mjh Posted February 24, 2015 Share #21 Posted February 24, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) I wish them well, and I look forward to seeing the finished camera. There will never be a finished camera. It‘s vaporware. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted February 24, 2015 Posted February 24, 2015 Hi mjh, Take a look here Konost {merged}. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
db24fps Posted February 24, 2015 Share #22 Posted February 24, 2015 Out of interest, is there anything technically flawed behind the concept of making the rangefinder system itself entirely digital vs the classic implementation Leica cling to? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wda Posted February 24, 2015 Share #23 Posted February 24, 2015 Looks good. Maybe this company can make them out of plastic and get the cost down?. I believe quite remarkable 3D products can be made on a printer nowadays. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted February 24, 2015 Share #24 Posted February 24, 2015 Out of interest, is there anything technically flawed behind the concept of making the rangefinder system itself entirely digital vs the classic implementation Leica cling to? If you have a hatred of EVF's then yes, there is! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted February 24, 2015 Share #25 Posted February 24, 2015 There will never be a finished camera. It‘s vaporware. Why are you so certain? It's ambitious I grant you, but not impossible. Their biggest challenge will be funding. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattMaber Posted February 24, 2015 Share #26 Posted February 24, 2015 I expect the Leica lawyers to encourage them to change the design. and lols Leica “Updates” T | New Camera News Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted February 24, 2015 Share #27 Posted February 24, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) Why are you so certain? It's ambitious I grant you, but not impossible. Their biggest challenge will be funding. There is nothing of any substance right now, or if there is, they don‘t show it. There are two off-the-shelf evaluation boards, one for the sensor, another for the CPU, and apparently some software to tie the two together. And there is a dummy showcasing a proposed design, with a viewfinder at an awkwardly low position close to the lens. The real challenge would be in developing the suggested electronic rangefinder, but it doesn’t look like they had an idea how to make it happen. How would they measure the focus position of the lens, for one thing – at the required precision and without ever requiring re-calibration? There is no indication that they have solved any of the hard problems. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeTexas Posted February 24, 2015 Share #28 Posted February 24, 2015 My guess would be a picture-in-picture display. The large portion of the display would feed from a small lens and sensor, which is autofocused. Then the "rangefinder patch" in the center would feed from the large sensor and come into focus as you turned the lens. Theoretically you could move the focus patch to anywhere on the display. The question remains, is this any more effective than just having live-view with focus peaking over the entire display? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
db24fps Posted February 24, 2015 Share #29 Posted February 24, 2015 If you have a hatred of EVF's then yes, there is! Ah but that's not what they are proposing is it? The viewfinder is optical, but seemingly with some kind of digital overlay (?) with the focus adjustment itself seemingly happening entirely in the digital realm rather than relying on prisms and so forth. I'm curious to know whether that approach would be technically sound in comparison to what we already have in terms of accuracy. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
spydrxx Posted February 24, 2015 Share #30 Posted February 24, 2015 Having come from the Koncept Kars at the annual car show to the Koncept Konost Kamera, I think it may be a long time in Koming to fruition. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
zlatkob Posted February 24, 2015 Share #31 Posted February 24, 2015 Just buy a Leica and you are already happy as a clam. A Leica is priced far out of most photographers' budgets. Perhaps this would be a cheaper alternative. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
db24fps Posted February 24, 2015 Share #32 Posted February 24, 2015 A Leica is priced far out of most photographers' budgets. Perhaps this would be a cheaper alternative. I've been having this discussion with a friend and I don't think the cheaper price would actually render much value in the long term, and I'd also question just how much demand there is for such a product when, slowly but surely, improvements are being made with EVFs and hybrid EVFs that are making more accurate manual focusing a more pleasurable experience on non-rangefinder cameras. I like the idea of some competition existing, but let's assume this camera actually came out and was (relatively speaking) popular amongst enthusiasts. People like the idea of buying Leica glass and sticking it on a cheaper camera body... fine, but with greater demand comes higher prices, and Leica glass both new and used is hardly cheap, at which point one has to ask if someone is going to spend that much on lenses is there really much getting in the way of them just buying an M, particularly when you consider that with an M comes the 2yr warranty inclusive of 1yr's accidental cover, and global support via various dealers and Leica stores. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted February 24, 2015 Share #33 Posted February 24, 2015 My guess would be a picture-in-picture display. The large portion of the display would feed from a small lens and sensor, which is autofocused. Then the "rangefinder patch" in the center would feed from the large sensor and come into focus as you turned the lens. Actually the idea is to combine the optical viewfinder image with a rangefinder patch supplied by a secondary sensor on the other side of the lens (not the main sensor). It works like an optomechanical rangefinder, only with the patch created electronically (and shifted electronically rather than by a pivoting prism). Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted February 24, 2015 Share #34 Posted February 24, 2015 Ah but that's not what they are proposing is it? The viewfinder is optical, but seemingly with some kind of digital overlay (?) with the focus adjustment itself seemingly happening entirely in the digital realm rather than relying on prisms and so forth. I'm curious to know whether that approach would be technically sound in comparison to what we already have in terms of accuracy. Sorry, you said "entirely digital" which I took to mean just going full time EVF. The hybrid route is more interesting certainly. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
