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the idiocy of 33 available shutter speed dial positions for M


Go Figure

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Hello Pebbles,

 

Your observation just above in Post #16 is interesting because the reason DIN numbers are a 3 number increase being equal to a 1 F stop increase (ISO100/21DIN - ISO200/24DIN - ISO400/27DIN).

 

Is:

 

Using standard B&W negative development techniques: 1/3 of a stop of difference in exposure is the least amount of exposure difference that can be seen as different in a B&W negative when it is being looked at by most people.

 

Best Regards,

 

Michael

I find that difficult to believe. Maybe for an experienced photographer but not for most of us.

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I dunno, I don't print my Polaroid's, do you?

 

You mean that you don't use Polaroids i guess. I did but don't use them anymore personally but i just wanted to stress that some photographers don't want or don't like playing with PCs, the same way as others (or the same) are not keen to waste their time in darkrooms. I used to make part of the second category in the past so i understand and respect those photographers. YMMV.

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I find that difficult to believe. Maybe for an experienced photographer but not for most of us.

Which part do you find difficult to believe?

 

A change of the DIN value by +/- three corresponds to a factor of 2 or exactly one f-stop. That's not subject to experience. It's the way the DIN scale is defined.

 

Any old photographic text says the same: a difference in exposure of one third of an f-stop is just about perceptible to the unaided human eye. This is not subject to belief. It is easily tested by taking several shots of the very same scene, each differing by a measured amount from the "correct" one.

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Not always reliable, but this is quite good in Wikipedia:

 

 

DIN

The DIN system, officially DIN standard 4512 by Deutsches Institut für Normung (but still named Deutscher Normenausschuß (DNA) at this time), was published in January 1934. It grew out of drafts for a standardized method of sensitometry put forward by Deutscher Normenausschuß für Phototechnik[8] as proposed by the committee for sensitometry of the Deutsche Gesellschaft für photographische Forschung[9] since 1930[10][11] and presented by Robert Luther (de)[11][12] (1868–1945) and Emanuel Goldberg[12] (1881–1970) at the influential VIII. International Congress of Photography (German: Internationaler Kongreß für wissenschaftliche und angewandte Photographie) held in Dresden from August 3 to 8, 1931.[8][13]

The DIN system was inspired by Scheiner's system,[1] but the sensitivities were represented as the base 10 logarithm of the sensitivity multiplied by 10, similar to decibels. Thus an increase of 20° (and not 19° as in Scheiner's system) represented a hundredfold increase in sensitivity, and a difference of 3° was much closer to the base 10 logarithm of 2 (0.30103…):[7]

    \log_{10}{(2)} = 0.30103... \approx 3/10

As in the Scheiner system, speeds were expressed in 'degrees'. Originally the sensitivity was written as a fraction with 'tenths' (for example "18/10° DIN"),[14] where the resultant value 1.8 represented the relative base 10 logarithm of the speed. 'Tenths' were later abandoned with DIN 4512:1957-11, and the example above would be written as "18° DIN".[5] The degree symbol was finally dropped with DIN 4512:1961-10. This revision also saw significant changes in the definition of film speeds in order to accommodate then-recent changes in the American ASA PH2.5-1960 standard, so that film speeds of black-and-white negative film effectively would become doubled, that is, a film previously marked as "18° DIN" would now be labeled as "21 DIN" without emulsion changes.

Originally only meant for black-and-white negative film, the system was later extended and regrouped into nine parts, including DIN 4512-1:1971-04 for black-and-white negative film, DIN 4512-4:1977-06 for color reversal film and DIN 4512-5:1977-10 for color negative film.

On an international level the German DIN 4512 system has been effectively superseded in the 1980s by ISO 6:1974,[15] ISO 2240:1982,[16] and ISO 5800:1979[17] where the same sensitivity is written in linear and logarithmic form as "ISO 100/21°" (now again with degree symbol). These ISO standards were subsequently adopted by DIN as well. Finally, the latest DIN 4512 revisions were replaced by corresponding ISO standards, DIN 4512-1:1993-05 by DIN ISO 6:1996-02 in September 2000, DIN 4512-4:1985-08 by DIN ISO 2240:1998-06 and DIN 4512-5:1990-11 by DIN ISO 5800:1998-06 both in July 2002.
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  • 2 weeks later...

of course ... 1/3 stops ... 1/2 stops are all visible and when the RZ came out we were besides ourselves to be able to set 1/2 speeds on a camera.

I still kept my Pentax 67s because I fixed all of that in the lab ( those were the 80 rolls a day, 300 days a year, E6 days ).

 

But if you were a pre digital Leica M photographer you would at least know where I come from and what the intricacies of the speed wheel are/were.

It is something that I call: camera intelligence or camera genius.

The late addition of the ratchet speed wheel just dumbs it down to Fuji/Panasonic levels.

If you don't believe me go out and shoot a night scene or a theater event - once you can't read your shutter dial anymore and your built in meter

starts giving you wrong readings, you will know what I am talking about.

 

 

_________________________________________________________________________________________

"In the land of the blind ... photography is not needed anymore."

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  • 4 weeks later...

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