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Leica 28mm Summicron ASPH 2016 #11672-- Owners Thread


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I am pretty disappointed, as this is the first lens in 20 years of photography that is poor enough to warrant a replacement.

Most likely it doesn't warrant a replacement but an adjustment. At least that's what's wrong with mine—it shows poor sharpness at the frame's center at medium and long distances due to severe back-focusing. When I push the focussing ring a tad or two towards a closer distance then the image will become significantly sharper. Extremely sharp indeed. Definitely sharper than the (very good) older Summicron-M 28 mm Asph #11604.

 

 

I have not yet looked at field curvature

I think the field curvature is positive (i. e. concave, as seen from the photographer's viewpoint) so the sharpness at the frame's borders is closer than at the center. In contrast, the older #11604's field curvature used to be negative (convex). I guess a positive field curvature feels more 'natural' and is easier to deal with in most (not all) cases, so that's another advantage for the new Summicron-M 28 mm Asph #11672.

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Quickly looking at my tests with the copy I briefly had last year and it had positive/concave field curvature while the original 28 Cron had the opposite. This behaviour was also evident in some images supplied to me by another photographer.

 

As for which is better, it will depend on the application and of course is subjective. For my purposes, I didn't like it because it meant for my typical landscape type images the edges were less sharp than the center of the frame, even stopped down a ways. With the old Cron, by f/5.6 everything was great across the frame. On the flip side, concave curvature would provide greater background blur at the edges of the frame when focused on something at close distance in the center. My impression is more often than not, RF wides seem to have convex field curvature whereby distant objects at the frame edge are relatively sharp even though the central subject content is considerably nearer to the camera.

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  • 1 month later...

Nordic sun?

 

Living in the nordics, this reply has some real humour in it considering the dredfull weather we’ve had this summer :-)

 

On a more serious note, haven’t seen much discussion arouns this 28/2 2016-model used with the M10.

 

I trust it works brilliantly, but would be nice to hear some user experiences never the less. So, M10 shooters speak up please.

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If you click on the image you will see this picture taken with the M240 and the new SC28 wide open. Then move to the left in my flickr stream and you will see aperture 2.8, 4, 5.6 and 8. You will see a slight gain in sharpness from aperture 2 to aperture 2.8 and stopping down the light fall-of towards the corners disappears, But that's it. No softness in the middle:

 

 

 

 

 

Your results reflect the experiences I've had with the new Summicron 28.

 

I am amazed by the sharpness across the frame, even wide open, at all distances.

 

I have yet to detect focus shift or field curvature. There is certainly no field curvature at shorter distances (0.7 to 5 meters), and my infinity shots at f2 also do not suggest field curvature, but I might have to take a closer, more critical look.

 

As a side not: My Summicron 28 easily outperforms the new 28 Elmarit as well as the 28 Summilux. I think the new 28 Elmarit is problematic on a M (better on the SL). At f2.8 and f4 it is outperformed by both, the Summicron and the Summilux 28. The Summilux 28 look is awesome wide open, but if you look for even sharpness across the whole frame right into the corners, it must be stopped down to approx. f3.4 to match the performance of the Summicron 28 at f2.

 

I am happy that I bought the Summicon 28 before reading this thread. I can only assume there is quite some sample variation. Very unfortunate.

(As another side note: I have yet to find a good copy of the highly praised 21 SEM...)

Edited by anickpick
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I am happy that I bought the Summicon 28 before reading this thread. I can only assume there is quite some sample variation. Very unfortunate.

(As another side note: I have yet to find a good copy of the highly praised 21 SEM...)

 

In my case, both copies received from my dealer had very early production dates, prior to official release, IIRC, even though I purchased about 9 months later. I don't know if there were early production hiccups and two copies is a rather small sample size. If I was to buy it again, I would want to be able to thoroughly test with the ability to return.

 

All I can say is I know what I saw with the copy that RF focused correctly: fairly strong field curvature with edge sharpness that did not match the center of the frame. It was outclassed for across frame sharpness by the current Voigtlander 35/1.7 and bettered by my copy of the first version 28 Cron.

 

That's disappointing to read about the 21 SEM. I guess I was lucky getting a good one. :) A lovely lens.

