enboe Posted January 24, 2016 Share #1 Posted January 24, 2016 Advertisement (gone after registration) An observation - many of the recent, meaning within the past 20 years, special edition and limited production Leicas are starting to come down in price. Example 1: I saw and had the opportunity to buy the M7/50 Titanium kit for under $10K. That's less than the new price. I had just purchased a new car, so I did not want to dip further into the savings, but that's a great price. By the way, there were two on the market at that price this month. Example 2: I see an M60/35 kit for under $10K, which is around half the price new. Again, very tempting. Example 3: I saw the M-P240/35 Safari kit selling for around $8K last December. Now, I have not seen much movement in the Noctilux 1.2, my quest lens, but I am eternally hopeful. Discussions? Comments? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 24, 2016 Posted January 24, 2016 Hi enboe, Take a look here Special cameras coming down in price - the temptation. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
ECohen Posted January 24, 2016 Share #2 Posted January 24, 2016 I don't really know because I don't "collect" camera equipment. The Special Editions have always seemed like a hobby for rich guys. Leica made the highest quality manual cameras so a Special Edition was cool and had a long life span. However now that film is almost gone, why would you collect this technology? And for that matter doesn't the same hold true for digital, even more so. Five years from now the M240-P will be old electronics and old tech. Why would you want one mint in box? But then I buy cameras to use....Rich guys are rich for a reason, maybe their grand children will have something cool to sell on EBay like vintage toys mint in box or an unopened copy of the British pressing in Mono of Beatles White Album. ( why buy it if you cant play it?) I'm also not into designer clothes....just a poor photographer who enjoys a well made camera. To me it's worth 3 times the price to use Leica over Nikon.........you can keep the Hermes case and strap. Perhaps the hip crowd need an accessory for the moment and Leica is smart to capitalize on that and make some extra cash? I too am curious what this crowd has to say............ any SE collectors in the forum? Value pricing....now thats something I can get behind;-) -- Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted January 24, 2016 Share #3 Posted January 24, 2016 Gone? Gone where? However now that film is almost gone, why would you collect this technology? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted January 24, 2016 Share #4 Posted January 24, 2016 An observation - many of the recent, meaning within the past 20 years, special edition and limited production Leicas are starting to come down in price. Example 1: I saw and had the opportunity to buy the M7/50 Titanium kit for under $10K. That's less than the new price. I had just purchased a new car, so I did not want to dip further into the savings, but that's a great price. By the way, there were two on the market at that price this month. Example 2: I see an M60/35 kit for under $10K, which is around half the price new. Again, very tempting. Example 3: I saw the M-P240/35 Safari kit selling for around $8K last December. Now, I have not seen much movement in the Noctilux 1.2, my quest lens, but I am eternally hopeful. Discussions? Comments? Presumably you're thinking they've dropped so much in price, buy now and then see them rise in value again? The flip side is that they might just drop further. Valuation discussions aren't permitted on this forum but FWIW I think I'd do something more sensible with my money. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECohen Posted January 24, 2016 Share #5 Posted January 24, 2016 Gone? Gone where? OK you are correct. I didn't mean it literally...and I certainly didn't mean to offend. This group has many many film users.....but as technology goes, film is turning into an antique process. Which brings me to a couple questions for you......rhetorical if you like. What percent of photographers are shooting film, compared to even 10 years ago? and What percentage of Leica sales are film cameras ? Look at how many great film cameras have little to no value. Thats what I meant by my post. I shouldn't have to defend the fact that we are in a digital age. But I do understand why you want me to......seriously don't take offense...please. I am in no way saying that film isn't any longer valid. Just that camera technology has changed and in the digital age, is changing with each new leap in technology. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECohen Posted January 24, 2016 Share #6 Posted January 24, 2016 "Valuation discussions aren't permitted on this forum but FWIW I think I'd do something more sensible with my money. " Can we talk about who the SE market is and if they are an important cash cow to Leica? I've always felt they were silly......but I'm not always right;-) Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kilmister Posted January 24, 2016 Share #7 Posted January 24, 2016 Advertisement (gone after registration) I've done with film, although I fully recognise that analogue film still beats digital pixels for resolution. A TV programme broadcast this evening in the UK had a chap using a plate camera. The results were beautiful. All the same I don't want to mess with developer and hypo in a dark room ever again. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schrödinger's cat Posted January 24, 2016 Share #8 Posted January 24, 2016 Gone? Gone where? Saw a tag line on some fellow in the Nikon forum: Film isn't dead, it just smells funny. