. Only people completely unaware of the R disaster can continue so blue-eyed.

Stephan

 

Please it was 1971, real insiders will know what I mean ;)  :D !

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I guess that rather proves my point - it is only a company, so who could hate it?

 

I was never an R camera user, and I bought into Leica with the M9.  To use your logic against you, it was individuals who made the decision to abandon all those faithful R users, with collections of fabulous R glass.  You can't blame the company ...

 

Or, you can; in which case, you can also give credit where it is due.

 

 

What makes you so clever that you need to use somebodys logic against him ?

Accept that it is ridiculous to feel affection to a company, or do not accept it.

Or at least accept that others find it ridiculous. And because it is related to feelings, it has nothing to do with logic. It needs no turning something against someone.

 

These are discussions, not wars !! Remember the world is full of wars. So be more careful with your exaggerations.

Edited by steppenw0lf
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But surely, applying logic to both sides is the point!

 

Don't take this either seriously, or personally - it isn't worth the effort!

 

People buy into the culture of companies.  That is what marketing and branding is all about.  It's also what stops companies from producing products or providing services which do not meet quality control or other standards.  It's why Apple turned the corner when Jobs came back - providing fewer products with a consistent finish, design and clear placement in the market.

 

I'm not trying to be clever, or poke fun at you (far from it); but for the same reason that some may understandably be angry or disappointed with Leica (as opposed to the individuals who made the decision) many like Leica as a company for what it stands for, complete with history going back to Herr Leitz saving jewish people when he had the chance.

 

I'm not sure what exaggerations I've made - if you visit some of the other forums (I don't), there is plenty of hate for Leica (or maybe it's just trolling, I never stuck around to find out).

Edited by IkarusJohn
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I like this thread because remind me my experience with the M9. When I took it in my hand for the first time I was blessed as John Belushi in the Blues Brother (I see the light!!) and I have passed wonderful 5 years despite the problems faced. It look to me at the end as I was married to a top model but sometimes I recognise that the top model can be an ass...le sometimes :-).  The shutter was too noisy and the sensor issue at the end kill my love  for the M9 and we divorce. The old M2 is still my partner.

 

I think many Leica's owner are really in love with photography (and the level of shot post in this forum proof it) and they do a lot of sacrifice to afford so expensive camera, so I did expect something really good. John mentioned Apple, and did it right. For the costs of its computer the quality must be perfect because I pay for it and not for the apple logo. And when my Mac Book Pro crash due to motherboard failure (caused by a low quality construction ) I did expect nothing less of free of charge fix (as it was) and in short time (as it was again). Ad this is the only reason I accept to pay more .

 

About being beta tester, I am not sure about this (last Leica M9 issue appear 4/5 year after the camera was released to the market) but for example the SL looks a fine camera but for sure nothing more than other product already on the shelf and I honestly I do not understand such camera even having worked with it for weeks.

 

So in conclusion I love Leica M camera (I say only M) but to be honest I will be more carefully when I will buy my next M.

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