zlatkob Posted February 24, 2015 Share #35 Posted February 24, 2015 I've been having this discussion with a friend and I don't think the cheaper price would actually render much value in the long term, and I'd also question just how much demand there is for such a product when, slowly but surely, improvements are being made with EVFs and hybrid EVFs that are making more accurate manual focusing a more pleasurable experience on non-rangefinder cameras. I like the idea of some competition existing, but let's assume this camera actually came out and was (relatively speaking) popular amongst enthusiasts. People like the idea of buying Leica glass and sticking it on a cheaper camera body... fine, but with greater demand comes higher prices, and Leica glass both new and used is hardly cheap, at which point one has to ask if someone is going to spend that much on lenses is there really much getting in the way of them just buying an M, particularly when you consider that with an M comes the 2yr warranty inclusive of 1yr's accidental cover, and global support via various dealers and Leica stores. But there are so many cheaper lens alternatives for the M mount. It's not just Leica lenses at Leica prices. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
db24fps Posted February 24, 2015 Share #36 Posted February 24, 2015 Of course, but the Leica glass is typically top of the list when I often hear or read about people excited about the prospect of adapting non-rangefinder bodies to mount rf lenses. Zeiss and Voigtlander already make a number of great lenses that can been purchased off the shelf with the right mount to fit a number of different camera bodies. The M mount exclusivity of Leica glass only seems to make the lenses more desirable by comparison, and I suspect there are more people out there lusting for the lenses than a rangefinder camera itself. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pecole Posted February 24, 2015 Share #37 Posted February 24, 2015 I just discovered various Internet sites commenting-announcing-illustrating the Konost FF. This camera looks very similar to the Leica T, is said to be made of aluminium too, and to have a Leica M mount ! Photos published (see copies attached) display either Leica or Zeiss lenses. Has anyone information about the company and the camera? Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/241491-konost-merged/?do=findComment&comment=2770129'>More sharing options...
MattMaber Posted February 24, 2015 Share #38 Posted February 24, 2015 Iand I'd also question just how much demand there is for such a product when, slowly but surely, improvements are being made with EVFs and hybrid EVFs that are making more accurate manual focusing a more pleasurable experience on non-rangefinder cameras. Indeed, I'm not convinced the market is there for what they want to sell, people seem happy enough the RF styled X100 and X-Pro1 and even Fuji have seen demand is higher for DSLR style so introduced the XT1. By the time this is live (if it ever is) any demand will have been and gone years ago. And what is the point of the cheapest one over an X100 or similar? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted February 24, 2015 Share #39 Posted February 24, 2015 (edited) I think we need to realise that there are an enormous number of M and LTM mount compatible lenses (not to mention all those compatible via a lens mount adapter for Nikon etc. that are possible because of the lens to sensor distance) that are still begging for a simple, cheap, no frills body. These are lenses that people have in a drawer, wondering if they should sell them on eBay. Consider the alternative option of being able to afford a camera simply able to accommodate them all? There is no direct line at the moment without expense (Leica M240) or compromise (such as crop factor). If any of you guys can't see an opening in the market I really don't know in which direction you are looking. The essence of the conundrum of course is will the sensor be able to accommodate wider rangefinder lenses without the problems associated with the Sony A7 lineup, so potential comes with one very simple question that needs answering. Steve Edited February 24, 2015 by 250swb 5 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanG Posted February 24, 2015 Share #40 Posted February 24, 2015 (edited) I tend to agree that there likely will not be a finished camera for sale. I can't imagine how it could be really great and also be cost competitive at small volumes. And without a significant discount to a Leica, who would buy it? (It would have to be below $3000 just to compete with used M9s) I can't say if people who have a "drawer" full of lenses will buy it. (Assuming it works well with all or many M mount lenses.) But my understanding of the camera market is that manufacturers make most of their money from selling lenses, not camera bodies. And Konost is not planning to make lenses so they can't subsidize their camera by selling lenses. Whereas Sony can get people who own a variety of lenses to buy into the A7. And once they do, many will also buy Sony lenses for it. Edited February 24, 2015 by AlanG 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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