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrozenInTime Posted January 24, 2016 Share #9 Posted January 24, 2016 The world is swamped with glossy digital photographs - photography has lost it's craft nature and become commoditized. Special editions ( precious metal and paint variations ) likely no longer impress the associates of those who used to buy them. The only special editions I bought were the 0-series replicas: I enjoy their historically quirky features and do actually use them ( so resale value is unimportant ) Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted January 24, 2016 Share #10 Posted January 24, 2016 Look at how many great film cameras have little to no value. I don't see any. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECohen Posted January 24, 2016 Share #11 Posted January 24, 2016 I don't see any. Heres one a Nikon FTN 50 bucks and no takers .....its a fine camera with no value http://www.ebay.com/itm/NIKON-FTN-35mm-SLR-FILM-CAMERA-BODY-ONLY-/371534934112?hash=item5681353060:g:v3sAAOSwoydWnFKz Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted January 25, 2016 Share #12 Posted January 25, 2016 Heres one a Nikon FTN 50 bucks and no takers .....its a fine camera with no value http://www.ebay.com/itm/NIKON-FTN-35mm-SLR-FILM-CAMERA-BODY-ONLY-/371534934112?hash=item5681353060:g:v3sAAOSwoydWnFKz That is definitely not a desirable camera. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
platypus Posted January 25, 2016 Share #13 Posted January 25, 2016 Film isn't dead, it just smells funny. No, that's the dead mouse under the darkroom fridge. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECohen Posted January 25, 2016 Share #14 Posted January 25, 2016 That is definitely not a desirable camera. Upon further searching ....I humbly stand corrected. All I meant was that film cameras are old technology and that we live in a digital world. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted January 25, 2016 Share #15 Posted January 25, 2016 Upon further searching ....I humbly stand corrected. All I meant was that film cameras are old technology and that we live in a digital world. We are okay. Other than the M9 and a Lumix G1 which I use only for 'bay, all I have and use is old technology. Some of it is over 130 years old and it still produces spectacular results. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
darylgo Posted January 25, 2016 Share #16 Posted January 25, 2016 I would like to collect an M9 Titanium or Hermes. Leicas are beautiful cameras, variations on a theme are also and I understand they fund Leica to continue our collective (or non-collective) habit. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECohen Posted January 25, 2016 Share #17 Posted January 25, 2016 We are okay. Other than the M9 and a Lumix G1 which I use only for 'bay, all I have and use is old technology. Some of it is over 130 years old and it still produces spectacular results. I too love film, although I shoot 95% digital now .I still teach traditional photography and darkroom techniques to a few students. I do think that film is quickly becoming an antique process and as old guys like me die off ( I still have a loo way to go) there will be fewer and fewer photographers shooting film. As new technology keeps progressing... sensors, printers, software and the cameras internal processing technology there will be little need for film except as an alternative process. Even as I write these words to this most esteemed forum, I think back to the turn of this century and cant believe I'm saying these words....It was not how I felt 15 or 20 years ago. Sorry for going way off topic....I'm glad we're OK Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted January 25, 2016 Share #18 Posted January 25, 2016 (edited) I have two associates who are well published photo-documentary professionals who have used film their whole career, fifty years or more for each. One uses 6x17cm full-time, always color. (His earlier works were 6x9cm). The other is 6x6cm, black & white, sometimes color. It is not necessary to critique their work to mention that their use of film was a deciding factor among their publishers. I cannot point to their publishers' deciding factor, but I do recall one time when approaching a reluctant publisher, one of them managed to get a brief appointment in which he laid out pages of MF color slides in acetate sleeves and the brief interview became two hours and ended with a contract. They were impressed by the medium. Of course, neither are wealthy, but they are darned comfortable and the 6x17cm fellow in particular seems to have no problems finding grants and gifts to travel and photograph. Regarding students, at least at the under graduate level at my university, I was blown aside by how very poor the college students regarded traditional printing (B&W). It all sucked. Really sucked. After a while I heard often enough their rationale: "Why should we spend more time in the darkroom than the digital people do on their computers?" Edited January 25, 2016 by pico Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECohen Posted January 25, 2016 Share #19 Posted January 25, 2016 I completely agree with everything you say and how very sad for the many things the newer generations value or don't value. Even so we do live in interesting times. "and the times they are a changin" ......... to quote Bob Dylan Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vern Dewit Posted January 26, 2016 Share #20 Posted January 26, 2016 I never understand the need to comment publicly on how others like to spend their hard earned money. So what if I both love to take photos and have a special edition camera because it looks good in my display case? I am not a wealthy individual but that doesn't mean I can't save and buy the Leica MP Safari kit and enjoy that purchase immensely. Which is why I did and I do. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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