bgaugs Posted January 8, 2015 Share #1 Posted January 8, 2015 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) Hello, I recently had my M3 and 135 f/4 CLA'd by a factory trained specialist. I took it out shooting on a trip to Arizona and a lot of pictures have incorrect focus. I know my technique is correct, and I am focusing properly. I did notice sometimes that focusing on an object at infinity seemed like through the rangefinder it became in focus before the lens focus ring hit infinity. What I am trying to figure out is what is causing the problem. I have heard things such as the film not being flat against the rear plate, the rangefinder being incorrectly calibrated, or the lens being incorrectly calibrated. I have a few images so you can see what it looks like. I really don't see that great Leica sharpness in many of the photos. Landscapes especially are not sharp. Could it be the film I was using? Or is this a problem with the Camera/lens? http://imgur.com/UnP81GA Edited January 8, 2015 by bgaugs Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 8, 2015 Posted January 8, 2015 Hi bgaugs, Take a look here Leica M3 Focus Issues. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
250swb Posted January 8, 2015 Share #2 Posted January 8, 2015 If you'll forgive me for working through the options of normalising contrast and sharpening the image, it looks to me like you have camera movement, as everything is equally soft. Try it with a tripod and the lens at a good aperture like f/8 and see if the image improves, but if scanned it will still need sharpening and some post processing. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/239572-leica-m3-focus-issues/?do=findComment&comment=2743615'>More sharing options...
bgaugs Posted January 8, 2015 Author Share #3 Posted January 8, 2015 Hmm that looks a little better. I do not however think it was movement, as I shot this with a fairly fast shutter. Could it be the scanning that had flaws? I'll post a few more pics so you can see some more examples. imgur: the simple image sharer imgur: the simple image sharer (I focused on the furthest branch) imgur: the simple image sharer imgur: the simple image sharer imgur: the simple image sharer (probably the most in focus shot I have) Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandokan Posted January 8, 2015 Share #4 Posted January 8, 2015 If the image comes into focus before lens comes to infinity, then you have a rangefinder calibration error. At least that is what I had with my M and the technician diagnosed it from this behaviour. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeswe Posted January 8, 2015 Share #5 Posted January 8, 2015 It would be helpful to get a bit more information to put these picture in context. What shutter speeds/aperture did you use? Are the pictures full frame size or crops? I would not rule out crappy scanning, so who did the scans using what hardware? When you say rangefinder indicates infinity before the lens hits infinity, what distances are we talking about? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenshacker Posted January 8, 2015 Share #6 Posted January 8, 2015 Is this the only lens that you have tried on the M3? Try your others, pick an object at distance. The RF and lens should agree at infinity. If they are all disagreeing, the RF is out of calibration. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madNbad Posted January 8, 2015 Share #7 Posted January 8, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) Have you looked at the negatives using a loupe? Just trying to narrow down whether it's the camera or the scanner. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgaugs Posted January 9, 2015 Author Share #8 Posted January 9, 2015 I used the sunny 16 rule for most of these, some were at f/8. Is there a way I can analyse the negatives using household items? I have a normal hp scanner and a Canon 60D if that would help at all in the process. Thanks for all your help guys. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madNbad Posted January 9, 2015 Share #9 Posted January 9, 2015 A magnifying glass and a low wattage lamp will work. Examine the negative and see if the image is sharp. If the negative is in focus then you'll know the camera is ok. If the negative is fuzzy the problem is with the camera or the lens. Hope this helps. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgaugs Posted January 9, 2015 Author Share #10 Posted January 9, 2015 Its hard to see exactly how sharp it is from such a small negative frame, but it looks fine from what I can see. I looked at this image through a magnifying glass and it looked fine as far as I could discern: imgur: the simple image sharer But its hard to tell how in focus it actually is when blown up it looks soft. The company which developed it is pretty reputable and is a professional shop, but it was during the holidays when they had tons of orders, so I'm thinking there may have been some mistakes? I am going back to the shop soon so should I bring this negative to see if they could scan it again? Some of the scans also had these weird small string-like pieces on the image if that means anything. I also just did a quick test with my summicron 50 f/2 (there are severe scratches on the front element, which is why I'm not using it to test for sharpness). I focused on an object, and recorded the distance the 50mm said, which was almost exactly 4m. Then I did the same with the 135, and it gave me about 3.5m. Is this a reliable way to tell if it isn't calibrated? