First time developing Black & White Film at home: Fail.

[Michael Hiles]

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The wash concept is excellent - if the first round produces a 1% solution of fixer (seems perhaps high), the second will produce a 0.01% solution. The third round will produce 0.0001% solution etc. After 6-8 rounds, the amount of fixer remaining is negligible. But everyone know this.

 

And it is simple. What's not to like.

Edited January 11, 2016 by Michael Hiles

[Martin B]

It is a Paterson Universal tank and it holds up to 2 35mm film or one plan film. 

 

I am using the same developer tank and make sure that I put the film on the reel at the bottom and not on top position of the center column. Make sure to use 300 ml of each fluid during the process. I suspect your first film was not fully submerged.  

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[adan]

The wash concept is excellent - if the first round produces a 1% solution of fixer (seems perhaps high), the second will produce a 0.01% solution. The third round will produce 0.0001% solution etc. After 6-8 rounds, the amount of fixer remaining is negligible. But everyone know this.

 

And it is simple. What's not to like.

 

Well, it's not quite that simple. Hypo ions have a tendency to cling to gelatin and paper fibers, and are not perfectly water-soluble (ever tried to clean dried hypo crystals off bottles and trays and such?)

 

So just reducing the concentration of the bath to .00001% does not mean you have reduced the amount in the gelatin equally. Any more than taking a piece of chromed metal out of the chroming solution means the chrome will then wash off in water.

 

Wash aids, usually primarily Ammonium Sulfite, help pry loose hypo's grip, making it more soluble.

 

(Discovered during WW2, in shipboard Navy photo labs that used sea water for washing to conserve fresh water supplies. The hypo cleared faster in "salted" water than when using fresh water.)

 

Not to say Ilford's method doesn't work - but it takes a combination of rinses and time to do the job, not just dilution.

 

I use Heico Permawash, because it saves water and time, and also helps pry loose TMax's pink antihalation dye (my Permawash goes screaming pink within 15 seconds as the dye leaches out 10 times faster than in water alone).

[Martin B]

I use Heico Permawash, because it saves water and time, and also helps pry loose TMax's pink antihalation dye (my Permawash goes screaming pink within 15 seconds as the dye leaches out 10 times faster than in water alone).

 

Got a question here - I observed the same effect when using Kodak Hypo Wash for two minutes with film. It dissolves some of the pink dye in the film - is this a "wanted" thing or is it better to leave the pink dye? I read that yellow or red color blocks UV light which is also emitted by the condenser bulb in an enlarger. Is a film without or with less red dye easier overexposed in an enlarger when making prints?

Edited February 2, 2016 by Martin B

[adan]

The dye is NOT supposed to remain in the film, and IS supposed to be removed. Once the shutter is triggered, it has served its purpose. It gives no benefit when printing, and might cause problems.

 

B&W film should be dead neutral gray when finished - TMax should be even less gray, almost clear: http://static.photo.net/attachments/bboard/00P/00P4O3-42751684.jpg

 

If it remains, and is perfectly even, it won't be a huge deal. A tiny increase in density and thus required print exposure.

 

The pink color will result in slightly higher contrast if using variable-contrast (e.g. Ilford Multigrade) papers (which use pinkish filters to increase contrast anyway). https://img1.etsystatic.com/019/0/8863923/il_570xN.579662613_ppg0.jpg

 

The real problem is that the dye washes out unevenly, so it may produce "blotches" in the print. Get rid of it all!

[Martin B]

The dye is NOT supposed to remain in the film, and IS supposed to be removed. Once the shutter is triggered, it has served its purpose. It gives no benefit when printing, and might cause problems.

 

B&W film should be dead neutral gray when finished - TMax should be even less gray, almost clear: http://static.photo.net/attachments/bboard/00P/00P4O3-42751684.jpg

 

If it remains, and is perfectly even, it won't be a huge deal. A tiny increase in density and thus required print exposure.

 

The pink color will result in slightly higher contrast if using variable-contrast (e.g. Ilford Multigrade) papers (which use pinkish filters to increase contrast anyway). https://img1.etsystatic.com/019/0/8863923/il_570xN.579662613_ppg0.jpg

 

The real problem is that the dye washes out unevenly, so it may produce "blotches" in the print. Get rid of it all!

 

Thanks so much, this is very helpful advice! I saw that still some dye must have remained on my previously developed TMax 400 film - invisible to the eye, but when I photographed my negatives and then opened the RAW file in PS, I saw a slight reddish color tint (removed by conversion in B&W). The reddish tint did not come from the LED light panel which I used to illuminate the negatives to photograph them - I did the same development procedure on Tri-X film, and didn't see any reddish color tint in my photographed negatives. I suspect a little bit red leftover from the dye doesn't harm either. It was fully evenly distributed on the film.

[Martin B]

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The dye is NOT supposed to remain in the film, and IS supposed to be removed. Once the shutter is triggered, it has served its purpose. It gives no benefit when printing, and might cause problems.

 

B&W film should be dead neutral gray when finished - TMax should be even less gray, almost clear: http://static.photo.net/attachments/bboard/00P/00P4O3-42751684.jpg

 

If it remains, and is perfectly even, it won't be a huge deal. A tiny increase in density and thus required print exposure.

 

The pink color will result in slightly higher contrast if using variable-contrast (e.g. Ilford Multigrade) papers (which use pinkish filters to increase contrast anyway). https://img1.etsystatic.com/019/0/8863923/il_570xN.579662613_ppg0.jpg

 

The real problem is that the dye washes out unevenly, so it may produce "blotches" in the print. Get rid of it all!

 

As addition to my earlier reply, I was able to remove the red dye of a recently developed TMax 400 film completely as you said by keeping it 2 minutes longer in the fixer and one minute longer in the Hypo Wash (the latter removed the dye most efficiently by seeing its purple-red color when emptying it from the tank). 

[250swb]

 

Not to say Ilford's method doesn't work - but it takes a combination of rinses and time to do the job, not just dilution.

 

 

The time element is accommodated in the number of inversions you give the tank, with each change of water the number of inversions is doubled.

 

As for the red dye, or purple, or green, depending on the film, a pre-soak takes care of that.

 

 

Steve

Edited February 8, 2016 by 250swb