No Autofocus with M Lenses

[bernie.lcf]

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Well, to be fair: during the weeks ahead of the SL introduction, there were rumours that the camera would focus anything including manual lenses.

This is not new. This has been done before:

 

Zeiss has sold an SLR camera that could do this: the Contax AX was able to move the film to focus a manual lens. There were limitations, but overall the system was quite usable and surprisingly fast (well, back then there wasn't much else, there was no Internet and I didn't own every other camera to compare. But compared to my Minolta SLRs, the Contax was good)

 

In the digital age, you would move the sensor. Since Olympus is able to move the sensor with enough precision to generate a high resolution picture via 8 separate images, I can see no reason why you could not move the sensor backwards and forwards for precise focusing.

(maybe it doesn't to the Noctilux with enough precision, but if it could handle the Summilux I'd be happy)

[jmahto]

There is no autofocus function when using M lenses.  I have just tried out the camera.  Focus is quick and accurate. Focus peaking better. But no autofocus.

 

Is it worth the price and  the weight?  

 

I am waiting (and getting tired) for firmware update to M240 which can make my lenses auto focus. Not sure whether I am alone....

 

(resisted hard in adding smiley and succeeded)

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[thighslapper]

I am waiting (and getting tired) for firmware update to M240 which can make my lenses auto focus. Not sure whether I am alone....

 

(resisted hard in adding smiley and succeeded)

 

Apparently they are still struggling with the M9 update which they cannot get to work ...... and have shelved the M240 firmware revision till they get it going properly on the M9 and MM.

 

Sorry to disappoint you ....... but rest assured, Leica have got their best boffins on this one (two old men in a shed back at Solms)

[satijntje]

I am waiting (and getting tired) for firmware update to M240 which can make my lenses auto focus. Not sure whether I am alone....

 

(resisted hard in adding smiley and succeeded)

 

 

Not AF but zoom lens!

I knew it was coming soon :-)

Enjoy!

John

Edited October 23, 2015 by satijntje

[aella]

According to this review by Sean Reid :

https://luminous-landscape.com/some-thoughts-on-the-leica-sl/

 

He said Leica SL includes lens menus (manual for R lenses, automatic and manual for M lenses).

 

I just can't stop thinking about what it really means...

Edited October 23, 2015 by aella

[bernie.lcf]

He said Leica SL includes lens menus (manual for R lenses, automatic and manual for M lenses).

 

I just can't stop thinking about what it really means...

 

Well, that's something different.

 

Leica has introduced a 6-Bit encoding on the lens bayonet of M lenses with the first digital M body, the M8. The 6-Bit code tells the camera about the lens. The purpose is for the camera to be able to apply some corrections: mainly color shift (in the M8 due to the UV/IR filter) and corners.

 

The M adapter for SL (which really is the T adapter) will read the 6-Bit code of an M-lens and pass on the information to the camera. The adapter has electronics built in. This is called "automatic".

If the lens does not have a 6-Bit code (because it is old or not by Leica), the camera will allow you to set the lens model in the camera menu (similar to the M9 and M-240 models). This is called "manual".

 

In case of R lenses. the ROM information (as found in newer R lenses and originally used by R8 and R9 bodies) is not processed. Instead, the current R to M adapter is 6-Bit encoded (with a single code painted on the bayonet). When mounted on an M-240 body, this code will tell the camera that an R lens is attached. The camera will then allow you to select the lens model in the camera menu. Again, this is called "manual". There is no "automatic" for R lenses (although theoretically it would be possible via the ROM, but not too many lenses actually have a ROM)

 

Seans comments basically tell us that the upcoming R adapter will communicate with the camera just as the current M adapter does. This distinguishes the expensive Leica adapters form the cheap e-Bay adapters made in China and the not so cheap adapters from Novoflex. Third party adapters are dumb - the camera gets no information whatsoever.*

 

I am afraid that this does not imply autofocus. This is for lens recognition.

 

 

 

*) yes, ok... the latest Novoflex R to M adapters is 6-Bit encoded because Novoflex actually licensed it...

[bernie.lcf]

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Not AF but zoom lens!

 

 

<smartass> ahem, the Tri-Elmar technically is a zoom, but Leica made 3 distinct "click stops" and some mechanical voodoo to show the proper frame and lens EXIF in an M body </smartass>

 

:-)

[mjh]

Well, to be fair: during the weeks ahead of the SL introduction, there were rumours that the camera would focus anything including manual lenses.

Yes, and I have tried to shoot down these rumours every time they came up. Maybe I wasn’t fast enough.

 

This is not new. This has been done before

We all know about the Contax AX. It won’t come back from the grave.

[jmahto]

just like zooming with feet, one can focus M with feet as well.

 

<unnecessary-explanation-thatis-needed>it's Friday and I am only on my 2nd JD. More creative ideas coming soon. </unnecessary-explanation-thatis-needed>

Edited October 23, 2015 by jmahto

[bernie.lcf]

We all know about the Contax AX. It won’t come back from the grave.

 

I only brought it up twice on this forum and I never said it should be done again...

[rramesh]

Autofocus has always been an eye and forefinger action.

[FlashGordonPhotography]

Unbelievable! I am stunned and dismyed that the SL hasn't added AF to my M lenses. I paid a fortune for them and I thought they'd be future proof. I hope that Leica will consider a firmware upgrade for my lenses to activate the AF.

 

Or there will be phone calls.....

 

Gordon

[pop]

Also, my M lenses seem to deteriorate with time. If I take a portrait of the same model with the same lens, it somehow doesn't look as crisp as it used to.

[jmahto]

Also, my M lenses seem to deteriorate with time. If I take a portrait of the same model with the same lens, it somehow doesn't look as crisp as it used to.

I hope with SL and 28-90 it is not a problem.

[250swb]

 

So...Is there any reason why that mechanisms could not in principle be inverted and motorised?  

 

You can try this yourself without bothering the forum to come up with justifications. First feel how easy it is to turn the focus ring of your M lens. Then try to push the focus point outwards just by pushing on the edge of the rear element of the lens. So you found that impossible didn't you. Now consider how, if it was possible for a small electric motor to push it out, how does it pull it back in....? Sometimes I wonder if other people ever made a working model of anything or have any practical concept of the world around them? Is this a morons paradise?

 

Steve

Edited October 24, 2015 by 250swb

[pop]

Is this a morons paradise?

 

Steve

And you'd be the snake?

[LCL999]

I can imagine a smart M to SL adapter which moved the whole lens.

Edited October 25, 2015 by LCL999

[pico]

I can imagine a smart M to SL adapter which moved the whole lens.

 

Even if it were possible, wouldn't it compromise lenses with floating elements?

[kkonkkrete]

You can try this yourself without bothering the forum to come up with justifications. First feel how easy it is to turn the focus ring of your M lens. Then try to push the focus point outwards just by pushing on the edge of the rear element of the lens. So you found that impossible didn't you. Now consider how, if it was possible for a small electric motor to push it out, how does it pull it back in....? Sometimes I wonder if other people ever made a working model of anything or have any practical concept of the world around them? Is this a morons paradise?

 

Steve

 

I'm terribly sorry for wasting your time!  As it happens, I don't have an M of my own, so I couldn't try it out for myself, but I thank you for taking the time to respond.  It is now clear to me why such a mechanisms would not be possible.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[mjh]

Even if it were possible, wouldn't it compromise lenses with floating elements?

Indeed it would. One could use a clamp-on motor transmitting its torque via a rubber wheel to the focus ring, but then we would be well into Silly Gadget Land.