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted January 9, 2015 Share #11 Posted January 9, 2015 As we now know the scan was made with a 'normal hp scanner' I think that will be the problem. I'd assumed it was a decent lab scan. HP don't make a good scanner and any 35mm negative needs to be scanned with a dedicated film scanner, flatbeds and cheaper options will not produce sharp images. But lets assume there is a rangefinder problem, just theoretically. The image has a wide range of depth from medium distance to far distance, so unless the lens was focused for the very near distance (of which there is nothing in the shot) then at f/8 something should be sharp even if the focus is out. It would need to be a gigantic mis-calibration not to get something sharp. There are beginners mistakes that I guess we can rule out, like focusing on the wrong part of a repeating pattern, so instead of window blinds or a picket fence you have the rock strata to confuse focus, but even so the OP knows where the lens barrel markings were set so that would be ruled out. But it should be emphasised that infinity is not a few hundred yards away, it is the horizon, and there is no horizon in the picture, there is no infinity in the picture, so the images of the rangefinder patch converging before the lens hits its end stop could well be expected. The simplest test is to make sure the camera doesn't move before conducting a witch hunt to prove the rangefinder (or lens) is out of adjustment. Steve Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgaugs Posted January 9, 2015 Author Share #12 Posted January 9, 2015 I was hoping it was the scans that were poor, but they were done professionally with a high quality dedicated scanner at a place that has been in business for more than a decade. I was only stating that I had an he scanner at my disposal. I do have pictures as well of horizons, and they are not sharp either. What do you mean by "make sure the camera doesn't move"? I think I'll go and get some cheap film, get them developed at can, and test for focus accuracy at varying f stops. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted January 9, 2015 Share #13 Posted January 9, 2015 Use a tripod and eliminate the possibility it is camera shake, with that out of the way and if the images are still soft you can eliminate the scanning by going somewhere else to have them scanned, with that out of the way and if the images are still soft you can look at the expensive solution of having your lens or camera serviced. Steve 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pop Posted January 9, 2015 Share #14 Posted January 9, 2015 Hello,I recently had my M3 and 135 f/4 CLA'd by a factory trained specialist. I took it out shooting on a trip to Arizona and a lot of pictures have incorrect focus. I know my technique is correct, and I am focusing properly. I did notice sometimes that focusing on an object at infinity seemed like through the rangefinder it became in focus before the lens focus ring hit infinity. What I am trying to figure out is what is causing the problem. I have heard things such as the film not being flat against the rear plate, the rangefinder being incorrectly calibrated, or the lens being incorrectly calibrated. I have a few images so you can see what it looks like. I really don't see that great Leica sharpness in many of the photos. Landscapes especially are not sharp. Could it be the film I was using? Or is this a problem with the Camera/lens? imgur: the simple image sharer How did you set the focus for this particular shot? (a) the RF indicated something being in focus; which part of the image? ( retracted the lens until it went no further in © manually focussed by aligning the infinity symbol with the focus mark on the barrel? Oh, and don't rule out motion blur. 135 is quite a long lens for handheld shooting. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted January 10, 2015 Share #15 Posted January 10, 2015 (edited) I was hoping it was the scans that were poor, but they were done professionally with a high quality dedicated scanner at a place that has been in business for more than a decade. I was only stating that I had an he scanner at my disposal. I do have pictures as well of horizons, and they are not sharp either. The scans are grainy as heck which would lead me to believe they are overexposed - it was brighter than your estimate indicated. Maybe your shutter speeds are terribly slow which would account for unsharpness as well as grain and tonality (which was probably overcompensated in scanning.) In your next group, if you could write down the shutter speed and f-stop it would help us. I ran an image through the usual first couple of pre-processing steps. See it here. . Edited January 10, 2015 by pico Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgaugs Posted January 10, 2015 Author Share #16 Posted January 10, 2015 (edited) Hmm ok. What exactly was that processing composed of? Ill run down to CVS and see if they can scan a few of the negatives of the pics I posted. Ill grab some film there and do a test shoot on a tripod, write down the settings for each shot, and then update soon with the results. Thanks so much for your help everyone! Edited January 10, 2015 by bgaugs Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madNbad Posted January 10, 2015 Share #17 Posted January 10, 2015 Attach the camera to a tripod, set up some objects on a table and place a whiteboard or card you can write on with them. Use a tape measure and mark the distance. f stop and shutter speed on the card. Do this for various settings and distance until you have used up the roll of film. Have it processed and have it scanned at a high resolution. This will give you a good idea of if the problem is the camera and lens combination or the processing. A few test early on save a lot of problems later. Try to have fun with it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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