IkarusJohn Posted November 9, 2015 Share #41 Posted November 9, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) You need to go to the greengrocer before you make such statements, Rick. He's got apples! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted November 9, 2015 Posted November 9, 2015 Hi IkarusJohn, Take a look here Who are the target customers for the SL?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
stevelap Posted November 9, 2015 Share #42 Posted November 9, 2015 (edited) Oh, one other thing... I don't need a camera strap that looks like it is designed to steady a target rifle in order to carry my M around Venice. I bet I can carry my M in one hand and a cappuccino in the other. Rick Oh dear Rick, Cappuccino........ To paraphrase Captain Rum in Black Adder. " 'tis a woman's drink milord" Edited November 9, 2015 by stevelap 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted November 9, 2015 Share #43 Posted November 9, 2015 Oh, one other thing... I don't need a camera strap that looks like it is designed to steady a target rifle in order to carry my M around Venice. I bet I can carry my M in one hand and a cappuccino in the other. Rick 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott kirkpatrick Posted November 9, 2015 Share #44 Posted November 9, 2015 Oh dear Rick, Cappuccino........ To paraphrase Captain Rum in Black Adder. " 'tis a woman's drink milord" My understanding of Italian practice (for men) is that cappuccino is tolerated at the breakfast table with family. But subsequently, exceeding a liquid volume of 1 cc per shot of coffee is unthinkable. scott 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonoslack Posted November 9, 2015 Share #45 Posted November 9, 2015 (edited) Jono, Great shots as always. I've been to Venice and have to say that none of those excellent shots could not have been taken with the M, as well. Except, the M would allow for more isolation with its cadre of excellent f1.4 lenses. Yes, they can be shot on the SL, but not optimally on the SL. The M would have been lighter and maybe faster, certainly more enjoyable, for me. I guess, right now, the SL is optically less than the current M system. Considering the only Sl lens, the SL zoom, is inferior to the many M primes. I suppose the sensors are about the same. The SL looks like a fantastic but, crippled camera at the moment without any real system lenses that can compare to the M lenses. I'll wait and watch from the sidelines for now. Rick Hi Rick Actually there are quite a number of shots I would certainly have missed with an M (the lovers on the bridge - the guy with the dog - various others). Largely because they were fleeting and I would most likely have had the wrong lens on the camera (I don't wander around with a 90mm lens much) - and some of them are at shutter speeds which couldn't have been managed without IS . . . added to which I'm not sure there is a great deal of sacrifice of quality with the SL zoom - but of course you're right about the aperture. So you might argue that I'd have got better images with the M, but I don't think it's true that I would have got all of those images . . . . Edited November 9, 2015 by jonoslack 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted November 9, 2015 Share #46 Posted November 9, 2015 Oh dear Rick, Cappuccino........ To paraphrase Captain Rum in Black Adder. " 'tis a woman's drink milord" Hi Steve, too funny! Around our house we start with a cappuccino. Certainly no lattes, though. When in Italy it is a morning shot and an afternoon cappuccino. http://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/138641-how-do-you-brew-it/?hl=espresso&do=findComment&comment=1525699 Rick 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted November 9, 2015 Share #47 Posted November 9, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hi Rick Actually there are quite a number of shots I would certainly have missed with an M (the lovers on the bridge - the guy with the dog - various others). Largely because they were fleeting and I would most likely have had the wrong lens on the camera (I don't wander around with a 90mm lens much) - and some of them are at shutter speeds which couldn't have been managed without IS . . . added to which I'm not sure there is a great deal of sacrifice of quality with the SL zoom - but of course you're right about the aperture. So you might argue that I'd have got better images with the M, but I don't think it's true that I would have got all of those images . . . . Jono, I understand that each camera has its strengths. Pete Souza http://www.petesouza.com owns Leica M's but, he shoots the White House with a DSLR and a zoom. I'm sure he could do it all with an M, but it would be a lot harder and I'm sure he too would miss a lot of shots. The SL is certainly going to be a great camera and system. I just have to rationalize my camera. I don't shoot the White House kind of stuff. But, I do like to shoot Venice kind of stuff. So, my rationalization is to look at your great shots and for me... I'd rather do that Venice stuff with an M. And, I can rationalize that the M may produce image wise , for me, a better result. But, I do miss my Canon 5DII and L 24-70 /2.8. Nothing like zooming to the right framing and AF... bam! But, I don't miss the weight and such for walking around with Venice with that cappuccino. Nice camera, though, Rick Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted November 9, 2015 Share #48 Posted November 9, 2015 Regarding Pete Souza I was wrong. Here is a quote from him from an interview I found interesting: DPP: What equipment were you working with that day? Souza: Two camera bodies and four lenses: a 24mm, 35mm, 50mm and 135mm. That's what I carry most of the time. I think these fixed lenses are sharper than the zooms, and if I need to, I can use a 1.4 aperture in a dark room. The 35mm is probably the lens I use the most. It's one of the sharpest lenses I've ever used. Sometimes, for a big public event, I'll bring a 70-200mm, which is actually a sharp lens, as well. http://www.digitalphotopro.com/profiles/pete-souza-master-of-the-white-house Rick 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