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In my case, both copies received from my dealer had very early production dates, prior to official release, IIRC, even though I purchased about 9 months later. I don't know if there were early production hiccups and two copies is a rather small sample size. If I was to buy it again, I would want to be able to thoroughly test with the ability to return.

 

All I can say is I know what I saw with the copy that RF focused correctly: fairly strong field curvature with edge sharpness that did not match the center of the frame. It was outclassed for across frame sharpness by the current Voigtlander 35/1.7 and bettered by my copy of the first version 28 Cron.

 

That's disappointing to read about the 21 SEM. I guess I was lucky getting a good one. :) A lovely lens.

 

 

I took a look at the pictures you provided. Many thanks for the link to your work!

I agree that your lens performed rather poorly in the outer third of the frame. 

That is definitely not what I see from my copy.

 

I sold my 21 SEM and am now quite happy with the WATE. I would still be tempted by a up to specs SEM 21 though...

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  • 4 months later...

When I click on the link it says 'access denied – private'.

 

Really sorry for this. Leica published some of my work on 'Leica Blog', all the images are with 28mm Summicron ASPH 11672 and M262...here are the links.

 

http://blog.leica-camera.com/2016/10/23/16-images-beautiful-himalayan-landscapes/

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  • 5 months later...

I recently bought a new 28 Summicron ASPH, took it home and did a series of comparison tests with my previous version 28 Sumicron ASPH at various apertures, various subjects, close to long distance, M10 (with Visoflex) and SL, tripod mounted. 

 

The overall 'rendering' of the two lenses was virtually identical.  

The corners were clearly better on my old lens :-O

 

I explained this to the dealer and returned the new lens.

They didn'tt have any other new 28s for me to test.  

I returned it still very happy with my old Summicron with I'll be keeping.

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Hi Mark, I think you did right, if you have the old one, you should keep, no need to upgrade. 

In my city, old cron 28 asph is very rare and the price of used piece is so high, That why I bought the new one as well.

As your test, how do you think about vignetting of the new cron 28?

I recently bought a new 28 Summicron ASPH, took it home and did a series of comparison tests with my previous version 28 Sumicron ASPH at various apertures, various subjects, close to long distance, M10 (with Visoflex) and SL, tripod mounted. 

 

The overall 'rendering' of the two lenses was virtually identical.  

The corners were clearly better on my old lens :-O

 

I explained this to the dealer and returned the new lens.

They didn'tt have any other new 28s for me to test.  

I returned it still very happy with my old Summicron with I'll be keeping.

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  • 5 months later...

I previously owned the first version of the 28 Summicron and mine kept coming apart at the front barrel as others have mentioned. It took several trips and several months back and forth to Leica to get it right. I ultimately parted ways with that lens as it got to a point where I couldn't trust it and that frustrated me. I was eager to try the updated version when it was announced as it was very much a lens and focal length I was interested in, but the cards didn't align until this year. 

I was able to get an open-box one from a dealer and I noticed the production date is from late 2015 which as far as I can tell is before the actual release so that tells me this one is very early as well. I have noticed now after thoroughly testing the lens that it does consistently back focus on my M10 at all apertures (though it is considerably less noticeable on film) and I've reached out to Leica to see if they can adjust it for me. I think that once it is spot on, like my 50mm Summilux then the pair will be my mainstays for many years. I can definitely say the build quality issues I had with the earlier version have for sure been addressed. 

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I own the current Summicron 28mm ASPH as I am a Leica owner now for a year. It is razor sharp with great micro-contrast in a very small package - a fantastic lens.

Regards,
Bud James

Please check out my fine art and travel photography at www.budjames.photography or on Instagram at www.instagram.com/budjamesphoto.

 

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  • 2 years later...

I am seeing quite strong field curvature on my 28mm Summicron-M Asph II (#11672) when stopped down to f/4 and f/5.6. When properly focused at infinity, the image is super sharp in the center, but in the outermost part of each side the image is blurred; not just less sharp. Subjects in the corners and borders of the sides that are (much) closer will be sharp though. In other words, obvious signs of field curvature. It isn't visible @ f/2, but stopped down midway, it is very visible. I don't see this mentioned much apart from Ron Scheffler in this thread and a very few others. When reading the quote below, I wonder if I should send my lens back to Leica for adjustment to see if the severe field curvature can be fixed.

