Leica M adapter T and built-in flash function?

[dkCambridgeshire]

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The Leica M-Adapter T allegedly 'fully supports' Leica T camera functions but when I tried a T camera today the menu's flash mode was not accessible when the M-Adaptor with M lens was fitted. And with the M-Adaptor fitted the built-in flash would not fire when the shutter button was pressed. The M lens was not 6 bit coded.

 

Is the camera designed so that the flash mode and built-in flash are only accessible / usable when a Leica T lens is attached?

 

dunk

[Daedalus2000]

You should be able to use the flash if you are in Aperture mode. I do not think it will work on Manual mode, or at least I have not found a way yet to do it.

 

Edit: Forget the above I was able to use it in Manual mode as well, I could not use it before because my speed was too high.

 

I have tried that with a coded and an uncoded lens.

Edited November 19, 2014 by Daedalus2000

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[dkCambridgeshire]

I've discovered the cause of the problem. Camera was set to a specific User Profile in which the Flash Mode was not accessible and the built-in flash was not functioning. Reverting to the Default Profile enabled use of the Flash Mode. The built-in flash now functions with M lenses - even at high ISO which compensates for the relatively low GN.

 

dunk

Edited November 19, 2014 by dkpeterborough
Typo

[dkCambridgeshire]

I've just acquired a secondhand Leica T body with an M Adapter T and charger … but no instruction manual/accessories/box … hence have been using it intuitively and took a while to discover it had previously been set to a custom profile hence the flash problem. An instruction manual has since been downloaded.

 

Given the T's very usable high ISO capability the built-in flash should be usable at up to ISO 6400 … with ISO 12500 possible but with grainy results. I tried a few JPEG test flash exposures at high ISO in almost total darkness using the T's B&W modes and results looked fine .. but need to try a few more shots to test the following theoretical exposure possibilities. In very low light, the image was focused through the Viso using max aperture and the M lens was then stopped down by counting the 'clicks' whilst turning the aperture ring.

 

Flash Guide Numbers and theoretical max. subject distances & f numbers should be as follows for a standard lens, but, the basic GN 4.5 published by Leica does not state the lens' focal length. If it refers to the 23mm lens (35mm FF equivalent) then actual GN for a 50mm FF equivalent lens will be higher.

 

ISO 100 GN 4.5: 2m f2

ISO 200 GN 6.3: 2m f2.8, 3m f2

ISO 400 GN 8.8: 2m f4, 3m f2.8

ISO 800 GN 12.3: 2m f6.3, 3m f4

ISO 1600 GN 17.3: 2m f8, 3m f5.6, 4m f4

ISO 3200 GN 24.2: 2m f11, 3m f8, 4m f5.6

ISO 6400 GN 34.0: 2m f16, 3m f11, 4m f8, 5m f6.3

 

The T should be able to achieve decent built-in flash images at up to 4 meters at ISO 1600 and ISO 3200 … select aperture priority and set the required lens aperture.

 

I'll post some high ISO built-in flash images when more tests have been completed.

 

Best wishes

 

dunk

Edited November 20, 2014 by dkpeterborough
typo

[firststream]

Dunk, glad you resolved your flash issue.

 

You might be interested to know that I've been getting higher sync speeds with a flash attached to the hotshoe. 1/250s images are clean, and at 1/320s there is just a whisper of curtain shadow at the edge. Unlike my experience with other cameras, the T doesn't cut-out hotshoe attached flash usage at inappropriately higher shutter speeds. It also works when the flash is attached to the camera via cable.

 

Sorry for the digression, but I hope this helps.

[dkCambridgeshire]

Thank you for sharing your flash info. I will be trying an external flash with the 'T' but for the following experiment will be using the camera in almost total darkness with the Viso and a Noctilux … and at high ISO but using the T's B&W film mode. The Noctilux is more for focusing than for its image footprint - at max. aperture I can see detail through the Viso not visible with the naked eye. After focusing, the lens can be stopped down to obtain necessary DOF … and at high ISO the built in flash can cope even when several layers of red cellophane cover the flash lens. I need to use red filtered flash to avoid compromising astronomers' night vision when taking pix of observers in action at star parties. Hence the experiments at high ISO.

 

The clock photo was taken in almost total darkness at ISO 12500 with the Noctilux set to f16 and with the T's built-in flash covered in three layers of red cellophane ... just to prove the idea works. In practice, photos will be taken at longer camera to subject distance and at lower ISO and at wider aperture … which will render a much less grainy image.

 

The Viso could not be used if a flashgun was attached to the T's accessory shoe - and I'm not sure how the T's low light monitor image compares to the Viso image for focusing as have not tried . It's easier to focus with the Viso pressed against my spectacles rather than using the monitor at 15 inches in front of my face.

 

If the built-in flash can cope well at e.g. f5.6 and ISO 3200 some reasonable 'observers in action' pics should be obtainable. Observers have small red lanterns attached to their 'scope tripods which cast sufficient light onto their white/silver tripod mounts to enable focusing at wide lens aperture.

