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who is going to buy the new Q ?


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Have given the Q much thought but then picked up my ergonomically superb DMR/21-35 in readiness for a trip tomorrow and thought," … unlikely the Q can whoop this for IQ within the DMR's ISO sweet range."  A friend has a Canon 5D Mk III and admits the DMR's IQ is far better … even when he uses my R lenses on his Canon. 

 

I'd like to own a Q - but could not justify buying. 

 

Best wishes

 

dunk

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I'm going to wait for the Lenny Kravitz Q version thats all artificially beat to hell

 

OK...just so you know, that was the funniest thing I read on the internet today  :p

 

I am conflicted on this camera. Don't get me wrong - I think it's a big win for Leica (integrated EVF, FF autofocus, fiendishly clever lens, Smartphone integration, etc.). If it had a tilting LCD and an interchangeable lens, I'd say "Finally a full-frame Fuji XT-1!". 

 

For me, less is more. That's one reason my film Leica (M7) would be the last camera sold if I ever had to liquidate all my gear. So I congratulate Leica for introducing a modern, full-frame, autofocus camera, but sadly, I will pass on this one.  For one, I shoot 80% of the time at 50mm.  I enjoy the challenge of one camera/one lens, but 28mm would not be my focal length of choice. 

 

Lovely camera, though. Artfully executed. I am not bothered by the price point and I think it will sell quite well. For those thinking about the entry point into the world of Leica though, consider a used M8, M9 or Monochrom and a lens from any era. 

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Have given the Q much thought but then picked up my ergonomically superb DMR/21-35 in readiness for a trip tomorrow and thought," … unlikely the Q can whoop this for IQ within the DMR's ISO sweet range."  A friend has a Canon 5D Mk III and admits the DMR's IQ is far better … even when he uses my R lenses on his Canon. 

 

I'd like to own a Q - but could not justify buying. 

 

Best wishes

 

dunk

The DMR/21-35 is a completely different animal than the Q.   And your friend either hasn't got a proper handle on post processing the 5D files, or he has a defective 5D, or he's looking in the outer areas of the image circle where the DMR crops away many lens aberrations the 5D records, or some combination therof.  Because I loved the DMR (and the idea of being able to fit a digital back to a film SLR) but it couldn't even "whoop" my 5D Mk1 above base ISO.  It (DMR) is indeed capable of some amazing IQ especially given it's ancient technology, and it's really sad it sold so poorly that Leica didn't think it was worth re-sourcing spares. 

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Welcome to the forum. I would say buy the 240 MP and 28. While the Q is certainly a great camera, you will have more options with the MP should you want additional lens down the road. You will essentially learn one camera system with the Monochrom and MP. The 50 APO is a great choice I might add.

+1

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I'd agree with bill on this one. I'd also add that the M246 and M240P share the same accessories and finally and most importantly it would be a crying shame not to be able to use the superb 50 APO for colour as well as monochrome.

 

Thank you both for the advice. I don't want to thread Jack or anything, but this represents a monumental output of funds and well, I need some advice from some Leica users. It's Done...well, as good as. I have to wait to place the order until Monday on the M 240 M-P...

My only fear is that with the Q coming and all the great reviews so far, if Leica follows their typical release pattern of the Ms, they'll announce a crazy nice new M that gets super high ISO usability late this or next year....and then I'll be bummed :(

:)

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There is always a new product coming. The trick is to be clear about what you want, and what you don't like. Does the M(240)-P fulfil that desire?  If yes, use it and be happy - it will work as well when the new camera is released. 

 

Otherwise, buy the M(249)-P and recognise that you will want the new camera when it is released, then trade it. 

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...... The A7r was difficult to focus manually especially with wide angles, and there was smearing too.   But maybe Sony has now fixed everything.  Even so, I could just never get comfortable with the menus and control wheel system on the Sony.

 

The A7r gives you some problems with wide-angle(!) M-lenses: Vignetting, some magenta or purple color cast along the edges, and some softness or detail-smearing in the corners. Partly solved were the problems by Adobe’s DNG Flat Field Plug-In or Cornerfix. Not all wide-angel lenses suffer from this, but many. But no problem was mentioned with manual focus.

 

No problems were reported using the A7s.

 

The new A7r II is a new game. I suppose the problems will be solved or at least minor, because of the new sensor technology: the gapless micro-lenses on the backside(!) illuminated sensor. This could mean, that the A7r II should work even with non-retrofocus lenses or mixed lenses, like most of the M-wide-angle lenses.

 

IMHO the alpha 7r II could be a very good choice, even though you will switch by time to original zeiss/sony lenses. They are more comfortable (e.g. vignetting and distortion already digital corrected). And don't think the Zeiss/Sony lenses are all inferior to the leica-lenses. This is not true.

 

Martin

Edited by saxo
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any rumors ?

 

 

Given the fact that Leica have lost and continue to lose many sales to the Sony A7 series,  a FF Leica mirrorless / rangefinderless ILC is inevitable … and the 'T' and the 'Q' pave the way. 

 

And whatever Leica have up their sleeve will also be the best Leica 'R' platform since the R9. 

 

dunk

Edited by dkCambridgeshire
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The A7r gives you some problems with wide-angle(!) M-lenses: Vignetting, some magenta or purple color cast along the edges, and some softness or detail-smearing in the corners. Partly solved were the problems by Adobe’s DNG Flat Field Plug-In or Cornerfix. Not all wide-angel lenses suffer from this, but many. But no problem was mentioned with manual focus.