viramati Posted November 9, 2015 Share #49 Posted November 9, 2015 (edited) Well I went to Red Dot in London today to see this beast in the flesh and it is a 'Beast' very heavy with the 24-90 on and not small. IMO in no way is this camera aimed at the dedicated M user but at those who would maybe looking at an equivalent alternative to Canon or Nikon and while it has some features that I really liked (the joystick for moving focus point and fantastic EVF) I can't really see any 'Pro's switching as yet with only 1 native lens. So I can only really see it being bought by the wealthy and serious amateur who wants the Leica quality and maybe does some paid photographic work on the side. Edited November 9, 2015 by viramati Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicaiste Posted November 9, 2015 Share #50 Posted November 9, 2015 Well I went to Red Dot in London today to see this beast in the flesh and it is a 'Beast' very heavy with the 24-90 on and not small. IMO in no way is this camera aimed at the dedicated M user but at those who would maybe looking at an equivalent alternative to Canon or Nikon and while it has some features that I really liked (the joystick for moving focus point and fantastic EVF) I can't really see any 'Pro's switching as yet with only 1 native lens. So I can only really see it being bought by the wealthy and serious amateur who wants the Leica quality and maybe does some paid photographic work on the side. Did you tried the SL with an M lens ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted November 9, 2015 Share #51 Posted November 9, 2015 (edited) If you mount the strap on the camera properly, I don't think that there's any way that the "poppers" (press studs) could twist around and scratch the monitor. I showed it to my mate and she said, "Oh, snaps! How sweet and campy! A biker's fist strap? Can we get snap-on jingle bells for it? Edited November 9, 2015 by pico Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
viramati Posted November 9, 2015 Share #52 Posted November 9, 2015 Did you tried the SL with an M lens ? No only with 24-90. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicaiste Posted November 9, 2015 Share #53 Posted November 9, 2015 No only with 24-90. If you have again the opportunity to try the SL, you should try it with an M lens. I was very pleased with the handling. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lx1713 Posted November 9, 2015 Share #54 Posted November 9, 2015 I might be a possible candidate for an SL if it handles intuitively and delivers very good to excellent images at all the focal lengths 24 to 90mm Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecaton Posted November 9, 2015 Share #55 Posted November 9, 2015 Had I not just ordered a brand new S-E (006) & 70 Summarit at a price I could not refuse I would be a target customer. My m-lenses do not feel at home on a Sony and the M9 starts to get a little long in the tooth. The SL looks as it could be a GAS healer for any additional/versatile system next to a Leica. Man have I burned money for mft, Fuji X, Sony e-mount stuff to complement my M8 and later the M9 over the last number of years. Bought, tried, sold all that stuff eventually. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
viramati Posted November 9, 2015 Share #56 Posted November 9, 2015 (edited) If you have again the opportunity to try the SL, you should try it with an M lens. I was very pleased with the handling. I'm sure it will but then I would prefer to use the M with M lenses as that is their natural platform. Edited November 9, 2015 by viramati Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicaiste Posted November 9, 2015 Share #57 Posted November 9, 2015 I'm sure it will but then I would prefer to use the M with M lenses as that is their natural platform. It may be there original platform, but is the M really the best platform for the wide angle lenses, the Noctiluxes and 75/1,4, 90/2 or 135 ? Maybe the day the optional EVF will be upgraded on a future M. For the time being, IMO the M is the natural platform of the 35 and 50mm f2 and f1,4. It is ok with the 28's and 75/2. And a bit cumbersome with the other lenses. I never even thought about buying the 50/0,95, 21/1,4 or 24/1,4 for the M. But now that they have a natural platform, the SL. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramarren Posted November 9, 2015 Share #58 Posted November 9, 2015 If you have again the opportunity to try the SL, you should try it with an M lens. I was very pleased with the handling. Likewise, I fitted my Elmarit-R 24 and Summicron-R 90 lenses to it when I went to see it. It handled beautifully with both. It is definitely set up to balance and handle well with larger, heavier lenses. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted November 9, 2015 Share #59 Posted November 9, 2015 So fast and tele M lenses weren't really designed to be used with the M camera after all? Amazing how we learn new stuff here all the time - usually after some new product launch….. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
viramati Posted November 9, 2015 Share #60 Posted November 9, 2015 Well it will be interesting to see how it performs with wides such as the WATE etc and I am sure that the my apo-telyt 135 will also perform well on the SL but then it also performs fantastically on the A7II and A7rII with added benefit of IBIS. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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