 

But it's early days in the experiment and going live is weather dependent. The T is set to max. quality JPEG for the experiment/project.

 

 

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Leica T, built- flash, Noctilux 50/1 at f16, ISO 12500 with three layers of red cellophane covering the T's built-in flash

 

 

A similar experiment using the X Vario worked well using the XV's AF - but focusing was a bit hit and miss - especially with its slow lens.

 

http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/technology-industry/334950-leica-xv-tool-camera.html

 

With the Noctilux, manual focus should increase the success rate ... and the T's imaging at high ISO is probably better than that of the XV.

 

 

Best wishes

 

dunk

Edited November 22, 2014 by dkpeterborough

[AndreasAM]

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In my first experience ( see my comment in the thread SF26 Flash) I used the flash as a slave off camera, in hand or an a tripod for example, triggering its sensor using the internal flash even in a low setting and still use the EVF.

You can change the power of the flash by holding the button SLAVE, cycling through settings full, half (minus 1 stop) and quarter (-2 stops), when not using TTL or off camera as a slave

[dkCambridgeshire]

In my first experience ( see my comment in the thread SF26 Flash) I used the flash as a slave off camera, in hand or an a tripod for example, triggering its sensor using the internal flash even in a low setting and still use the EVF.

You can change the power of the flash by holding the button SLAVE, cycling through settings full, half (minus 1 stop) and quarter (-2 stops), when not using TTL or off camera as a slave

 

Thanks ... have yet to try using a flash with a slave function. Would still need to use red filtered flash to avoid compromising observers' night vision; will have to experiment to see if slave triggers are activated by red filtered flash. The only Leica compatible flash I have is the SF 240 which TTBOMK does not include a slave function.

 

dunk

[thighslapper]

Have you stolen my clock ?????

 

I thought it was in the loft .......

 

I have an identical example ...... and have never seen another till your picture

 

It has been 'retired' ...... along with a few dozen others as the house was getting very 'clock heavy' and there were disgruntled mutterings from the decor manager.....

[dkCambridgeshire]

Have you stolen my clock ?????

 

I thought it was in the loft .......

 

I have an identical example ...... and have never seen another till your picture

 

It has been 'retired' ...... along with a few dozen others as the house was getting very 'clock heavy' and there were disgruntled mutterings from the decor manager.....

 

Fairly common mass produced 19th C Black Forest movement weight driven clock … when I bought mine from a clockmaker in Barnet Village N. London three years ago the shop had two for sale. The bezel hinge has broken on mine and needs solder repair - hence no reflections from the glass fronted bezel which is not attached. I guess Leica enthusiasts also enjoy charismatic clocks. I'm in the process of servicing a Seiko clock for a Leica owner friend … I'm not an expert clock repairer but some are easy just to clean and lubricate if the movement is accessible and not worn out.

 

dunk

[firststream]

It's very encouraging to see how many ways the T is being used to break new ground. Setting focus with a Noctilux wide open along with high ISO in almost total darkness, is darn near revolutionary. Good luck with your experiment.

 

The star party near Mount hope, Ontario always gives out red plastic for the guests' car headlights (should they need to leave at night). I think it would be a little thicker, and more opaque than red cellophane. On the other hand, it might be more suitable for your flash.

[dkCambridgeshire]

It's very encouraging to see how many ways the T is being used to break new ground. Setting focus with a Noctilux wide open along with high ISO in almost total darkness, is darn near revolutionary. Good luck with your experiment.

 

The star party near Mount hope, Ontario always gives out red plastic for the guests' car headlights (should they need to leave at night). I think it would be a little thicker, and more opaque than red cellophane. On the other hand, it might be more suitable for your flash.

 

Thank you for the suggestion but red plastic is too opaque … cellophane is applied in layers to the flash until observers say 'OK no night vision interference' … and they are comfortable with three layers .. and it's easy to apply to the built-in flash or an external flash.

 

Have now improved method to enable more accurate focusing in total darkness with a slower lens e.g. 35mm f2 Summicron wide open - but there's a bit more to it than just that; more details will be advised ref methodology employed in due course. Unfortunately the weather is too poor currently to venture out stargazing. The astro club had a star party planned last Saturday but ended up just eating the lamb chilli & rice supper . And this coming Friday, our regular observing night weather permitting, it's likely to be too cloudy.

 

The 50/1 Noctilux will be tried again but with 1.5 crop factor on the 'T' it's 75mm which is a too narrow FOV go capture a group of astronomers observing. The 35mm = 52.5mm FF equivalent which is fine. Ideally a 24/1.4 would be 36mm FF equivalent enabling closer lens to subject distance, easy manual focus and decent light gathering … but the ££cost would be prohibitive .. unless using e.g. a Samyang lens.

 

But other people use e.g. Voigtlander lenses on their M cameras so why not use a Samyang on a 'T' ?

 

Horses for courses.

 

dunk