 

No problems were reported using the A7s.

 

The new A7r II is a new game. I suppose the problems will be solved or at least minor, because of the new sensor technology: the gapless micro-lenses on the backside(!) illuminated sensor. This could mean, that the A7r II should work even with non-retrofocus lenses or mixed lenses, like most of the M-wide-angle lenses.

 

IMHO the alpha 7r II could be a very good choice, even though you will switch by time to original zeiss/sony lenses. They are more comfortable (e.g. vignetting and distortion already digital corrected). And don't think the Zeiss/Sony lenses are all inferior to the leica-lenses. This is not true.

 

Martin

Indeed the A7rII looks to be pretty amazing on paper and may well perform better with some of the leica wides. I have now sold my M and 28 summicron which will give me money left over for a possible purchase of the new Sony,

By the way 28 summicron performed really badly even on the A7s but the WATE and CV 21/1.8 performed well on the A7s and A7II.

Focussing MF wide lenses especially slow one anything over 35mm I find to be a real pain on the A7's

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That's an interesting choice, David.

 

Like you, I am very keen on the A7 series, and like you also see the problems. I never got on with the A7R mark 1 because of how bad it was with wide lenses and also that horrible shutter clunk. But I also found 38mp was nearly always too much for me. I am selling it, along with my Noctilux, to part fund the Q.

 

The Sony A7s on the other hand is a camera I really appreciate, I find much better with wide lenses, is beautifully silent and I can live happily with 12.2mp. The high iso, as you know, is wonderful, so I find it a good alternative to the Leica in some situations. I have nevertheless found it works much better with Sony or purpose made Zeiss lenses like the Zeiss 50mm Loxia which is lovely.

 

I am tempted too by the A7R Mark II, and I may or may not buy it when it comes out. It seems to me to be a quite different camera to the M type 240 though, given its much higher resolution. I think I would regard it more as a competitor to the Leica S range, or medium format film or digital. The size of the files will be enormous, which will certainly be great for some photography, and I expect it to out resolve the M easily, but for most of my purposes I expect it will be too big for me, and just eat memory.

 

I am much moire excited about the Q though. I don't agree with those who say they would prefer it if it had an interchangeable lens - the thing that attracts me to it is it is a one camera/ one lens tool that can be ideal for street photography and architecture, as well as some landscape - as I'm mostly a street/architectural photographer it suits me. It looks like it will easily outperform the M for high iso, but in most conditions the M suits me. If you are buying the Q (which I think I read you are) I completely understand your decision to sell the M and then maybe buy the A7R II, though expect you will use the Q much more knowing your style of photography which I appreciate. I expect to use the Q a lot, maybe more than the M, and often with the M. I expect I shall use the A7s a lot less as a result, perhaps only when really really high iso is necessary. For those reasons, although the A7R mark II might be, all things considered, the 'best' camera out of all of these, I expect I would not use it as much as such a fine camera deserves. But let's see. I would be very interested to see how you get on.

 

Nick

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Given the fact that Leica have lost and continue to lose many sales to the Sony A7 series,  a FF Leica mirrorless / rangefinderless ILC is inevitable …....

 

you nailed it.

 

an FF-EVIL is overdue, with functional adapters for M and R lenses

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any rumors ?

There is the lavidaleica rumor of a new M body with electronic EVF at the end of the year.

 

But nevertheless the Q seems to be a mature product. Just remove the fixed lens and replace it with an M mount and you're done. Leica would be foolish not to do it.

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... By the way 28 summicron performed really badly even on the A7s ....

Focussing MF wide lenses especially slow one anything over 35mm I find to be a real pain on the A7's

 Thanks for the information. I haven't got an A7s. What I've heard from friends, or read about 7s and Leica lenses was positive, especially with the lux 35. I've only heard of several problems with the A7®. Focussing of wide-lenses was no issue, you have different experience with wide-angel lenses using the alpha7?

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By the way, in terms of size and weight:

 

A7RII will be 625g body only, dimensions 127mm x 96mm x 60mm. But if you add the Sony FE 28mm lens (a relatively compact lens for the A7 series), it becomes:

843g and 127 x 96 x 125mm

 

The Q will be (with lens of course)

640g and 130mm x 80mm x 93mm

 

So it shall be much easier to take the Q around with you in a small bag, or as a second camera, than the A7R II

 

Of course, given the massive size of the A7RII's sensor, and the fact it is and interchangeable system, we would all expect it to be a bit heavier and bigger, and its still remarkably compact and light, but it is worth remembering that as soon as you put a dedicated lens on the a sony it starts to get a little bit DSLRish.

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There is the lavidaleica rumor of a new M body with electronic EVF at the end of the year.

 

But nevertheless the Q seems to be a mature product. Just remove the fixed lens and replace it with an M mount and you're done. Leica would be foolish not to do it.

Do that and you'll have an empty useless box!

 

The sensor and lens are one unit. It's not like an M inside. You need to think more in terms of an M body but with an EVF in place of the rangefinder.

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I will buy the Q very probably. When I tried it I immediately thought it was the best digital Leica...M! I hated m8 and M9 and not so convinced by the type 240. I use an S2 and an Alpa12 for larger formats while my only digital for little formats is still the Nikon v1. Now I can have a little horse in my setup

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