Did anyone here send in their 28mm Summicron-M Asph #11672 and then the issue was fixed?

"I am currently using the 2nd version 28mm Summicron. The lens is excellent, but only if it is well adjusted. My first copy suffered immense field curvature, while the second had a flat plane but back-focussed. But after a pass through Wetzlar, the lens is amazing with excellent sharpness (on digital) even in the extreme corners. There is virtually no colour fringing, the out-of-focus areas are really smooth, and the ergonomics are excellent."

The above quote is found here in post #28: https://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=168174

(The person in the quoted forum may be the same as the one here with username "Mark II". At least both are called Mark and are situated in Barcelona.)

 

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6 hours ago, LarsHP said:

I am seeing quite strong field curvature on my 28mm Summicron-M Asph II (#11672) when stopped down to f/4 and f/5.6. When properly focused at infinity, the image is super sharp in the center, but in the outermost part of each side the image is blurred; not just less sharp. Subjects in the corners and borders of the sides that are (much) closer will be sharp though. In other words, obvious signs of field curvature. It isn't visible @ f/2, but stopped down midway, it is very visible. I don't see this mentioned much apart from Ron Scheffler in this thread and a very few others. When reading the quote below, I wonder if I should send my lens back to Leica for adjustment to see if the severe field curvature can be fixed.

Did anyone here send in their 28mm Summicron-M Asph #11672 and then the issue was fixed?

"I am currently using the 2nd version 28mm Summicron. The lens is excellent, but only if it is well adjusted. My first copy suffered immense field curvature, while the second had a flat plane but back-focussed. But after a pass through Wetzlar, the lens is amazing with excellent sharpness (on digital) even in the extreme corners. There is virtually no colour fringing, the out-of-focus areas are really smooth, and the ergonomics are excellent."

The above quote is found here in post #28: https://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=168174

(The person in the quoted forum may be the same as the one here with username "Mark II". At least both are called Mark and are situated in Barcelona.)

 

So I finally upgraded to a v2 in 2020 because the third one I tried was the first to finally outperform than my old v1.  If it's new then return it, if you've had it for a while then send it in for a service. Is it still under warranty?

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1 hour ago, MarkP said:

So I finally upgraded to a v2 in 2020 because the third one I tried was the first to finally outperform than my old v1.  If it's new then return it, if you've had it for a while then send it in for a service. Is it still under warranty?

I bought it used from a shop and already have sent it to Leica in Germany (for another reason) once. I think or at least hope that there is a warranty on their service since it was originally sent in for optical adjustment/correction. 

The odd thing is that at f/2 the field curvature is virtually invisible. Stopped down to f/4 it looks bad. Stopped down to f/8 and very carefully focused it's acceptable. This means focusing at f/4 or f/5.6 in the center with live view and then pushing the focus point as far away as possible while still retaining sharpness and then finally stopping down to f/8 and taking the picture. If I just focus perfectly in the center at f/4 and then take a picture, the borders will be blurred... I am of course talking about landscapes/cityscapes with focus at infinity. 

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8 hours ago, LarsHP said:

I bought it used from a shop and already have sent it to Leica in Germany (for another reason) once. I think or at least hope that there is a warranty on their service since it was originally sent in for optical adjustment/correction. 

The odd thing is that at f/2 the field curvature is virtually invisible. Stopped down to f/4 it looks bad. Stopped down to f/8 and very carefully focused it's acceptable. This means focusing at f/4 or f/5.6 in the center with live view and then pushing the focus point as far away as possible while still retaining sharpness and then finally stopping down to f/8 and taking the picture. If I just focus perfectly in the center at f/4 and then take a picture, the borders will be blurred... I am of course talking about landscapes/cityscapes with focus at infinity. 

Just my 2c:

1. I own v1 and not v2.

2. Summicron 28 is IMHO not optimised for landscape work. Elmarit ASPH outperforms it in this rescpect. There are few forum users that claim how good is Summicron  28 also for landscape work but majority use it as all-around (family events) lens. Both posted proves (photos). Maybe there is sample variation - in non Leica terms - quality control issue.

3. Comparing to 21 Color Skopar, Summicron is really not sharp at infinity in corners. It is mushy and infinity rendering is not to my liking (although still sharp). On the other Summicron shines for indoor and outdoor family shots.

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